Doing it the right way

[s73owl]

1 minute ago, sonofbert2 said:

 

Not a bad effort but I think you're giving him a bit too much credit.

 

Easy puns on Owlstalk are pretty ten a penny these days.

You may have just snatched his crown 

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

5 hours ago, Animis said:

I'm not sure why people are worried about next season in terms of penalties. 10 or so senior pros on perhaps 60% of the total wage bill, will have left.

 

Because, despite this, it's fairly safe to assume from Chansiri's comments that the amount we've spent in the previous two seasons is going to make meeting the three-year rolling P&S requirements nigh on impossible for us.

 

Without raising some serious income via transfer fees, I can't see how we can hope to escape another embargo.

[mcmigo]

OP talking a lot of sense , and of course could have included the departed Clare and hirst in his list as two more who made the step up briefly albeit we didn’t retain them.

i wonder if Bullens retention on the staff is part of this strategy. He will know a lot of these young players really well and him being a sort of constant in the coaching set up might make the transition a bit easier up to first team football.

it is great to see.

[Carlton Palmreader]

Another Snoots talks a load of sense post... I love it! Long live Owlstalk!

[Jim]

When Jos first got the job there is no doubt whatsoever that the target for him from Chansiri was get promotion to the Prem just like it was for Carlos.

 

The big difference was Jos had come in halfway through a campaign inheriting a struggling squad at the wrong end of the table that was in the midst of an unbelievable injury crisis and also had a group of disillusioned and disenchanted players with financial constraints lurking in the background.

 

He had little choice at the time but to throw in the youth because let’s face it their was no other option. In all fairness the youth have done him, themselves and the club proud but at the end of the day they are young players and you are going to get fluctuations in form unless they are really Top Drawer which IMO only Penney and maybe Thorniley look at the moment.

 

I believe it’s nigh on impossible for Jos to achieve promotion with this currrent set-up but he and the club have no choice but to continue to plough the furrow with what we currently have and I would expect even more Youth to be thrown in before the end of the campaign. Rice on the bench on Friday is an example of that.

 

I don’t ever believe this plan was in place but they have stumbled on this through fault rather than design and given little other option they have to persevere with this approach for the foreseeable future.

 

I don’t expect Jos to hang around. I think he’ll see this season out and maybe he may stick around for next season but there will be big clubs in Bundesliga 2 who will want rescuing and he’ll be back there before long and if financial constraints are still in place then we’ll probably have little choice but to appoint Bullen and his little cameo last season showed he’s not up to the top job.

 

The future looks uncertain at the moment but we just have to strap ourselves in for the ride and hope for the best and you never know what’s around the corner, it may well pleasantly surprise us?

 

[pgmetcalf]

8 hours ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

 

 

If you told me three years ago that we were putting in place a  plan and that within that plan we'd within three years- :

 

Given debuts and involved in first team duties Jordan Thorniley , Ash Baker ,Cameron Dawson,  Connor O'Grady , Joe Wildsmith ,Alex Hunt , Connor Kirby, Isaac Rice ,Frederik Nielsen ,Fraser Preston , Jack Lee ,Matt Penney ,Jack Stobbs would all have been named in match day squads.  (Well.... well actually the first thing I'd have done was ask you who the hell they were because 3 years ago I reckon only heard of Wildsmith and Stobbs!)

 

13 young lads who've been playing in the youth sides. All named in match day squads. Many of them getting on the park and playing too. Becoming regulars.

 I'd have thought that was brilliant. 

 

If you'd told me that sprinkled into that a couple of signings which prove excellent value for money. younger signings like Reach is proving to be and Pelupessy certainly is for the absolute peanuts we paid for him.

 

I'd have thought Crikey. Talk about building up the foundations for a solid future!  We're going places and we're doing it in the right way.

 

And do you know. With patience. I still think we are. I think we're doing it right. I really do.

 

That's why its shame really that we spent 3 years spaffing money all over the place and now have the "problems if we don't get promoted" hanging over us because that's going to put a downer on things.

 

It's going to put pressure , sadly, on what is actually -at last- a proper genuine plan in place and which we can actually see.

