Guest mkowl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 10 minutes ago, Peacenocchio said: Nice to see some proper info mk. Ditto 2 lawyers btw. Is the real danger that as in the FF case, EFL rules mean they can basically decide to believe what they want. The law or even accounting regulations have nothing to do with this. We are part of a private association with it's own set of rules by which we have to abide. The EFL rules follow the accounts in the main. They are under the rules allowed to adjust for non arms length transactions - so DC could have put in 20m for stadium sponsorship in the accounts but the EFL would adjust. Reading the statement it seems they the EFL are not challenging the value but the fundamental assertions in how accounts are compiled and then audited. Good luck in arguing that without a fight because the potential repercussions for those professionals are huge. I promise you cross an accountant or lawyer on their professional judgement they won't lie down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debram Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 We are Wednesday so will get the harshest decision they can impose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEnchanter Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Just now, kevtheowl said: Was that your view when we were 90 mins from the premiership ? Didn't think it was !!!! UTO No but what about in the 3 years since then? Myself and many other fans have regularly had deep concerns that have now seemingly been qualified. Concerns that have all centered around the same issues, Chansiris running of the club, our ignorance of FFP and why those factors will contribute to us struggling to be a true Premiership contender. This isnt a 'its come true' moment because its been happening ever since that first Carlos season. Its just that we've finally been caught out... short term future is bleak for us and as usual we will pay for it as fans. Slightly disappointing and im surprised there haven't been stronger reactions on here. It shows many were expecting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mkowl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 14 minutes ago, Animis said: Carilion, Patisserie Valerie, Thomas Cook - they appear to do what's necessary to keep the client happy. There have been issues - there will be a forthcoming shake up in the audit market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJMortimer Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, kevtheowl said: Was that your view when we were 90 mins from the premiership ? Didn't think it was !!!! UTO I flatter myself to be a little more pragmatic than you are portraying yourself to be. Ultimately, I largely go along with what the club is doing because I don't really have much say in it. Doesn't mean I'm always happy with it. If you check my posting history, you'll find I have always advocated financial prudence because any short-term gains will usually catch up with you in the long run; as may be the case here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
full fathom five Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 DC just announced a new gold membership scheme, for just £1000 you can bring a friend to two CAT D games a season for free and as much elev8 as you can drink. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theowlsman Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 At least we’ll still be above Boro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogers Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Pick the worse thing that happen and it will; whilst Derby and rest get away with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellbeaten-the-owl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, mkowl said: The EFL rules follow the accounts in the main. They are under the rules allowed to adjust for non arms length transactions - so DC could have put in 20m for stadium sponsorship in the accounts but the EFL would adjust. Reading the statement it seems they the EFL are not challenging the value but the fundamental assertions in how accounts are compiled and then audited. Good luck in arguing that without a fight because the potential repercussions for those professionals are huge. I promise you cross an accountant or lawyer on their professional judgement they won't lie down Which is why if EFL commission find against us can see this going on and on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 1 minute ago, mkowl said: The EFL rules follow the accounts in the main. They are under the rules allowed to adjust for non arms length transactions - so DC could have put in 20m for stadium sponsorship in the accounts but the EFL would adjust. Reading the statement it seems they the EFL are not challenging the value but the fundamental assertions in how accounts are compiled and then audited. Good luck in arguing that without a fight because the potential repercussions for those professionals are huge. I promise you cross an accountant or lawyer on their professional judgement they won't lie down But what leverage would accountants have on the EFL or their decision? If they can ignore a ruling in a court of law and apply a different burden of proof according to their own rules why would they worry about not complying with the fundamental principles of accountancy? I hope you are right btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mkowl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 13 minutes ago, wellbeaten-the-owl said: Very reason I am glad I left auditing! The thing that rules me are the "experts" such as the price of football guy who keeps on going on radio Sheffield, yes he can put a few graphs together and work out ratio's but he clearly doesn't understand accounting standards and the issues on recognising a transaction in a given accounting period including the judgements involved. I gave up Auditing earlier this year - best call I made Maguire is qualified by the way, had a debate with him on twitter when the accounts were released. Suggested the same ! I just said them that can do do, them that can't teach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Farrell Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, TheEnchanter said: No but what about in the 3 years since then? Myself and many other fans have regularly had deep concerns that have now seemingly been qualified. Concerns that have all centered around the same issues, Chansiris running of the club, our ignorance of FFP and why those factors will contribute to us struggling to be a true Premiership contender. This isnt a 'its come true' moment because its been happening ever since that first Carlos season. Its just that we've finally been caught out... short term future is bleak for us and as usual we will pay for it as fans. Slightly disappointing and im surprised there haven't been stronger reactions on here. It shows many were expecting it. A day out at Wembley more than compensates though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beswetherick Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 6 minutes ago, debram said: We are Wednesday so will get the harshest decision they can impose. Then FFP will be scrapped when Chansiri decides he’s had enough and fùcks off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Farrell Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, full fathom five said: DC just announced a new gold membership scheme, for just £1000 you can bring a friend to two CAT D games a season for free and as much elev8 as you can drink. Free taxi home too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animis Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 9 minutes ago, SiJ said: Who knows. There are some good points in here. There's more to this than what we may or may not have done. Our accounts would be signed off by an independent auditor. They were initially accepted by the EFL? Why was that? Do the EFL just accept the accounts on face value? Do they not properly check through club's accounts before accepting them? I suspect this will not just lead to us getting point deductions and that being the end of it. I think this will run and run. Proper Pandora's box type moment. The EFL are just following their own, widely known process. The accounts are the accounts and the auditors will have to answer that they are ligit. But as Maguire says: First of all, the timing of the sale appears curious. Sheffield Wednesday's accounts were until 31 July 2018 and there was no reference of ownership by the new company until around 12 months later with the land registry. The timing issue does concern the EFL. They might be concerned that the transaction was accelerated into the 2018 accounts, which would give them cause for concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellbeaten-the-owl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Just now, Peacenocchio said: But what leverage would accountants have on the EFL or their decision? If they can ignore a ruling in a court of law and apply a different burden of proof according to their own rules why would they worry about not complying with the fundamental principles of accountancy? I hope you are right btw. Issue not just commission hearing, imagine if we are in top 6 or god forbid top 2 in march and then get a 12 point deduction. Imagine potential for DC to sue EFL and take them to court for potential lost income.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debram Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 1 minute ago, beswetherick said: Then FFP will be scrapped when Chansiri decides he’s had enough and fùcks off Sods law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakefield owl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 41 minutes ago, Royal_D said: why didn’t the EFL just refuse to approve the accounts then ? If we make the reasonable assumption that our submission to the EFL is based on our statutory accounts then the EFL will have a battle on their hands. Our accounts were audited and so it appears the EFL is not accepting the same information that was presented to a firm of professional accountants. Therefore it seems likely that the EFL have already spent a lot of time and money investigating this and employing the services of many professionals eg accountants, lawyers and possibly surveyors. They will have to, IMO, state that the auditors should not have signed off the accounts - this would then start the legal arguments which could take a long time. I would be surprised if this is sorted before the end of the season and potentially a lot longer if we appeal should the decision go against us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wellbeaten-the-owl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, mkowl said: I gave up Auditing earlier this year - best call I made Maguire is qualified by the way, had a debate with him on twitter when the accounts were released. Suggested the same ! I just said them that can do do, them that can't teach. Big difference between theory and practice, his ins on radio Sheffield tonight was cringe worthy. I know qualified accountants who couldn't balance an ETB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kagoshimaowl Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 We are fooked. The EFL hate us. I expect us to be chucked out of the league. Chansiri you really have screwed this one up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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