Fan on fan

[Buxtongent]

When will this 'love-in' with Megson end?  Anyone would think he had bits of Shankley, Busby, Ferguson, and many more welded into his being. The majority of his time in management came in League 1, a far cry from either the Championship or the Premier league. And don't forget that League 1, for all its airs and graces, is simply THIRD DIVISiON football. This is certainly no 'CC for ever ' plea, but a plea for sanity. If we are going to get rid of CC we must progress, not egress.

As someone who has watched the Owls for a very long time, one thing is certain. To the fan , the past is always better.. We are a very demanding, and loyal, but extremely fickle set of fans, who love to live in the past. And yes, I am one who tends to reminisce and romanticise the past, but don't forget, in his time here Carlos has achieved a Sixth and a Fourth place in what is a very competitive league. Yes, there are Managers who have achieved promotion to the premiership, but also many who have been unable to sustain this.

[prowl]

Megson is/was a good manager but we had some bad results with him in charge. It's unfair to say he was a 3rd division manager, he managed at a higher level and probably wouldn't have dropped to the 3rd for anyone else but us.

 

I think the reason fans want him back is because he was a player for us, so was his dad, there's a relationship between his family and our Wednesday family. There's also the way he was sacked after just beating the pigs, if he'd lost we would have lf expected it, but he won.

 

I don't think he's the man we need at this moment in time, part of me wishes he was but that time has gone, we need to move forward.

[Bing Cosby]

1 hour ago, Lord Snooty said:

It's not been bad on here. We seem to have slightly more control than the folks on the twattersphere and Facebook,  or the emotional drunk In the stand who boils over after paying big money to see his team escape what would have been a tousing at lowly Bolton.

 

Good of you for highlighting pretty much the only people Owlstalk can ever take the moral high ground over.

 

Good post Snoots and I agree with pretty much all of it.

 

It seems that these days most people want to take an extreme view, either one way or the other "he's got to go, he's a clown" fights "he's the best manager since Big Ron"... It can seemingly only end in conflict.

 

For me, things don't change much however we are doing. If we are playing great then I'll offer praise, if it's bad I'll offer criticism, I've never got myself entrenched by shouting for a man to be sacked or by declaring him to be our saviour. Seems like hard work either way.

 

But I am aware of that's how most people roll, therefore I always dreaded this scenario when Carlos agreed to stay for a 3rd season, there were too many people waiting to pounce.

 

It's never good when fans turn on fans, as you say, it often signals the beginning of the end.

 

 

 

[S36 OWL]

1 hour ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

No, Sadly, not two svelte young, supple women, with golden sun kissed skin glinting with perspiration as they gently trace their finger tips up and down each others silky bodies, the downy hairs prickling to attention as their backs arch with barely controlable desire and their lips swell as they tenderly kiss...

 

No not that. Im on about fans scuffling in the stand as tensions boil over. On social media as they start to describe each other as cretins,  f*cking morons and thick c*nts. 

Sad times. A divided fanbase. 

People talk about the apathy and I agree that is always one of the first bell tolls of trouble. But the second chime is always when fan turns on fan. 

When opposing  opinions usually filed in the box 'agree to differ' are now scrunched into a ball in a verbal fist, then the writing is on the wall. Crunch time is rarely far away.

 

It's not been bad on here. We seem to have slightly more control than the folks on the twattersphere and Facebook,  or the emotional drunk In the stand who boils over after paying big money to see his team escape what would have been a tousing at lowly Bolton.

 

The team must start winning again. Whatever it takes. Whoever is selected and whatever the system. Win ugly. But by God we must start winning. Or the scenes in the digital arena and the football arena stands will only get uglier. 

 

Personally I think that the course of things maybe run. But whilever we aren't cut adrift of the pack we must all back the team 100% while they are on the park, whatever our views on the manager. I know we'll take a tremendous following to Derby to urge us on. Let's make sure we give as good a backing at Hillsborough too against the Dingles. 

 

I'm as frustrated as the next man. But let's not go crackers and insult each other. We all ultimately want the same thing. 

 

UTO

 

 

Any pics mi lord ? 

Edited October 17, 2017 by S36 OWL

[Dagmeister]

44 minutes ago, torryowl said:

your right of course .....but would you accept a winning team playing in a cautious way ?