 

I'm actually quite enjoying this season. Like I said. Shame the shadow lurks and is adding pressure (needlessly in the sense the club has brought it on itself) on Jos and his young players, because it is casting a shadow on what is a good plan but which needs development time. 

Time which I hope it gets.

 

 

 

 

Fair points, but is it the right way or just your way? The thing I would say is that history shows the clubs that spend more stand the better chance of promotion. Personally, I'm happy trying to compete in this division, I wouldn't get anything extra out of football through the club gaining promotion. In fact, it would be a lot less, especially in the money stakes. You could argue there are another 3 divisions above the Championship too 

 

 

Edited September 30, 2018 by pgmetcalf

[Bluesteel]

If we’d gone up when we were close to doing so that would’ve been the right way. On the whole I think we have been fairly prudent when you see how much we spent on Hooper and FF compared with the current market.  I just think some of the others have been like our recruiting in the 1990s, not expensive but buying a lot of average players and it all mounts up. Add to that the failed bigger buys of Abdi and Rhodes and then it’s an issue as you have nowt to sell.

 

We are fortunate that our u23s are doing well and we can afford to play a few of them. I think we need to find a balance between playing them and having the funds to spend on players who are already doing it when we need to. I think that would be the right way.

[poite]

3 years ago we were pretty much told to expect premier league football by now. 

 

Instead we have 'we're fked if we don't go up this season' and have team full of youngsters who realistically can probably only achieve a mid-table finish.

 

Don't get me wrong. Seeing these young players in the first team is absolutely brilliant and for young players they are doing tremendously well. I'm absolutely 100% behind giving them a shot. But we as fans shouldn't be getting rinced with the most expensive ticket prices in the league to be seeing a team finish mid-table becuase we need to play developing players. Fans have every right to be disgruntled in my view.

 

Mr Chansiri said that we had to pay the top prices for the top reward. That just isn't happening. 

 

If the plan for the next 3 seasons is to develop our youth players I'm absolutely all for that, but our pricing structure has to reflect that. 

 

Probably not going to be a popular post but oh well. That's my view 

[MrsHall]

'Top prices for top reward'. Unfortunately we are now paying the credit card off. UTO.

[The Batman]

There's obviously been a lot of work going on, for years, to get these young players to this stage, where they're ready to make the step up.

 

Ok, circumstances have played a part too, injuries last season etc.

 

But it's not some miracle or accident or Jos masterstroke that we've got this group of kids.

 

Long may it continue.

[East Yorks Owl]

9 hours ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

 

 

If you told me three years ago that we were putting in place a  plan and that within that plan we'd within three years- :

 

Given debuts and involved in first team duties Jordan Thorniley , Ash Baker ,Cameron Dawson,  Connor O'Grady , Joe Wildsmith ,Alex Hunt , Connor Kirby, Isaac Rice ,Frederik Nielsen ,Fraser Preston , Jack Lee ,Matt Penney ,Jack Stobbs would all have been named in match day squads.  (Well.... well actually the first thing I'd have done was ask you who the hell they were because 3 years ago I reckon only heard of Wildsmith and Stobbs!)

 

13 young lads who've been playing in the youth sides. All named in match day squads. Many of them getting on the park and playing too. Becoming regulars.

 I'd have thought that was brilliant. 

 

If you'd told me that sprinkled into that a couple of signings which prove excellent value for money. younger signings like Reach is proving to be and Pelupessy certainly is for the absolute peanuts we paid for him.

 

I'd have thought Crikey. Talk about building up the foundations for a solid future!  We're going places and we're doing it in the right way.

 

And do you know. With patience. I still think we are. I think we're doing it right. I really do.

 

That's why its shame really that we spent 3 years spaffing money all over the place and now have the "problems if we don't get promoted" hanging over us because that's going to put a downer on things.

 

It's going to put pressure , sadly, on what is actually -at last- a proper genuine plan in place and which we can actually see.

 

I'm actually quite enjoying this season. Like I said. Shame the shadow lurks and is adding pressure (needlessly in the sense the club has brought it on itself) on Jos and his young players, because it is casting a shadow on what is a good plan but which needs development time. 

