What's The Club Actually Worth Right Now?

[matt68owls]

Stop panicking, those golden elephants are worth 20m each.

[Guest Therealrealist]

4 hours ago, bladeshater said:

It's worth exactly the value the chairman places on it

So if he says we are worth 300 mill ..we are worth 300 mill?? Bizzare post...if you say your house is worth 2 mill..is it really worth 2 mill? Do you still believe he’s ‘the best chairman we have ever had’?

[RhodesToNowhere]

I’d imagine the current realistic price would be a Tesco meal deal and a signed picture of Dot Cotton. Doesn’t even have to be signed by the right actress just as long as it’s got some ink on it. That’s a realistic price for the state the clubs in now.

 

But Chansiri probably values us at £300 million, because ya know, successful businessman and that. 

[Lee Strafford]

Bearing in mind that the EFL knows that the various asset manouverings have been spending limit workarounds.

 

Ignoring the possibility that Chansiri and associates may well have financed our assets in part with 3rd parties who might act as blockers to a sensible deal being done. 

 

Tangible assets:

Players under contract - c£7m = £0 due to contract breach. 

Stadium - c£30m residential development value

Training ground - c£7m residential development value. 

 

So £37m.

 

But any buyer will need to stand behind a plan which assumes circa £10m losses a year for 3 years in order to get back to the Championship. 

 

The new owners would then be looking at a uplift in valuation of the club and all of its assets in the Championship to £50m-£100m - but - would need to stand behind a plan of losing £39m over 3 years to have a chance of promotion to the Premier League, at which point all of the Premier league funding will be needed to develop the squad and physical infrastructure in order to establish the club in the Premier League, probably via a few years of yo-yoing between the Premier League and the Championship. 

 

All in all from where we are now with the current owners having zero rope to play with from the EFL, zero goodwill left with Wednesdayite's, and the club only hanging together due to the dedication and professionalism of the staff. Then maybe in 7-10 years, on the basis of investing c£106m, there would be the possibility of emerging in the same way that Leicester did and the new owners might be looking at a £300m-£500m valuation. 

 

So reasonable terms of a deal right now would be to agree to sell the club for £1, conditional on evidencing the funding to fund the £30m in losses mentioned above, and granting an option to the buyer to buy the stadium and training ground for £37m at any point with an annual rental of £1.8m (5% return on the £37m) until the acquisition is triggered. 

 

Absent finding a credible buyer who would step up to the above I would favour the approach that Brentford and Swansea took of community ownership, with an executive team being appointed made up of ex-Wednesday football people, with local authority backing on the property side, and a commitment in the shareholders agreement and the articles to onboard financial investors in due course.

 

This would also require the club to build by way of selling some of its talent for profits each year and absent onboarding financial investors in due course could result in a longer time-frame to being established in the Premier League.

 

This second scenario being something that Chansiri spoke of as an exit plan in one of the forums if he was no longer going to support the club and no credible buyer was forthcoming. 

 

If administration occurs then on the threat of liquidation the current owners mighty be looking at 20p in the pound on the £37m.

 

Which would take the deal back to the level where Mandric and his partners bought the club by leveraging a £6m loan and forward financing season tickets and other revenue streams....

 

 

 

 

[Blue and white]

A pint of Carling and a packet of cheese and onion crisps.

[catdog1121]

I would think we are worth a negative amount or at best nothing...

 

We don't own our own stadium and in the last god knows how many years we have made a loss so the likelyhood of us making a profit is extremely slim.  On that basis we are a liability rather than an asset and as such are worth a negative amount..

 

Unless someone can come in an make the club profitable then we are not worth anything without any assets.  The only thing that makes us worth anything is our current membership of the football league and the possibility that we might get into the prem where we have a much higher chance of being able to post a profit.  

 

 

Lots of fans are complaining that DC will not sell, but where are these mythical buyers?  I am not trying to defend DC but frankly without him pay-rolling the club we would be bankrupt, in administration and be non existent...  Just be really careful what you wish for, its tough times out there and the days of ultra rich people buying football teams as play things has passed.   With some of the abuse DC has got (Some of it I agree is totally warranted) I am surprised he hasn't already just walked away, it would save himself a lot of money, I think the phrase that comes to mind is "No point throwing good money after bad"..

 

Again not defending DC and I will be the first on the DC should go bus if there is proof that we have better alternative owners that are willing to come in...  So far all we have had is Erik Alonso, we all know how well that is going for Derby.  I don't know what the solution is as it does not seem like DC is going to change his ways, if anything it appears he now wants the club to stand on its own two feet, which is never going to happen, I think we are entering into a new era of going back to the sort of Chairmanship of Dave Allen.  I really hope not but I think fans turning on DC has contributed to him falling out of love with the club.

