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A managers job is to manage the players. They have different needs. Imagine if Spurs binned Ledley King? I bet most squads have players that must train differently for longevity reasons. I guess the difference is most clubs don't have a potato as a manager. Monk leaves before Hutch and quite frankly he's far easier to replace. 

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With Hutchinson it seemed to work when his training was managed differently by Gray and possibly Carlos. Luhukay seemed a bit more inflexible.

 

Hes one of those that is good enough to get away with it and it’s the only reason he wasn’t playing higher.

 

I can see the need to move players on but other than financial theres nothing at face value that suggests he couldn’t do a job here til he retires. He’s obviously vocal and has an opinion but that’s what a good dressing room is? He’s still one of our best players now but we just can’t rely on him and we have done so for too long in that role.

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7 hours ago, rickygoo said:

When did he fall out with Bruce or Bullen? 

Talking about GM and JL. Bullen and Bruce-well lets face it, neither of them were in post long enough to be considered anything other than a passing phase. Not sure Hutchinson actually gets on that well with Bullen, if what I was told by someone who is in daily contact with him is right.

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10 minutes ago, airborne_rat_of_s6 said:

Talking about GM and JL. Bullen and Bruce-well lets face it, neither of them were in post long enough to be considered anything other than a passing phase. Not sure Hutchinson actually gets on that well with Bullen, if what I was told by someone who is in daily contact with him is right.

 

What were you told?

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It’s about being a man manager and knowing your players. Bruce was perfect for us.

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20 hours ago, S36 OWL said:

Surely training every day is what is required for first team players. If you can only train a couple of times a week then you arnt in condition to play in the team. 

Fans of Paul mcgrath might argue

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Badly managed by poor managers. Monk as bad as any... 

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Can understand both sides, but football is a team sport and an individual has to work in a team. 

 

By his own admission, Hutchinsom has been outspoken and can understand how that has rubbed some people up the wrong way. I can also understand a few players being miffed if he doesn't train every day like they have to and him being picked over them. 

 

That said, for a couple of seasons, he was an important player for us.

 

Had to go through a lot in his career and fully respect the mental struggles he's had and how he's overcome them. 

 

I'll miss playing Hutchinson yellow card bingo, but the time is right to move on. 

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18 hours ago, WalthamOwl said:

Personally I’m a big fan of Hutchinson. The type of player I like to see in the team, for me we look a better side when he’s playing. Very sad how things have turned out. SH and people like Westwood seem big personalities, some managers don’t like that and can’t handle that, they prefer weak minded players that don’t speak their mind. 

Or have you just made that up ?

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, the monk said:

Or have you just made that up ?


it’s called having an opinion. You know the stuff forums like this are created for. My opinion is people like Jos and Monk can’t handle big personalities, Bruce and Carlos where better at it. Imo we need big personalities in the team. 

Edited by WalthamOwl

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21 minutes ago, WalthamOwl said:


it’s called having an opinion. You know the stuff forums like this are created for. My opinion is people like Jos and Monk can’t handle big personalities, Bruce and Carlos where better at it. Imo we need big personalities in the team. 

 

There's having an opinion and then theres making something up.

 

How do you know what personalities they have? 

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Just now, Grez Bez said:

 

There's having an opinion and then theres making something up.

 

How do you know what personalities they have? 


do you think they come across as quiet individuals that go along with everything someone says no matter if right or wrong. Or do you think they are players that speak their minds and come across as 2 of the more vocal personalities in the squad? 

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My view on the situation.

 

Sam was and has been a superb player for us. His story is inspiring and he has been taken in well since he arrived in 2014 by the fans. Whatever issues/contradictions he has had with head coaches are very natural in football clubs. Fans won't know 99% of the arguments that go on at clubs on all levels. Fans think footballers die for the cause and bleed blue and white when in reality they are humans, in the middle of a short career and also their true rivals are usually the players they train against that are trying to steal their place in the team. Anyone that doesn't identify how strong these factors influence players minds are idle to the reality of modern football.

 

Sam has done well for us but as football is a tough industry with really hard decisions to make it isn't a problem to me that we have to see the back of certain players in order to progress. For years now we have stagnated. Fans will always hold onto the good times. But we NEED to find a new identity as a club and team. We are losing it. 

 

On a personal level I think letting Sam and other players know early enough that they aren't wanted will hurt them but give them the best chance to secure the next step of their career. This has been problematic considering covid 19. Hard and horrible decisions have to be made. Its worried me immensely that these sorts of planning scenarios haven't taken place for years. We have hidden behind the veiled success of 2 play off years. Its been alarming how we've not built on it. All of that is through inexperience behind the scenes. I've gone off on a tangent a bit but ultimately its time for a new era at SWFC and some players won't like it but they aren't and shouldn't be part of it. 

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28 minutes ago, WalthamOwl said:


it’s called having an opinion. You know the stuff forums like this are created for. My opinion is people like Jos and Monk can’t handle big personalities, Bruce and Carlos where better at it. Imo we need big personalities in the team. 

Reading what hutch said it seems bruce didn't know how to handle him .....

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46 minutes ago, torryowl said:

Reading what hutch said it seems bruce didn't know how to handle him .....

