Monks gone?

[Owls Loyal]

That is a very worrying form table of Championship teams since Xmas posted by hirtsyboy wonder.

 

It is truly frightening and hardly down to the loss of Fletcher for some games as Monk should surely have been able to pick up more than 9 points out of a possible 42 avaialble.  Also Fletcher started in the 3-1 defeat to Derby County and the 5-0 defeat away at Brentford.

 

Meanwhile DJ Mortimer posted the following:

 

A change of manager can of course bring about the kind of change desired, but most of the time it doesn't for long because it fails to address at least some of the foundational causes. And in our case at the moment, I think that is most certainly true.

 

Well the tone of that sounds very definitive as did DJ Mortimer's defence of Luhukay right up until the end of his time at SWFC.

[@owlstalk]

 

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

[dorian gray]

18 hours ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

You can't be so reliant on one player to get you results - that's not the sign of an effective manager. Yes Fletcher has been very effective for us, even more so this season and was a big loss but other managers have had to cope without him at times since he has been here. Also, the form started to dip when he was still in the side and has not improved that much since he returned, especially defensively. 

 

We were 3rd at Christmas and Monk deserved praise for the effective way in which we had played to that point. Since then however this is where we stand:

 

 

 

he has a totally unbalanced squad, built to square pass the ball for an age inside it's own half before crossing the half way line, it has an abundance of strikers on the books, by numerous times our most expensive, yet ONLY ONE of them is any good. 

any manager would have been under pressure when losing that single striker for such an extended period, let alone one who appears to have a rebellion on his hands, and works for a club who has brought players in, and not released them causing them to be walled in by a straightjacket of financial constraints, it's a perfect storm.

yet some foolishly think this club if it gets shut of him is going to attract some kind of messiah, to the point that sam allardyce has been mentioned.  

[Philb125]

Is there no way to change the title of this thread @OWLSTALK? 
 

I see it every day and think wow then realise it’s just a poor thread title that’s inaccurate and doesn’t represent the topic within. 

[Pulsar]

20 hours ago, daleblue said:

 

 I say give Monk a chance.

 

 

 

I wish his surname was Peace.

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

1 hour ago, @owlstalk said:

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

 

This is the question I keep coming back to as well.

 

For a team who were third in the table at the halfway point to completely and utterly collapse in the manner we did is almost beyond comprehension.

[pazowl55]

1 hour ago, @owlstalk said:

 

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

Had xmas off didnt they this season. That or that's about the time we found out we were definitely losing points and the players give up.  Watch the EFL postpone or suspended the charge now and we come out and win 5 out of 6 when football returns.

Edited April 1, 2020 by pazowl55

[gurujuan]

Never rated Monk as a manager, but even he should have been competent enough to keep this side upper mid table at least. Even Bullen would have achieved that. All that was needed, was to carry on the approach under Bruce, and not rock the boat. He could then, gradually introduce his own ideas, and even bring in a few of his own players. The trouble is, as is his want, he did rock the boat, and that’s when our form collapsed. It’s a moot point whether the squad is particularly unbalanced. Yes there are areas that need improving, but that would be true of most squads. 

Edited April 1, 2020 by gurujuan

[room0035]

2 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

 

He forgot to do the secret Santa at the staff party, all the players had great gifts but Monk decide not to buy anything for his pick Westwood and it all kick off from there.

 

Its like when you watch these nightmare neighbours programs and everything is good until a small thing like the bin is put in the wrong place or the dog poos on their lawn and before you know it they are fighting and wanting to kill each other.

 

I bet when monk looks back now he wishes he had bought Westwood something from the Owls store online Xmas deal be it the 150th Yr top trumps, the play off final t-shirts or a swfc jigsaw. 

[airborne_rat_of_s6]

22 hours ago, daleblue said:

 I have always given the benefit of doubt to someone / something that has not had the best outcome after a short time, if the resources are not up to standard.

 

 I would prefer to see what progress  he can make after making his own signings in the next transfer window.

 this would also give him next Season with players he has chosen to make a statement of intent.

 

 I really don't want him to be sacked just to bring in,

 

 A) another foreign bloke who has no idea of the Championship.

 B) Out of work has been.

 C) Young upcoming Manager who finds himself out of his depth.

 

 I say give Monk a chance.

 

 

Can’t see us under FFP having the means to make any decent new signings, irrespective of who is manager. Real mess

[daleblue]

16 minutes ago, airborne_rat_of_s6 said:

Can’t see us under FFP having the means to make any decent new signings, irrespective of who is manager. Real mess

 

I agree, just hoping that one day like the scrubbers over the road, we fall on a set of players and Manager that just come together,

and don't cost the earth.

[airborne_rat_of_s6]

22 minutes ago, daleblue said:

 

I agree, just hoping that one day like the scrubbers over the road, we fall on a set of players and Manager that just come together,

and don't cost the earth.

Agree. Thought Bruce and then Monk would be the men to lead us back to victorious ways. Whilst we haven’t really impressed (aside from Leeds away) at any point under Monk, we did for a time have a winning mentality. Love to know what happened at xmas. Interesting how players such as Dawson were offered contracts whilst it appears most others were not. Something more decisive afoot and this is beyond Monk’s managerial stance of backing, then slating then backing his players.

