akbuk Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 9 hours ago, TrickyTrev said: Anybody who tries to stop me sitting in my season ticket seat tomorrow on the North Stand can go f*** themselves. This whole situation is a complete and utter farce. Why did the club fail to turn up to the meeting on the 17th of July Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quinnssweetshop Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Mycroft said: , or give them a hug. Then wash 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspector Lestrade Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 9 minutes ago, akbuk said: Why did the club fail to turn up to the meeting on the 17th of July Are they obliged to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Regulator Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 10 minutes ago, akbuk said: Why did the club fail to turn up to the meeting on the 17th of July Probably too busy dealing with the departure of cabbage face. Probably sick and tired of constantly having to deal with crap like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akbuk Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Just now, Mycroft said: Are they obliged to? Morally yes and practically absolutely the club have had decades to sort the matter out but put things off with the excuse "when we get to the Premier league" It's time to act ,trying g to prove the Manchester report wrong is not the way to go about things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akbuk Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, The Regulator said: Probably too busy dealing with the departure of cabbage face. Probably sick and tired of constantly having to deal with crap like this. It's not crap though is it ,no excuse for club to get the fans into this predicament so near to the match stupid attitude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latemodelchild Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 I'm on holiday at the moment so brother is using my season tickets today. Told him to get there early. I've read this thread and the other one. I've just read the report. I am at a bit of a loss to be honest. The report talks as though the away stand always has c3500 fans in it and the north always has c10000 fans in it. Every single game. It says 5000 home fans leave via leppings lane. It says the minimum time taken for those fans to leave will be around 10 minutes, that's why no holdback can take place. It then says that this time is not actually a useful guide as fans never leave en masse at exactly the same time in a platoon formation that would lead to this time being taken. It talks about 2 fans per square metre being comfortable and aims to provide this by reducing the number of people in the area. At no point does it look at penistone Road and whether there is enough egress space to accommodate this. Basically they have looked at one issue, at one game, in isolation and provided a solution. They haven't looked at the knock on effect anywhere. It's like saying to stop a burglar getting into your house you should brick up all your doors and windows and have no points of access. The report also blames home fans for the trouble outside whilst stating the away fans behaviour is acceptable and normal. Was this the case? If so, our fans that kicked off have landed us with a proper nightmare by giving the police and sag the ammo they needed. Well done to those involved. I am appalled that it seems the club haven't responded to this report in a timely manner. However, I'd like to know why they didn't attend the initial meeting. We are only being told what has happened with the meetings from the police side of things. I'm also wondering if the pigs will have the same restrictions at their away end. Ingress and egress from there is as bad as at our ground. In fact, they have a mix of fans in the same stand with away turnstiles flanked on either side by home ones don't they? As you can see, I have many disjointed thoughts on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Binky Griptite Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Anyone know / worked out the approximate average away attendance at Hillsborough? In its present state the holding areas are sufficient for circa 2,500 away fans (I think). How many away attendances exceed that? Not many is my guess. The report is all well and good, it applies logic but a fair amount of the logic is flawed. By rights the stadium should be condemned as if everyone wanted the toilet at the same time there wouldn't be enough facilities, which would cause changes in fans behaviour and issues with said fans behaviour towards stewards. If fans all wanted a can of pop on 35mins would the catering facilities be able to cope or would there be issues? How about if everyone got cramp, or jumpy legs and just needed to walk around to stave it off, would there be enough space? Alton Towers must be considered a deathtrap with all those queues, snaking around the rides. Parliament should be shut down as on the incredibly rare occasion the MPs can all be bothered to turn up there's not enough space for them to sit down. If you want to apply hysterical nonsense levels of logic to literally any scenario you'll find issues and be able to make recommendations. Doesn't make the recommendations valid, practical or worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulva Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 (edited) I’ve done nearly 80 grounds and the worst to get in and out of for fans is the Lane. Edited August 10, 2019 by vulva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Binky Griptite Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, vulva said: I’ve done nearly 80 grounds and the worst to get in and out of for fans is the Lane. Yep, it will be... Won't be the same issue for fans of Arsenal, I imagine they've had more difficulty getting out of the old White Hart Lane... But let's learn lessons from the worst case scenario and apply it when one man and his dog from Brentford comes to Hillsborough... Edited August 10, 2019 by Binky Griptite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Regulator Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 6 minutes ago, akbuk said: Morally yes and practically absolutely the club have had decades to sort the matter out but put things off with the excuse "when we get to the Premier league" It's time to act ,trying g to prove the Manchester report wrong is not the way to go about things Why is trying to prove the report wrong not the right way to go about things? The solution that’s been put in place is at best impractical and at worst dangerous. The