Celtic agree personal terms with Liam Shaw

[SallyCinnamon]

1 minute ago, Minton said:

 

And as a young player, you don't sign a deal until you're into your last 6 months so that you can attract better offers. So that you and not your club, hold all the aces. 

That’s completely not true. I could list a number of young players who sign new deals a year to 18 months before they run out. It’s called having a good system - it’s something a DOF or CEO would look after.

 

Few recent examples for you - Alex Mighten, Jason Knight, Morgan Whittaker, Michael Olise, Max Bird - all young Championship talents who are highly thought of and are under contract at their current club. I hazard a guess all of them will go on to make their respective clubs decent money.

 

Keep on defending the way we handle contracts though. 

[edinburghowl]

27 minutes ago, room0035 said:

Really are you sure, I seem to remember some pretty big transfer fees over the last few years for young players Celtic either developed themselves or took from other academy.

 

They have made £8m yesterday on a player they signed for nothing from Man City, dembele from Fulham cost £500k sold for £20m, Tierney to Arsenal £25m for a 22 yr old.

 

No Celtic know exactly what they are doing and doing it very well

I’ve seen it for 30+ years in Scotland where they’ve hoovered up young talent with a small amount of game time experience and the players careers have stalled. There are countless examples.

Dembele had already played 50+ first team games at a high level when he signed for Celtic and isn’t comparable to Shaw. No way you’re having that.
 

Frimpong came from Man City’s academy and was a Dutch U21 international, again not really comparable to a 19 year old who has barely played for a second tier English team but for arguments sake I’ll give it to you.
 

Tierney I’ll give you, and I rate him very highly, better than Andy Robertson IMO, he’s a player they brought through their ranks from the beginning and brought on.

 

So that’s two in how many years? I maintain their record of bringing through players who have just started their careers is poor.

[StudentOwl]

16 minutes ago, kirksandallowl said:

So at what point should stop offering U23’s a new contract every year just in case they make the first team?

You're completely missing the point

 

Obviously what you don't do is continuously offer every half-decent youth players a new contract every single year and, you don't sign them up to a 6 year contract the second they show any promise. It doesn't work as:

Year 1: Youth player

Year 2: Youth player

Year 3: Youth player

Year 4: Championship player

 

It's a gradual change, and the contract these players are offered need to reflect that. Take your later example of Sean Clare:

Year 1: Youth player,  barely features in loan to L1 Bury

Year 2: Youth player, some appearances at L2 Accrington

Year 3: Youth player, many appearances at L1 Gillingham

____________END OF CONTRACT_____________

 

Now any competent club looks at Sean Clare's progression and near the end of Year 2 will offer a one or two year extension on wages that justify his cumulative experience up to that time period, which would equate to probably a decent League Two/low-end League One player's salary. No billybigbollocks salary to contend with, and it allows you to have a Year 4 throw in there

Year 4: Championship breakout season

And gives you time to assess whether the Championship is going to be about his level, or if it's a bit of a flash in the pan and his career rightly deserves to take him elsewhere. If he doesn't accept the extension, then your Year 3 doesn't happen... sell him. 

 

It's the same with Shaw:

Year 1: Youth player

Year 2: Youth player, some appearances at Chezza

Year 3: Youth player and breakout

Year 4: ?? Who knows, but he's gone

 

By all accounts, he was half decent at Chesterfield. By not offering an extension at this point at the end of Year 2, there are really only two outcomes. Either he progresses and we're floundering because we have a year to tie him down to a longer contract, or he doesn't progress as fast as we'd like, but he's still only barely turned 20 and that loan spell wasn't so bad so we'll give him another year at the end of Year 3 anyway just to see if he finally kicks on. The outcome is exactly the same, a contract that expires at the end of Year 4. It all comes down to lack of organisation and forward planning. 

 

[SallyCinnamon]

2 minutes ago, StudentOwl said:

You're completely missing the point

 

Obviously what you don't do is continuously offer every half-decent youth players a new contract every single year and, you don't sign them up to a 6 year contract the second they show any promise. It doesn't work as:

Year 1: Youth player

Year 2: Youth player

Year 3: Youth player

Year 4: Championship player

 

It's a gradual change, and the contract these players are offered need to reflect that. Take your later example of Sean Clare:

Year 1: Youth player,  barely features in loan to L1 Bury

Year 2: Youth player, some appearances at L2 Accrington

Year 3: Youth player, many appearances at L1 Gillingham

____________END OF CONTRACT_____________

 

Now any competent club looks at Sean Clare's progression and near the end of Year 2 will offer a one or two year extension on wages that justify his cumulative experience up to that time period, which would equate to probably a decent League Two/low-end League One player's salary. No billybigbollocks salary to contend with, and it allows you to have a Year 4 throw in there

Year 4: Championship breakout season

And gives you time to assess whether the Championship is going to be about his level, or if it's a bit of a flash in the pan and his career rightly deserves to take him elsewhere. If he doesn't accept the extension, then your Year 3 doesn't happen... sell him. 

