Ante's Bubbly Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Two minutes on the internet can find you pretty much all there is to know so far about our plight with the EFL. Despite our accounts appearing to most of us as uninformative and misleading, the real experts on these forums told us that we were going to be in real trouble, have an embargo on transfers and so on, way before DC decided it was time to come clean and let us know how badly he had misspent all of our money and a good pile of his. Before he did that that we had already suffered the predicted embargo in the summer of 2019. Then just over a year ago DC told us... “If we break [Financial Fair Play rules] a little, no problem. But we broke a lot: eight figures high – this is the truth. If we don’t go up soon, we will break it anyway. If we didn’t spend, I believe we would have been relegated.” – Dejphon Chansiri, Sheffield Wednesday owner, December 2018 He then went on to buy the ground and re-arrange the club all allegedly under the jurisdiction of the EFL. The Club maintains that it consulted with the relevant executive officers of the EFL in connection with the stadium transaction and that it acted in good faith. The Club has in its possession numerous emails, letters and other documents in which the EFL gave authorisation to the transaction, and on which authorisation the Club understood it could rely. That authorisation gave rise in law to a legitimate expectation that the transaction would be accepted by the EFL, which is binding on the EFL. The EFL is acting in breach of that binding legitimate expectation by retrospectively treating as misconduct that which it had itself previously authorised, and this makes the charges themselves unlawful. The Club is accordingly bringing its own claim against the EFL to establish that it is acting unlawfully, as well as standing ready, if necessary, to vigorously defend the charges. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattitheowl Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 19 hours ago, Beauchief Owl said: Interesting situation, DC would probably sue them for loss of revenue which would be well over 100 million. If this is the case why didn't EFL block QPR from play-offs and eventual promotion a few years back? The rules have changed since QPR (mainly because of them). And it would be hard going suing someone for enforcing rules that you signed up to and then broke! Just not bothered... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattitheowl Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 10 hours ago, Belfast Owl 2 said: Nope but there is no potential 21 point deduction headline in that People also forget the fairytale club Bournemouth broke the rules as did Wolves. Wolves didn't. They would have done had they not got promoted but their losses spanned 2 years before they got promoted so no bother. Just not bothered... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherlyegg Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 3 hours ago, Ante's Bubbly said: The Club maintains that it consulted with the relevant executive officers of the EFL in connection with the stadium transaction and that it acted in good faith. I think that's why Meire was here...to sort the ground sale, dot all the i' and cross all the t's. Hope she was good at her job... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ante's Bubbly Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 19 hours ago, sherlyegg said: I think that's why Meire was here...to sort the ground sale, dot all the i' and cross all the t's. Hope she was good at her job... Me too! I bet DC is cool about it though. Typical isn't it that we went so long servicing huge amounts of debt built up by dropping out of the Premier League without the massive parachute payments that clubs had for four seasons not so long ago, but get for up to three years now (or just two if you have only been in the prem for one season). Since then we have had to compete with those clubs and their mega millions, along with the clubs still getting paid for coming down two years ago, or three years ago. They get between £34.9M and £42.6M, which is the kind of money over just two years that would level our books, without having to sell our ground and give us a bigger player budget to compete with the other big boys, but although we finally have a chairman that is prepared to spend big to compete with the other big spenders, we are now held back, not by a lack of money, but by the EFL telling us to compete fairly! DC could argue (unsuccessfully if the EFL's position with us now is a pointer), that he is trying to compete fairly this season with the 6 clubs who are being given a £34.9M to £42.6M unfair start every season. Hull's parachute money has run out now, but top team WBA got a £34.9M unfair advantage this season, 4th placed Fulham got a £42.6M unfair advantage, Swansea on the same points as us got a £34.9M unfair advantage, Cardiff & Stoke also got £34.9M extra to play with and Huddersfield got an extra £42.6M start on the other clubs that are not getting any mega millions from the premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldierboyblue Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 On 15/01/2020 at 16:03, Ante's Bubbly said: Two minutes on the internet can find you pretty much all there is to know so far about our plight with the EFL. Despite our accounts appearing to most of us as uninformative and misleading, the real experts on these forums told us that we were going to be in real trouble, have an embargo on transfers and so on, way before DC decided it was time to come clean and let us know how badly he had misspent all of our money and a good pile of his. Before he did that that we had already suffered the predicted embargo in the summer of 2019. Then just over a year ago DC told us... “If we break [Financial Fair Play rules] a little, no problem. But we broke a lot: eight figures high – this is the truth. If we don’t go up soon, we will break it anyway. If we didn’t spend, I believe we would have been relegated.” – Dejphon Chansiri, Sheffield Wednesday owner, December 2018 He then went on to buy the ground and re-arrange the club all allegedly under the jurisdiction of the EFL. The Club maintains that it consulted with the relevant executive officers of the EFL in connection with the stadium transaction and that it acted in good faith. The Club has in its possession numerous emails, letters and other documents in which the EFL gave authorisation to the transaction, and on which authorisation the Club understood it could rely. That authorisation gave rise in law to a legitimate expectation that the transaction would be accepted by the EFL, which is binding on the EFL. The EFL is acting in breach of that binding legitimate expectation by retrospectively treating as misconduct that which it had itself previously authorised, and