[Ian]

20 minutes ago, Lee Strafford said:

Bearing in mind that the EFL knows that the various asset manouverings have been spending limit workarounds.

 

Ignoring the possibility that Chansiri and associates may well have financed our assets in part with 3rd parties who might act as blockers to a sensible deal being done. 

 

Tangible assets:

Players under contract - c£7m = £0 due to contract breach. 

Stadium - c£30m residential development value

Training ground - c£7m residential development value. 

 

So £37m.

 

But any buyer will need to stand behind a plan which assumes circa £10m losses a year for 3 years in order to get back to the Championship. 

 

The new owners would then be looking at a uplift in valuation of the club and all of its assets in the Championship to £50m-£100m - but - would need to stand behind a plan of losing £39m over 3 years to have a chance of promotion to the Premier League, at which point all of the Premier league funding will be needed to develop the squad and physical infrastructure in order to establish the club in the Premier League, probably via a few years of yo-yoing between the Premier League and the Championship. 

 

All in all from where we are now with the current owners having zero rope to play with from the EFL, zero goodwill left with Wednesdayite's, and the club only hanging together due to the dedication and professionalism of the staff. Then maybe in 7-10 years, on the basis of investing c£106m, there would be the possibility of emerging in the same way that Leicester did and the new owners might be looking at a £300m-£500m valuation. 

 

So reasonable terms of a deal right now would be to agree to sell the club for £1, conditional on evidencing the funding to fund the £30m in losses mentioned above, and granting an option to the buyer to buy the stadium and training ground for £37m at any point with an annual rental of £1.8m (5% return on the £37m) until the acquisition is triggered. 

 

Absent finding a credible buyer who would step up to the above I would favour the approach that Brentford and Swansea took of community ownership, with an executive team being appointed made up of ex-Wednesday football people, with local authority backing on the property side, and a commitment in the shareholders agreement and the articles to onboard financial investors in due course.

 

This would also require the club to build by way of selling some of its talent for profits each year and absent onboarding financial investors in due course could result in a longer time-frame to being established in the Premier League.

 

This second scenario being something that Chansiri spoke of as an exit plan in one of the forums if he was no longer going to support the club and no credible buyer was forthcoming. 

 

If administration occurs then on the threat of liquidation the current owners mighty be looking at 20p in the pound on the £37m.

 

Which would take the deal back to the level where Mandric and his partners bought the club by leveraging a £6m loan and forward financing season tickets and other revenue streams....

 

 

 

 

Is the EFL license not a significant asset?

[Truth is out there]

6 minutes ago, Blue and white said:

A pint of Carling and a packet of cheese and onion crisps.

Are the crisps Seabrooks crinkle cut ?

[Truth is out there]

6 hours ago, Harrysgame said:

Hard to value any club, it's a dream you are buying. Possibly someone might pay 50m. There are some serious wealthy people in the world who buy boats costing 200m. Problem is we need someone honest and sensible, that would exclude them from buying us.

Genius - turning a negative into a positive - flog perennially flooded Hillsborough into a berth for a (200m)boat...............................................or have I misunderstood ?

[The Night-Owl]

The club we grew up loving and have given a lifetime of support, sadly is worthless. We've no stadium, no saleable assets, nothing of worth. Just mountains of debt; failed schemes, unpaid bills, embargoes and what looks like a bleak future of more embargoes; points deductions and relegations. 

 

The history and support is priceless but sadly the fans have been taken for mugs for far too long by various owners and especially the current owner. We're worthless to the current owner, not valued respected supporters but mere customers. Customers that have been given poor service, ignored and underappreciated for far too long.

 

Owners come and go, same as managers and players, I feel most empathy and heartache for our fans; young and old, the community and the staff connected with the club because the reputation and history of our famous old club and us supporters deserve far more better than this clueless inept lack of leadership and mediocrity.

 

I hope there's a way out of this nightmare, a way that's good for the club. I can see no brighter times or way back up the leagues unless DC cuts his losses and accepts a reasonable offer. When DC leaves, I hope there's a club left and I hope the new owners respect the club, it's history and us fans more, and I hope they're far more sensible an owner. Enough is enough, DC has to sell up and go or I fear we'll drop further down the pyramid or sooner or later there might not be no club left. 

[Rogers]

If all the players leave, £3m

[g-owls]

You'd have to be a complete masochist to want to take the club on right now.

 

I mean, where on earth would you start?!