 

It's the same with Shaw:

Year 1: Youth player

Year 2: Youth player, some appearances at Chezza

Year 3: Youth player and breakout

Year 4: ?? Who knows, but he's gone

 

By all accounts, he was half decent at Chesterfield. By not offering an extension at this point at the end of Year 2, there are really only two outcomes. Either he progresses and we're floundering because we have a year to tie him down to a longer contract, or he doesn't progress as fast as we'd like, but he's still only barely turned 20 and that loan spell wasn't so bad so we'll give him another year at the end of Year 3 anyway just to see if he finally kicks on. The outcome is exactly the same, a contract that expires at the end of Year 4. It all comes down to lack of organisation and forward planning. 

 

Absolutely spot on.

 

This situation does not arise at a well run club. 

[edinburghowl]

46 minutes ago, SiJ said:

Those knocking Celtic are on cloud cuckoo land. 

 

A much, much bigger club than us with a greater profile. 

 

If he goes there and does well then it will be a great move. 

The above is undeniable. They’re a huge club and IF it works out for him it could be a great move.
 

It’s the working out for him bit that I’m not convinced about. 

[SiJ]

Just now, edinburghowl said:

The above is undeniable. They’re a huge club and IF it works out for him it could be a great move.
 

It’s the working out for him bit that I’m not convinced about. 

Fair enough, but I'd rather chance my arm at Celtic than at us atm. 

[edinburghowl]

Just now, SiJ said:

Fair enough, but I'd rather chance my arm at Celtic than at us atm. 

It’s sad to say it but nearly anywhere would be a better option than Hillsborough at the moment.

[Shezza]

I actually thought it never could get worse when Milan Mandaric saved the club from bankrupcy. Chansiri has managed to make the club worse than the dark days of Dave Allen, spending millions upon millions doing it. 

[modboy]

Reckon he'd have been a star with us in L1. 

 

 

[Andrew6666]

Gutted. The lad looked promising, not to say this would make him a world beater, but I was impressed with him and thought he was our best midfielder in the games he played. Don't blame him at all for leaving. Good luck, I hope he does well.

[Guest Bulgaria]

What an absolute downer that is.

 

Only bright point to come out of this club for ages and he has gone in a split second.

 

Very annoyed.

[@owlstalk]

3 minutes ago, Shezza said:

I actually thought it never could get worse when Milan Mandaric saved the club from bankrupcy.  

He didn't

He swooped in to buy a failing club, stabilise it, put out brilliant PR to get the fans on side, then sold it

[unkastav]

Oh right. Great. Bye

[Django]

First genuinely exciting exciting player to come though the academy in years.... makes 6 appearances and f**ks off to Celtic 

 

Standard Wednesday 

 

 

Genuinely can’t get angry about the goings on at this club at the minute. It’s like a real far fetched comedy show 

[Beauchief Owl]

Ludicrous situation at a time when getting players in is more difficult than ever, that we let our young talent go. You might question whether it's worth following our youth teams as anybody anygood moves on.

[McRightSide]

At least they know his salary expectations won’t be greater than 7k a month

[PEARSON]

He’s not an idiot. Whether you’re a boyhood Wednesdayite or not you do what’s best for your career and rightly so. We’re blatantly a complete mess behind the scenes and the clubs only going one way. Good luck to him, hope he succeeds and becomes the player he’s capable of being. 

[Guest]

41 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

And not in today's squad again.

 

 

 

(cold) shoulder issue.

[Django]

Come to think of it. If Chansiri wants to raise a few quid he could get the cameras in like Sunderland did. It would be absolute tv gold 

[SiJ]

6 minutes ago, edinburghowl said:

It’s sad to say it but nearly anywhere would be a better option than Hillsborough at the moment.

Exactly. 

 

I never thought I'd see the day where I'd actively encourage players to leave us. 

 

But that's how bad it is.