RETAINED LIST

[The coach]

4 hours ago, Royal_D said:

More chance of us signing Billy Sharp than there is George Hirst coming back to Hillsborough

Billy sharp would be a great signing

[legendaryswan]

17 minutes ago, Pulcinella said:

Leicester

Huge difference between acquiring teenage talent to go on loan to further their careers and re signing a player that will be 27 next season

[Lawrie’s Left Peg]

4 hours ago, Pulcinella said:

Exactly this. Moore has been very good in the transfer market.

I think Moore has had mixed results is more accurate IMO

Brown, Gibson, Corbeneau, Wing, Shodipo, Berahino, Kamberi, NML & Sow were flops. 
Byers, Dean, BPF were ok
Gregory, Johnson, Storey were a success

[Pulcinella]

Moore had to almost rebuild the whole squad - of course some wouldn’t work out as well as others, but he also had his successes.

 

Scroll back to the first years of Chansiri, that first summer was completely awesome - amazing signings. Thereafter the success diminished to almost zero with players like Jones and Abdi supposedly bolstering the squad but turning out to be duffers.

 

Moore brought us the best transfer window since that first summer.

[Pulcinella]

24 minutes ago, legendaryswan said:

Huge difference between acquiring teenage talent to go on loan to further their careers and re signing a player that will be 27 next season

Of course you’re right. But in my clumsy attempt to find a logic in signing Wildsmith it would be that we think he’d either be a worthy backup or have a decent sell on fee. Either way, I’m expecting Dawson to be ahead of him as a back up at least at the beginning of the season - due to his success at Exeter. Therefore, seeing as Dawson has hopefully improved with a year long loan, the sensible thing would be to see how well Wildsmith would progress on loan, then next summer decide which one to keep.

[legendaryswan]

Just now, Pulcinella said:

Of course you’re right. But in my clumsy attempt to find a logic in signing Wildsmith it would be that we think he’d either be a worthy backup or have a decent sell on fee. Either way, I’m expecting Dawson to be ahead of him as a back up at least at the beginning of the season - due to his success at Exeter. Therefore, seeing as Dawson has hopefully improved with a year long loan, the sensible thing would be to see how well Wildsmith would progress on loan, then next summer decide which one to keep.

I reckon theyl bring in a new keeper, Dawson will play 2nd fiddle, league cup, pizza trophy, JW has played barely any 1st team football for too long at his age.

If I were him, Id seek pastures new, it worked for Dawson, its no good sitting on a bench everyweek if youve got any ambition, and he has, he wants to be 1st choice, wherever that maybe be it Rochdale Harrogate or wherever, and rebuild his career, Dawson will leave when his contract expires and Render will step in as no2

[Jim]

Giving Dawson a chance as No 1 is too much of a gamble. He hasn’t got the temperament to be first choice here. Once he drops that first b*ll**k and he will, the crowd will be on his back straight away and that’ll be him done.

 

Wildsmith is too far behind the game to be a better choice either.

 

Moore needs to pull off a similar loan to BPF. He got it right in this dept. before. He has to again or else we won’t be where most on here will expect us to be.

[beswetherick]

2 hours ago, The coach said:

Billy sharp would be a great signing

Would rather lick mi own arris 

[legendaryswan]

24 minutes ago, Jim said:

Giving Dawson a chance as No 1 is too much of a gamble. He hasn’t got the temperament to be first choice here. Once he drops that first b*ll**k and he will, the crowd will be on his back straight away and that’ll be him done.

 

Wildsmith is too far behind the game to be a better choice either.

 

Moore needs to pull off a similar loan to BPF. He got it right in this dept. before. He has to again or else we won’t be where most on here will expect us to be.

They wont loan in another keeper, could go for the lad at shrewsbury whose done well and bring in some proper defenders, no more stop gaps, too many defensive mistakes, you cant keep leaking goals at set pieces and have desires on a title, we need a sound base to give the rest a licence to attack, move Iorfa back to RB get rid of Hunt, and get some REAL defenders in, solid base thats where all champions are built.