This IMO is a really good question. Most would answer a resounding yes but for me ultimately watching my team play in a way that entertains me is what it's fundamentally about. Short term expediency however is OK with two provisos for me:-

 

1) It is just that; short term.

2) It produces the desired goal i.e. promotion in our case

 

 

[Lord Snooty]

55 minutes ago, torryowl said:

no bigger megson fan than me but unite the fan base is not how I remember him 

 

45 minutes ago, Blatter said:

There's a sure way of uniting the fan base.

A winning team playing attacking football.

Thats all the vast majority want .

Don't really care who does it.

 

41 minutes ago, Big Ron's Sovereign said:

 

He never did that before  

 

I don't want this to turn into a Meggo thread as that wasn't my intention. 

And whilst the past always seems rosier equally we can't just pass it over either.  

 

The fanbase may have been splitting when he departed after a couple of heinous defeats, and all would accept -including Gary himself if he was being honest- that the tension was starting to show in the performances of some of the players. I think his absolute passion and determination to do it was creating a tense atmosphere. No doubt about it. 

Jones' biggest input ,IMO, was simply relaxing the players on the run in. Aided admittedly by Antonio,  Uniteds capitulation and Ched the Ripper.

 

By the end of his tenure the fans were dividing no doubt.

But I think it's far to easy to overlook what he did when he first came in and the foundations he put down for Dave Jones to steer over the line.

And one of those things early on was definitely to unite a dispirited and apathetic fan base.  

 

We can all it lip service to the fans when he talked us up. Talked about us being massive. When he took the players to the back of the KOP.

It might have been tricks and ego polishing. But it worked. Let's not kid ourselves about that. 

 

Because after years of Doom and gloom to hear someone come in and talk about our club positively re invigorates the soul of every crushed fan. Whether they are easy trotted platitudes or not.

When you've had Alan Irvine terrifying you before a game about playing against a striker who used to play for the Dog and Duck,  then someone coming in saying 'we should be top ten in the rip flight' puts and flutter in your heart. 

 

When you've seen Kim Olson.....when you've heard your manager say there are some terrific players at Hartlepool and Orient who'd he like but he's not sure they'd fancy a move to Hillsborough,  then to hear a man say he only wants players who'll die for the shirt does make you grin.

 

I know people who hadn't been in 5 years who went back simply because of what Megson was saying. Because he was bigging us up. Because he wanted us to have pride in our club, not be embarrassed about it.  He was proud of our club he wanted the players to be proud to wear the shirt. 

 

And lip service or not.....it worked. Certainly in the beginning.

I know young fans...fans born post Atkinson who had never seen good times. Never seen us make the national press. Never seen pundits talk about us. Never seen the weary old faces around then chanting and bellowing with pride. Megson did that.  It might have been wavering at the end. And the football might not have matched the passion. But he definitely brought the fans together when he arrived.  

That should never be forgotten. 

 

As for the attacking football.  

If by attacking we mean pretty. Then no.

If by attacking we mean having lots of shots and the ball being in their box more than ours,  then yes. And there's nothing wrong with that. 

 

The pressure of getting results. ...of United. ..From Milan...got to him. Probably highlighted by his use of JoC wide. Desperate to pinch results. 

It was a climatic tense period. 

 

I'm not saying he should come back.

 

But......

 

I'll never forget that for the first time in many a long year he turned up at this club when our fanbase were like a sick dog dying in its basket and told us we were top dogs , to stick out chests out with pride  and we did.

[Rance McGraw]

1 hour ago, torryowl said:

and half the feckers wanted him gone because we lost to chesterfield ......he's in the top 6 of managers ive seen down here but this board was in meltdown everytime we lost in the average run we had in the new year before he got the bullet .....he wouldn't be a popular choice for a lot of supporters not that that matters in him doing  a good job but unite the fans it wouldn't .

Didn't he also preside over pastings  by illustrious opposition in Exeter and Stevenage?

[Wednesday_Jack]

19 minutes ago, Mishowl said:

Just how many new fans do you think a couple of failed promotion attempts will have attracted? 

 

How do you know there is more of an understanding from time served fans?