 

I was quite surprised that Sam didn’t mention Bruce in the list of managers who knew how to man manage him. In all honesty I’m not sure whether that says more about Sam or Bruce, but I have a friend  who got to know SB very well professionally during his time at Hull City and he said he was a lovely bloke. 

 

I have to confess I still feel pretty gutted that Bruce was prised away from us in much the same way that Villa lured Big Ron all those years ago.  I also feel Bruce may have been Chansiri’s last realistic chance to succeed with our club.  I wouldn’t be surprised if Bruce’s departure took a lot out of DC.

 

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1 hour ago, WalthamOwl said:


it’s called having an opinion. You know the stuff forums like this are created for. My opinion is people like Jos and Monk can’t handle big personalities, Bruce and Carlos where better at it. Imo we need big personalities in the team. 

Just a question,  cant I ask a question on a forum ?

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1 hour ago, TheEnchanter said:

Sam has done well for us but as football is a tough industry with really hard decisions to make it isn't a problem to me that we have to see the back of certain players in order to progress. For years now we have stagnated. Fans will always hold onto the good times. But we NEED to find a new identity as a club and team. We are losing it. 

 

And the usual answer is to let players go at the end of a season. Not dump them from a floundering squad that needs all the grit and determination it can get in mid-season. 

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16 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

We will never know what went on behind the scenes fully so would be unable to give a proper opinion on it


That's the tricky thing with non-football decisions or disciplinary decisions


 

This is the thing... looking at it from a fans viewpoint, something has definitely happened but we will probably never know what. This is the second time that Hutchinson and Westwood have been taken out of the squad, and not for football reasons. 
 

It seems no coincidence that the last time it happened under Luhukay, our form dropped rapidly. Players who had been in the first team regularly and performed for a number of years suddenly couldn’t string a pass together. Players looked lost and like they didn’t want to be there. 
 

It seems the same this season. Something has happened and now the club is falling down the league while some players look like they don’t want to be there. 
 

From that viewpoint you would have to believe what the club are saying and back their decision. But that didn’t stop me singing Hutchinsons name from the stands a few times this season when the opposition are walking through our midfield like a hot knife cuts through butter completely unchallenged, when you know that a player like Sam would be showing the grit and determination youd

expect. Someone who seems proud of wearing the shirt and would run through brick walls to play for the club. 
 

I don’t care what’s happened behind the scenes.... that should be kept behind the scenes. Just like Winnalls training ground bust up with FF. Ex players would have you believe that this sort of thing happens quite often in training but rarely gets publicised. There was a reason that it got reported in the media, because someone wanted us to know that it wasn’t exactly an happy camp. All I care about are the results, so I’d rather see Sammy wearing the shirt if it’s going to keep us in this division.


 

So it’s a tough one. And if other players are downing tools because of it, then its

about time they went too. Because they aren’t doing it for the good of the fans who are paying top dollar to see us getting humiliated every week. You don’t just go from 3rd to dropping like a stone and conceding for fun. Maybe half of them already know that they won’t be here next season.... and the rest know their mates won’t be here next season.
 

I want the season over, clear out the camp.... because it clearly looks troubled. 

Start over with players who want to be here. 

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Glad his version has come out. 

 

I'm with him on this. One size fits all training regimes shouldn't be applied to everyone. 

 

He is a unique case and knows his own body.

 

Sounds like Monk has been a bully and disregarded his individual needs.

 

This wrecked our season because Hutch is a key player. 

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8 minutes ago, Miffed said:


 

This is the thing... looking at it from a fans viewpoint, something has definitely happened but we will probably never know what. This is the second time that Hutchinson and Westwood have been taken out of the squad, and not for football reasons. 
 

It seems no coincidence that the last time it happened under Luhukay, our form dropped rapidly. Players who had been in the first team regularly and performed for a number of years suddenly couldn’t string a pass together. Players looked lost and like they didn’t want to be there. 
 

It seems the same this season. Something has happened and now the club is falling down the league while some players look like they don’t want to be there. 
 

From that viewpoint you would have to believe what the club are saying and back their decision.
 

 

 

If there's a link between banishing two players and a subsequent slump in morale and results I'd say that was evidence that the club - or rather the manager - might have made the wrong decision. 

 

I don't agree that falling out with two managers - although according to Monk they haven't fallen out have they? - necessarily makes them bad eggs. It's circumstantial evidence. Anyway, I just wanted the best team on the pitch and in my opinion that wasn't happening under Jos and Monk. They aren't managers whose judgement I trust fully - they look like peas from the same pod to me - negative, bit dour etc. All gleaned from pressers and interviews of course - apparently Kenny Dalglish is delightful when he's not on the telly! 

 

Obviously Hutchinson isn't coming back so that's all water under the bridge - and Christ knows what will happen with Westwood - it looks like there's no way back for him. It's a right mess and Monk's general demeanour and response to our collapse doesn't convince me he's the man to lead us out of it. 

 

But Chansiri has much more information on all this so he has to go with what he thinks is right. When to get rid is a tricky decision and probably the most important he has to make. I don't envy him. 

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