club has a duty of care to its supporters so surely, if they believe that supporters are in greater danger as a result of this action being taken, this is precisely the right thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspector Lestrade Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, akbuk said: Morally yes and practically absolutely the club have had decades to sort the matter out but put things off with the excuse "when we get to the Premier league" It's time to act ,trying g to prove the Manchester report wrong is not the way to go about things Morally yes? That's a get out tactic. They should remember they answer to us the public not the other way around, they are doing this not due to H&S issues or moralistic reasons, they are doing it coz again they failed the footballing community and have childishly responding by laying the blame at the fans and the club, when it was the police who was largely to blame. They have gone crying to SAG and other authorities who have closed ranks against the club. They should work with the knowledge that the ground has 34000 capacity and they should put in the resources and manpower to make that work. Not just cut the capacity as its the easy thing to do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrickyTrev Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 17 minutes ago, akbuk said: Morally yes and practically absolutely the club have had decades to sort the matter out but put things off with the excuse "when we get to the Premier league" It's time to act ,trying g to prove the Manchester report wrong is not the way to go about things The club have had decades to sort the matter out? What matter???? Since the Hillsborough disaster the club have hosted (off the top of my head) Euro 96, 3 cup semi finals and a cup final. Since the stadium became all seater and the railings at the front of the stands removed, the Leppings Lane end has been perfectly safe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
latemodelchild Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 I can see issues later today on penistone Road. Traffic must be stopped in both directions the way it is on leppings Lane otherwise someone could be seriously hurt. It seems the report only looks at safety of away fans. If you look at the photos showing direction of egress, the away and north exits to leppings lane have arrows that point to areas outside the stadium. The arrow pointing to egress towards the east ends within the north stand. No consideration given to the fact fans are exiting onto a 30mph dual carriageway that is one of the busiest in the city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Regulator Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 6 minutes ago, TrickyTrev said: The club have had decades to sort the matter out? What matter???? Since the Hillsborough disaster the club have hosted (off the top of my head) Euro 96, 3 cup semi finals and a cup final. Since the stadium became all seater and the railings at the front of the stands removed, the Leppings Lane end has been perfectly safe. Indeed. All of these restrictions have coincided with the more recent inquests and trials relating to the disaster. It smacks of an agenda and it’s time we fought back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrysgame Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 7 minutes ago, latemodelchild said: I can see issues later today on penistone Road. Traffic must be stopped in both directions the way it is on leppings Lane otherwise someone could be seriously hurt. It seems the report only looks at safety of away fans. If you look at the photos showing direction of egress, the away and north exits to leppings lane have arrows that point to areas outside the stadium. The arrow pointing to egress towards the east ends within the north stand. No consideration given to the fact fans are exiting onto a 30mph dual carriageway that is one of the busiest in the city. The more you read the report the more you realise it seems to be a failing of the crowd management by the police. Stop parking away coaches on the lepp for big games. More space etc. There were more than enough police on duty to deal with this. So all the home fans now need to double back on their routes by exit on the kop end then walk up vere rd and end up.at the same place. Or are we expected to walk to law bros then back up leppings lane? Away fans mix at most grounds; and police seem to manage. ⁰ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristmace Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 The report uses a couple of very debatable assumptions on crowd flow and maximum standing capacity in an area. These are huge underestimates. The 6m wide exit door from the North stand on to Leppings Lane can fit far more than 82 people per minute through it. I bet in practice it's double that number, easily. Since when has 2 people per square metre been a safe limit for standing capacity? Anyone who's ever been anywhere near the front of a standing concert knows isn't the case in practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meggoisgod Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Its utter bllx the whole thing Its time to move away fans to the end section of the south stand so that the lepp can be kept either empty or populated by our fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrickyTrev Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 Just out of interest will anybody be altering their match day routine because of this farce? We usually go drinking around Hillsborough corner before the matches and leave at about 2.30pm to get to the match but was thinking of leaving 15 minutes early to allow for this nonsense. Surely that’ll be enough time to make kickoff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essix Blue Posted August 10, 2019 Share Posted August 10, 2019 15 minutes ago, latemodelchild said: I can see issues later today on penistone Road. Traffic must be stopped in both directions the way it is on leppings Lane otherwise someone could be seriously hurt. It seems the report only looks at safety of away fans. If you look at the photos showing direction of egress, the away and north exits to leppings lane have arrows that point to areas outside the stadium. The arrow pointing to egress towards the east ends within the north stand. No consideration given to the fact fans are exiting onto a 30mph dual carriageway that is one of the busiest in the city. Barnsley police have warned away fans there’ll be extra road closures today 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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