[Johnny Fantham]

14 hours ago, Tamworthowl said:

I don’t think we need to put a timescale on it at all. We just tell the players that whilst they’re looking at alternative clubs, we’re looking at alternative players. If we find, and sign, an alternative player, then we withdraw the offer. No point burning bridges if we don’t have to. What we shouldn’t do, is sit twiddling our thumbs waiting for a response from those we’ve given an offer before we approach those alternatives.

Just checked EFL regulations. A contract offer to a player whose old contract has just expired remains open for a month, then it can be withdrawn. 

Edited May 22, 2022 by Johnny Fantham

[kristmace]

11 hours ago, Lawrie’s Left Peg said:

I think Moore has had mixed results is more accurate IMO

Brown, Gibson, Corbeneau, Wing, Shodipo, Berahino, Kamberi, NML & Sow were flops. 
Byers, Dean, BPF were ok
Gregory, Johnson, Storey were a success

 

I think you're being really harsh on Darren Moore here. 

 

I'd say Byers, Dean and BPF were much better than "ok". NML, Berahino were ok.

 

Wing and Shodipo were both good signings based on last seasons performances but just didn't perform for us. Moore deserves very little blame here. 

Corbeanu was one of our better players in the first half of the season. After we switched formations, he didn't fit in as much and was moved on. 

Gibson was excellent when he played but unfortunately had a bad season for injuries. Again, not Moore's fault. 

 

Sow, Kamberi and Brown have been disappointing and didn't work out. 

 

What we have seen is that Moore can find and then attract the type of quality players we need. I was also really impressed with how he did in January. Pivoting halfway through the season and bringing exactly what we needed in. 

[victorturner]

11 hours ago, Lawrie’s Left Peg said:

I think Moore has had mixed results is more accurate IMO

Brown, Gibson, Corbeneau, Wing, Shodipo, Berahino, Kamberi, NML & Sow were flops. 
Byers, Dean, BPF were ok
Gregory, Johnson, Storey were a success

Agree with nearly all this.
 

 But N M-L looked good except when played out of position.

 

Berahino improved and began to score. He suffered away at Sunderland because our midfield was stifled. Agree with the three under “success”. 

Main problem was acquiring too many players to be able to build a team. Hence chopping and changing for much of the season made worse by extra players joining in the winter who expected to play.

 

Getting NM-L in while Byers was coming through and Longuo getting fit to play, meant that Dele-Bak and Adeniran ( unfit much of the time admittedly) could not get into a team revolving around Bannan when we already had wing backs playing on the flanks.

 

Berahino, Paterson and Windass ( admittedly unfit till late on) were fighting for the right to play with Gregory who had constantly changing partners.
 

At one time we had seven centre backs on the books although maybe six in fact as Iorfa mainly unfit although he did feature , but we sometimes preferred to play Palmer there when he isn’t a centre back. Brennan disappeared after briefly starring. Dunkley in and out .
Hutchinson seemed first choice and never left out so why no contract renewal? Baffling. 

 

Too much choice and Berahino suffered from that …not picked after scoring a hat trick. Must have knocked  his confidence. 

[hughdowdisgod]

I'd keep Hutch, get him his coaching badges (if he hasn't already got them) and put him on the staff. What youngster wouldn't be inspired by his back story? Just don't give him the caretakers job and ruin him like Bullen!

[Worksop Wednesday]

Initially surprised about Hutch and Bera but.....

Hutch probably wants the the central role in a 3 or the right side role in a 2, and probably not gonna get either, also think there may still be some of the Hutch v Manager personality clash at play so DM prefer not have him around  moaning and influencing  others and his injury record means he cant be first choice CB

Bera wont fit into a 4-2-3 -1, he's not a No. 10 and him and LG dont offer enough physicality as a 2

 

Plus we cant keep everyone as will restrict what DM can bring in 

NML can be part of 4-2-3-1 and is a good impact sub but may get better offer 

Wildsmith is cheap back up option as per this season so why not  carry on same 

Hunt is worth another year , but may get better offer

Luongo ? he will know himself how fit he is and what he can and cant do, he knows he'll get hammered if he accepts and get injured again so suspect he will be off to save face for all of us 

 

  

[TomtheOwl95]

3 hours ago, victorturner said:

Too much choice and Berahino suffered from that …not picked after scoring a hat trick. Must have knocked  his confidence. 