this makes the charges themselves unlawful. The Club is accordingly bringing its own claim against the EFL to establish that it is acting unlawfully, as well as standing ready, if necessary, to vigorously defend the charges. Misspent all of our money?! It’s his money not our money we didn’t have any money before he put his hand in his pocket and spent his own money 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tudders Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 (edited) This FFP is a load of rubbish. I understand clubs not being able to spend beyond their means and risk bankruptcy etc but when the cash is there it should be allowed to be spent. So irritating that for years we had no cash,now we’ve got it, we can’t spend it!! When Blackburn won the Premier League in the 90s, they had gates averaging 17k supporters a week and Jack Walker bank rolling them. They’d have had no chance in the current climate. If an owner wants to spend their own cash they should just be allowed to do it. Football has never been ‘fair’ and never will be. It’s the nature of the beast. Edited January 16, 2020 by Tudders 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOHNHARKES Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, Tudders said: This FFP is a load of rubbish. I understand clubs not being able to spend beyond their means and risk bankruptcy etc but when the cash is there it should be allowed to be spent. So irritating that for years we had no cash,now we’ve got it, we can’t spend it!! When Blackburn won the Premier League in the 90s, they had gates averaging 17k supporters a week and Jack Walker bank rolling them. They’d have had no chance in the current climate. If an owner wants to spend their own cash they should just be allowed to do it. Football has never been ‘fair’ and never will be. It’s the nature of the beast. Nail on head . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hookowl Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 17 minutes ago, JOHNHARKES said: Nail on head . Could be painful 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarrowbyOwl Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 (edited) The club statement on 27 December said the process of appointing arbitrators was underway. The EFL rules say that must be done within 14 days. There's no indication of how long arbitration proceedings are likely to last. An article I came across on FA Rule K4 arbitration cases says that the Standard Directions under FA Rule K4 envisage that the hearing (the final bit of the arbitration proceedings) should take place within 119 days (17 weeks) following the appointment of a Tribunal chairman. So even if the arbitration ruling goes against us it looks likely to be a while before the EFL will be able to even start the disciplinary proceedings on the misconduct charges. It could drags on well into the summer, after the the play-offs and even maybe after the start of the 2020-21 season. Edited January 16, 2020 by HarrowbyOwl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlZfan84 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Derby join the points deduction party... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essix Blue Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 So. Derby sold their ground also. Does this mean the EFL have charged them despite that? If their ground sale was deemed legal and above board surely they wouldn’t have broken P&S rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalthamOwl Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 (edited) Wonder if Derby will take the EFL on like we are doing. Hope so. 2 big clubs doing so are better than 1. Edited January 16, 2020 by WalthamOwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trev Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 9 minutes ago, Essix Blue said: So. Derby sold their ground also. Does this mean the EFL have charged them despite that? If their ground sale was deemed legal and above board surely they wouldn’t have broken P&S rules? Good point indeed. Maybe we can split solicitor costs to reduce fees?? Lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlZfan84 Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 minute ago, WalthamOwl said: Wonder if Derby will take the EFL on like we are doing. Hope so. 2 big clubs doing so are better than 1. Wouldn't surprise me. Mel Morris ain't no push over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ante's Bubbly Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 hour ago, soldierboyblue said: Misspent all of our money?! It’s his money not our money we didn’t have any money before he put his hand in his pocket and spent his own money Are you joking? So you dont count all the multi-season ticket deals, the over inflated match day tickets, 1867 club etc to be our money? DC did. He asked us to help him and we did. The overspending charges are levelled at the club, not DC personally. Surely we all wish they were? If DC got fined, his money (and our money) that has been invested in the club, would be a lot safer without a big point deduction and a club fine. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 minute ago, owlZfan84 said: Wouldn't surprise me. Mel Morris ain't no push over. Morris will be just as belligerent as Chansiri perhaps even more so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ante's Bubbly Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Tudders said: This FFP is a load of rubbish. I understand clubs not being able to spend beyond their means and risk bankruptcy etc but when the cash is there it should be allowed to be spent. So irritating that for years we had no cash,now we’ve got it, we can’t spend it!! When Blackburn won the Premier League in the 90s, they had gates averaging 17k supporters a week and Jack Walker bank rolling them. They’d have had no chance in the current climate. If an owner wants to spend their own cash they should just be allowed to do it. Football has never been ‘fair’ and never will be. It’s the nature of the beast. Exactly my point earlier. Even clubs like Bournemouth and Huddersfield have had steady investment in them while we didnt have a pot to p in for 15 years! Now we have an owner with money and fans spending more on tickets etc, but we cant spend enough to get us up, especially doing it the hard way with so much bad advice for DC from the likes of Doyen etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S36 OWL Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 28 minutes ago, owlZfan84 said: Derby join the points deduction party... Yet they STILL sanctioned the Rooney deal. Unbelievable Jeff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalthamOwl Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 That tw@t Gibson at Boro will be loving this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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