[Guest LondonOwl313]

8 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

I think the bigger question is how were we third at Xmas because we didn't look at all like a team chasing promotion, we played like a mid table side in the first half of the season but came out on top in a lot of scrappy games. I know they say it evens itself out and you finish where you deserve, thats why its so surprising we were third after playing everyone. The football on display was significantly worse than the play off seasons.

 

Then it's a number of things... Fletcher injury for a start, plus excluding two of our best players, then loss of confidence by the rest of the team, poor run of results and further loss of confidence, feeling that the season was over with a points deduction looming anyway. Plus on top Monk told lots of them they had no future with 20 games still to play.

 

Monk and his bad man management is a large factor

[Guest]

Just now, LondonOwl313 said:

I think the bigger question is how were we third at Xmas because we didn't look at all like a team chasing promotion, we played like a mid table side in the first half of the season but came out on top in a lot of scrappy games. I know they say it evens itself out and you finish where you deserve, thats why its so surprising we were third after playing everyone. The football on display was significantly worse than the play off seasons.

 

Then it's a number of things... Fletcher injury for a start, plus excluding two of our best players, then loss of confidence by the rest of the team, poor run of results and further loss of confidence, feeling that the season was over with a points deduction looming anyway. Plus on top Monk told lots of them they had no future with 20 games still to play.

 

Monk and his bad man management is a large factor

2 of best players if westwood didnt drop as many testicles we would of been top at xmas .stop living in past westwood was good but not be same for a good while

[Guest LondonOwl313]

2 minutes ago, dan1980 said:

2 of best players if westwood didnt drop as many testicles we would of been top at xmas .stop living in past westwood was good but not be same for a good while

Still miles better than Dawson who lets in 2-3 goals a game with the exception of a 6 game spell just before Xmas, never been championship standard. Westwood was back to his best end of 2018-2019 so its likely he was just on a poor run of form

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Still miles better than Dawson who lets in 2-3 goals a game with the exception of a 6 game spell just before Xmas, never been championship standard. Westwood was back to his best end of 2018-2019 so its likely he was just on a poor run of form

This season westwood cost us as many points as dawso.im not trying to make dawson sound like a world beater but westwood is not the answer 

[Hougoumont]

16 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

I think the bigger question is how were we third at Xmas because we didn't look at all like a team chasing promotion, we played like a mid table side in the first half of the season but came out on top in a lot of scrappy games. I know they say it evens itself out and you finish where you deserve, thats why its so surprising we were third after playing everyone. The football on display was significantly worse than the play off seasons.

 

Then it's a number of things... Fletcher injury for a start, plus excluding two of our best players, then loss of confidence by the rest of the team, poor run of results and further loss of confidence, feeling that the season was over with a points deduction looming anyway. Plus on top Monk told lots of them they had no future with 20 games still to play.

 

Monk and his bad man management is a large factor

 

Unfücking believable...Do you honestly think that???

[Guest LondonOwl313]

1 hour ago, Hougoumont said:

 

Unfücking believable...Do you honestly think that???

He said it in the post match presser after the Hull game I think it was.. so yeah 

[83owl]

1 hour ago, Hougoumont said:

 

Unfücking believable...Do you honestly think that???

Owlstalk posters - Why hasnt Penney signed a new contract yet? There’s only 6 months left and we are in danger of losing him on a free.

 

Owlstalk posters - I can’t believe monk told the players whose contracts are expiring in 6 months that their contracts won’t be renewed. That’s bad man management telling them that.

 

 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

What actually happened over the Christmas period to trigger such an almighty collapse?

 

Cant be Monk...

 

Of course it can't all be down to Monk but he is the manager and it is his responsibility to manage the team and part of that involves dealing with whatever is thrown at him and whatever may happen behind the scenes that has an effect on the team.

 

It is clear that he hasn't been able to adequately deal with whatever happened in that respect and the pattern of results generally is following what happened in a few of his other jobs, all of which ended after a year or so after initial promise.

 

10 hours ago, dorian gray said:

he has a totally unbalanced squad, built to square pass the ball for an age inside it's own half before crossing the half way line, it has an abundance of strikers on the books, by numerous times our most expensive, yet ONLY ONE of them is any good. 

any manager would have been under pressure when losing that single striker for such an extended period, let alone one who appears to have a rebellion on his hands, and works for a club who has brought players in, and not released them causing them to be walled in by a straightjacket of financial constraints, it's a perfect storm.

yet some foolishly think this club if it gets shut of him is going to attract some kind of messiah, to the point that sam allardyce has been mentioned.  

 

The squad is unbalanced but the financial constraints are nothing new and we have brought in a few new players over the past year or so. Monk knew what he was walking into and others have managed to get some results out of this squad without relying solely on Steven Fletcher.

 

If the season does get finished it looks probable that we could well finish bottom of the table for results over the second half of the season, a complete collapse that the manager has to take significant responsibility for but you think it is understandable that we are performing far worse than every team in the division baar Hull because Fletcher has been injured.

 

What difference did Fletcher make when we were 3-0 down at half-time in the last 2 matches?