He played the next game in which he didn't play well.

 

We need to stop this narrative that Moore dropped him after the Cambridge game, he didn't.

[Lawrie’s Left Peg]

3 hours ago, kristmace said:

 

I think you're being really harsh on Darren Moore here. 

 

I'd say Byers, Dean and BPF were much better than "ok". NML, Berahino were ok.

 

Wing and Shodipo were both good signings based on last seasons performances but just didn't perform for us. Moore deserves very little blame here. 

Corbeanu was one of our better players in the first half of the season. After we switched formations, he didn't fit in as much and was moved on. 

Gibson was excellent when he played but unfortunately had a bad season for injuries. Again, not Moore's fault. 

 

Sow, Kamberi and Brown have been disappointing and didn't work out. 

 

What we have seen is that Moore can find and then attract the type of quality players we need. I was also really impressed with how he did in January. Pivoting halfway through the season and bringing exactly what we needed in. 

Someone else made a very good point earlier in the thread. We should appraise what actually happens rather than what potentially could happen or what we hope might happen. 
For example Dean came with a big reputation and potential to improve is. In reality he played 7 games including the defeat to Rotherham and home tie to Sunderland. I genuinely don’t see how that than be judged better than ok. 
Wing and Shodipo should have been good signings but were flops because they were inconsistent, made no significant contribution and hardly played. 
Berihino scored less than 1 in 4 and rarely started. 
I don’t mean to be harsh on DM but the reality is that his transfer business based on actual performances and outcomes was mixed. 

[Tewkesbury]

Players who came in and had an extended run in their favoured position did OK.

 

Players who got chopped and changed didn't.

 

It's that simple.

[TomtheOwl95]

20 minutes ago, Lawrie’s Left Peg said:

Someone else made a very good point earlier in the thread. We should appraise what actually happens rather than what potentially could happen or what we hope might happen. 
For example Dean came with a big reputation and potential to improve is. In reality he played 7 games including the defeat to Rotherham and home tie to Sunderland. I genuinely don’t see how that than be judged better than ok. 
Wing and Shodipo should have been good signings but were flops because they were inconsistent, made no significant contribution and hardly played. 
Berihino scored less than 1 in 4 and rarely started. 
I don’t mean to be harsh on DM but the reality is that his transfer business based on actual performances and outcomes was mixed. 

Dean didn't play against Rotherham.

[victorturner]

1 hour ago, TomtheOwl95 said:

He played the next game in which he didn't play well.

 

We need to stop this narrative that Moore dropped him after the Cambridge game, he didn't.

Sorry if that was a slip.
Was the next match vs Gillingham away? Not a match suited to him. Strong non football playing side who put in lots of physical effort . 

A bit like so many of our players who are good at home. Our style and fragility is suited to home matches where we play the mediocre off the park. Our midfield in particular. 

 

 Bit like Rhodes at Forest away under Monk, we had a striker brimming with confidence, a key ingredient,  after a hat trick , and acted as if we could not believe it and he slipped out of being in the first pick after one game where he was indifferent. 
At one stage we were trying N M-L upfront instead.

[victorturner]

10 minutes ago, victorturner said:

Sorry if that was a slip.
Was the next match vs Gillingham away? Not a match suited to him. Strong non football playing side who put in lots of physical effort . 

A bit like so many of our players who are good at home. Our style and fragility is suited to home matches where we play the mediocre off the park. Our midfield in particular. 

 

 Bit like Rhodes at Forest away under Monk, we had a striker brimming with confidence, a key ingredient,  after a hat trick , and acted as if we could not believe it and he slipped out of being in the first pick after one game where he was indifferent. 
At one stage we were trying N M-L upfront instead.

Looks as if he was substituted after an hour in the next match vs Accrington at home then brought on as a sub in the next after that away to Gillingham….I think!