Time which I hope it gets.

 

 

 

I have to agree that the philosophy of developing home grown talent and patient progression, rests far easier than the short term gamble approach.  The first year under CC felt like a year of sensible investment, but Year 2 was very damaging for our club.  There are zero guarantees in football so those poor decisions made in year 2 were pretty reckless in hindsight.

 

i personally felt more than comfortable with the MM Stuart Gray era, with the one worrying aspect that even under MM’s careful stewardship we were still losing money. I despair of the flawed economics of the Championship and wouldn’t want to be in DCs position. The development of our youth players feels so refreshing and appropriate after the crazy punts in recent years. These young lads could go down as club legends if they help progress the club to the next level. Lastly the fact that Jos appears to be more comfortable with this philosophy of developing youth suggests we’ve got the right man for the job.

[Mike Hunt]

Mr C was sold the dream and he then sold the dream to the supporters , unfortunately it was a dream that nearly turned into a nightmare financially .

 

It seems that Mr C has learnt from his mistakes and now trying to put a long term plan together that is sustainable , when we get the over the hill gang off the books then we will see much improvement throughout 

 

Its obvious that Jos likes young mobile hungry mobile players and its like a breath of fresh air , viva the revolution !

[gurujuan]

If it is a plan, I too like it. We have to be careful here though, it’s hardly likely that we’ve stumbled on a “once in a lifetime generation” like the Manchester Utd of the 90s. Indeed, can anyone remember when that last happened at any club? Not for a long while, I’d have thought. Sadly, most of these youngsters are unlikely to make it at this level, although hopefully, a lot will go on to have careers in the game. 

It was never the plan to use youth during the Carlos regime. For a start, it didn’t fit the remit set out by DC himself. However, we do need to give credit to the club, this was set in motion when DC and Carlos arrived at the club. It may not have been the plan to use the youngsters at the time, but money was invested in the youth set up, that is clearly playing dividends now. Perhaps back then, we didn’t have the youngsters who could step up. Our youth set up has been evolving over the last three years, and now we are starting to reap the rewards.

As supporters though, we are notoriously fickle. We are singing the praises of these youngsters now, suggesting that they can be the future of Sheffield Wednesday, and yet when they leave, they are deemed not good enough. Take Clare for example, one of the first off the production line, he looked a useful prospect, and yet when he left, it was “he’ll end up at Gillingham” In truth though, most of these youngsters will end up at that level. If we can blend a few of these youngsters, with some of the experienced talent we have, then I agree, that’s a more sustainable way of doing things.

[owls7]

9 hours ago, s73owl said:

You may have just snatched his crown 

I didn't think much of Penny the other night, I thought the Leeds player had him in his pocket.

[OWLERTON GHOST]

9 hours ago, s73owl said:

You may have just snatched his crown 

You're not a full Shilling lad !!!

[Roscoe P. Coltrane]

Just now, OWLERTON GHOST said:

You're not a full Shilling lad !!!

You can say that again 

[OWLERTON GHOST]

1 minute ago, Andoverowl said:

You can say that again 

You're not a full Shilling lad!!!

Edited September 30, 2018 by OWLERTON GHOST

[Bluesteel]

1 hour ago, MrsHall said:

'Top prices for top reward'. Unfortunately we are now paying the credit card off. UTO.

 

Kind of, but lack of funds isn’t the issue it’s the regulations and the refusal to sell players. For example and reading between the lines we have had bids for the likes of Lees, Bannan, Reach and Forestieri in the last few seasons. Selling them wouldn’t be popular but we probably would’ve been able to have been a lot more active in the last three windows.

[Costello 77]

I think that the majority of us are resigned to losing players in the January/summer windows.

 

There's no point being up in arms when it happens.

 

Also...it might be that we don't splash the money we get in.

I wonder if Jos can dig a few nuggets out from abroad to complement the youngsters?

 

He seems canny enough.

[Lord Snooty]

2 hours ago, pgmetcalf said:

 

 

Fair points, but is it the right way or just your way?

 

Thsts usually the same thing