 

I agree that fighting amongst ourselves won’t help anyone but what is there to suggest the ‘newer mob’ are responsible for that? (I doubt anyone who’s only been going since Wembley would even have enough points for away tickets anyway).

 

To suggest one particular section of the fan base is more impatient and less understanding of the situation than another does not help unite does it?

 

 

 

Ok you obviously want an argument!!! Find someone else to try it on with

[The only way is S6]

1 hour ago, torryowl said:

your right of course .....but would you accept a winning team playing in a cautious way ?

 

We did last season

[Dagmeister]

1 minute ago, The only way is S6 said:

 

We did last season

There were rumblings of discontent even before the play-off shambles to be fair.

[daveyboy66]

1 hour ago, Blue and white said:

WAWAW.

The city is ours.

You don't choose Wednesday, Wednesday choose you.

We are a top 10 premiership team.

All sayings that he gave to us and we revealed in it, the pride, the passion and dare I say arrogance,we lapped it up.

And fans were split from the dire prehistoric football from the off...no thanks

[Watto]

1 hour ago, torryowl said:

wow I don't think you grasp what being a supporter means .....it's easy when your winning it's when your not that the fans should be coming to the fore . .

Does it really help the team when the fans are behind them though , 2 examples are Preston and Bolton , two big followings and ultimately two garbage displays, we might aswell play without an away following imo for what it matters, Wembley was another example , one of the best atmosphere's you could wish to be in and the players didn't rise to it.

[WayneTheOwl]

2 hours ago, torryowl said:

wow I don't think you grasp what being a supporter means .....it's easy when your winning it's when your not that the fans should be coming to the fore . .

 

You clearly did not read my post did you. It stated "it's getting difficult, not that I wouldn't, don't or can't support them.

 

I want Carlos gone, simple as that. It is shocking the man is still here.

 

Not sure about yourself my friend, but holding a season ticket for 29 years continuously, away days in Germany etc and 75% of league grounds, I certainly know what being a supporter is all about, as do my 2 children and my 88 year old grandad who I have taken continuously as well. Next.................

[Mr. Tom]

2 hours ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

No, Sadly, not two svelte young, supple women, with golden sun kissed skin glinting with perspiration as they gently trace their finger tips up and down each others silky bodies, the downy hairs prickling to attention as their backs arch with barely controlable desire and their lips swell as they tenderly kiss...

 

You wrote the books my mum keeps under her bedside table, not the ones on top that she pretends to read, AICMFP

[owlmanc]

1 hour ago, Buxtongent said:

When will this 'love-in' with Megson end?  Anyone would think he had bits of Shankley, Busby, Ferguson, and many more welded into his being. The majority of his time in management came in League 1, a far cry from either the Championship or the Premier league. And don't forget that League 1, for all its airs and graces, is simply THIRD DIVISiON football. This is certainly no 'CC for ever ' plea, but a plea for sanity. If we are going to get rid of CC we must progress, not egress.

As someone who has watched the Owls for a very long time, one thing is certain. To the fan , the past is always better.. We are a very demanding, and loyal, but extremely fickle set of fans, who love to live in the past. And yes, I am one who tends to reminisce and romanticise the past, but don't forget, in his time here Carlos has achieved a Sixth and a Fourth place in what is a very competitive league. Yes, there are Managers who have achieved promotion to the premiership, but also many who have been unable to sustain this.

Majority of time in management? He took west brom up TWICE and was named manager of the season took Bolton off the bottom of the premier league and guided them to their best ever European finish beating athletico Madrid and drawing 2-2 with Bayern along the way... He hasn't spent that long in league one at all.

Edited October 17, 2017 by owlmanc

[Waddlesdiamondlights]

I'm going to get negged for this but here goes anyway.Who will hold their hand up to say they were wrong if Carlos and all his backroom staff go and their manager of choice gets appointed and we end up in free fall as we could end up with a squad or part squad of unsettled players .We are a third of the way through the season well within reach of the playoffs but also closer to the relegation places(heaven forbid)Some of the performances have been dire but last season was the same and we were not far off Wembley again.I feel we have to see this season out with CC if the attendance's fall DC could act but I think he will give it to the end of the season.I just think if cc goes now we will be left to rue our decision

[fatbloke no1]

So if ever we do get in premier and we go on long losing runs or get hammered by city or someone like them.will we be calling for managers head? Never have I known as many fickle fans as we have at minute.get behind lads at derby,at Bolton heard some saying hope they lose at derby ,so he goes!! 