 

 

[Orlando_Trustful]

At the moment, nothing. DC should really be hoping someone makes him an offer to take on any debts and loans and then he can just walk away. DC won't be getting anyone to actually pay him money for us in this state. We're far, far worse than when he bought us. 

[Rogers]

24 minutes ago, g-owls said:

You'd have to be a complete masochist to want to take the club on right now.

 

I mean, where on earth would you start?!

 

 

From the ground up; and it needs to be done. 
 

Determination, passion, and drive on a day-to-day basis is required. 

[bobness]

2 hours ago, Rogers said:

 

If all the players leave, £3m

 

£1m if they don't! 

[Daniele Giovanni]

13 hours ago, maidstoneowl said:

We only 1 sponsor so Chansiri is sponsor all

 

If all sponsor diffrent then money still arrive

 

Problem is sponsor if we all on sponsor then all o. k

 

Sponsor seem to be all Chansiri and not sponsor like Telecom or Bet so we struggle.

 

If sponsor was other money then we would make summer o. k with money.

 

If one man run from money then problem

 

 

 

DC you English is getting worse

[BrucieBonus]

 Pint of magnet and a packet of pork scratching 

[Guest Mcguigan]

6 hours ago, Lee Strafford said:

Bearing in mind that the EFL knows that the various asset manouverings have been spending limit workarounds.

 

Ignoring the possibility that Chansiri and associates may well have financed our assets in part with 3rd parties who might act as blockers to a sensible deal being done. 

 

Tangible assets:

Players under contract - c£7m = £0 due to contract breach. 

Stadium - c£30m residential development value

Training ground - c£7m residential development value. 

 

So £37m.

 

But any buyer will need to stand behind a plan which assumes circa £10m losses a year for 3 years in order to get back to the Championship. 

 

The new owners would then be looking at a uplift in valuation of the club and all of its assets in the Championship to £50m-£100m - but - would need to stand behind a plan of losing £39m over 3 years to have a chance of promotion to the Premier League, at which point all of the Premier league funding will be needed to develop the squad and physical infrastructure in order to establish the club in the Premier League, probably via a few years of yo-yoing between the Premier League and the Championship. 

 

All in all from where we are now with the current owners having zero rope to play with from the EFL, zero goodwill left with Wednesdayite's, and the club only hanging together due to the dedication and professionalism of the staff. Then maybe in 7-10 years, on the basis of investing c£106m, there would be the possibility of emerging in the same way that Leicester did and the new owners might be looking at a £300m-£500m valuation. 

 

So reasonable terms of a deal right now would be to agree to sell the club for £1, conditional on evidencing the funding to fund the £30m in losses mentioned above, and granting an option to the buyer to buy the stadium and training ground for £37m at any point with an annual rental of £1.8m (5% return on the £37m) until the acquisition is triggered. 

 

Absent finding a credible buyer who would step up to the above I would favour the approach that Brentford and Swansea took of community ownership, with an executive team being appointed made up of ex-Wednesday football people, with local authority backing on the property side, and a commitment in the shareholders agreement and the articles to onboard financial investors in due course.

 

This would also require the club to build by way of selling some of its talent for profits each year and absent onboarding financial investors in due course could result in a longer time-frame to being established in the Premier League.

 

This second scenario being something that Chansiri spoke of as an exit plan in one of the forums if he was no longer going to support the club and no credible buyer was forthcoming. 

 

If administration occurs then on the threat of liquidation the current owners mighty be looking at 20p in the pound on the £37m.

 

Which would take the deal back to the level where Mandric and his partners bought the club by leveraging a £6m loan and forward financing season tickets and other revenue streams....

 

 

 

 

Great summary.

 

Any prospective buyers will also need to look at our infrastructure and facilities and factor in the cost bringing that up to PL level also, if PL football is the ultimate aim. Stadium and training ground upgrades could run into £10’s of millions.

 

Extremely deep pockets will be required and a willingness to basically write off a small fortune.

 

Sometimes a restoration project just needs too much work to be done to make viable to take on, especially when there are other projects out there for the same price that aren’t as broken. 

[Guest Mcguigan]

6 hours ago, Ian said:

Is the EFL license not a significant asset?

The golden share is worth about £8.5m in the Championship. Then it allows entry into the EFL competitions and a chance to increase income, so yes..I’d say it’s a significant asset.
 

Only maybe not as significant as you drop down the leagues.

[vulva]

5 hours ago, g-owls said:

You'd have to be a complete masochist to want to take the club on right now.

 

I mean, where on earth would you start?!

 

 

I’d argue it’s the best time ever to take the club over. If the price is right of course.