[Winco owl 90]

3 minutes ago, Waddlesdiamondlights said:

I'm going to get negged for this but here goes anyway.Who will hold their hand up to say they were wrong if Carlos and all his backroom staff go and their manager of choice gets appointed and we end up in free fall as we could end up with a squad or part squad of unsettled players .We are a third of the way through the season well within reach of the playoffs but also closer to the relegation places(heaven forbid)Some of the performances have been dire but last season was the same and we were not far off Wembley again.I feel we have to see this season out with CC if the attendance's fall DC could act but I think he will give it to the end of the season.I just think if cc goes now we will be left to rue our decision

I might just beg you for just sitting there 

[trevdi9]

1 hour ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

 

I don't want this to turn into a Meggo thread as that wasn't my intention. 

And whilst the past always seems rosier equally we can't just pass it over either.  

 

The fanbase may have been splitting when he departed after a couple of heinous defeats, and all would accept -including Gary himself if he was being honest- that the tension was starting to show in the performances of some of the players. I think his absolute passion and determination to do it was creating a tense atmosphere. No doubt about it. 

Jones' biggest input ,IMO, was simply relaxing the players on the run in. Aided admittedly by Antonio,  Uniteds capitulation and Ched the Ripper.

 

By the end of his tenure the fans were dividing no doubt.

But I think it's far to easy to overlook what he did when he first came in and the foundations he put down for Dave Jones to steer over the line.

And one of those things early on was definitely to unite a dispirited and apathetic fan base.  

 

We can all it lip service to the fans when he talked us up. Talked about us being massive. When he took the players to the back of the KOP.

It might have been tricks and ego polishing. But it worked. Let's not kid ourselves about that. 

 

Because after years of Doom and gloom to hear someone come in and talk about our club positively re invigorates the soul of every crushed fan. Whether they are easy trotted platitudes or not.

When you've had Alan Irvine terrifying you before a game about playing against a striker who used to play for the Dog and Duck,  then someone coming in saying 'we should be top ten in the rip flight' puts and flutter in your heart. 

 

When you've seen Kim Olson.....when you've heard your manager say there are some terrific players at Hartlepool and Orient who'd he like but he's not sure they'd fancy a move to Hillsborough,  then to hear a man say he only wants players who'll die for the shirt does make you grin.

 

I know people who hadn't been in 5 years who went back simply because of what Megson was saying. Because he was bigging us up. Because he wanted us to have pride in our club, not be embarrassed about it.  He was proud of our club he wanted the players to be proud to wear the shirt. 

 

And lip service or not.....it worked. Certainly in the beginning.

I know young fans...fans born post Atkinson who had never seen good times. Never seen us make the national press. Never seen pundits talk about us. Never seen the weary old faces around then chanting and bellowing with pride. Megson did that.  It might have been wavering at the end. And the football might not have matched the passion. But he definitely brought the fans together when he arrived.  

That should never be forgotten. 

 

As for the attacking football.  

If by attacking we mean pretty. Then no.

If by attacking we mean having lots of shots and the ball being in their box more than ours,  then yes. And there's nothing wrong with that. 

 

The pressure of getting results. ...of United. ..From Milan...got to him. Probably highlighted by his use of JoC wide. Desperate to pinch results. 

It was a climatic tense period. 

 

I'm not saying he should come back.

 

But......

 

I'll never forget that for the first time in many a long year he turned up at this club when our fanbase were like a sick dog dying in its basket and told us we were top dogs , to stick out chests out with pride  and we did.

And that sums it up for me your'e Lordship ,he built the side with what he was allowed to bring in and that dictator'd the football to an extent , sadly he wasn't allowed to finish the jigsaw with who he wanted to complete the jigsaw, that was given to jones ,and the rest is good history but we will never ever know if given the players  megson wanted would he have taken us upward ,

[pgmetcalf]

Assuming they all support the same team of course, which is unlikely to be the case