beloved_aunt Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Hope we stick with the diamond at Fulham. I can't be the only one who thinks we've played better with this shape than a flat midfield 4. I think it allows us to get the best out of more of our best midfielders and play them all in their natural positions. Hutchinson/Jones both best when sitting in front of the back four breaking up play and passing it simple. Lee/Bannan both get to play in the middle and go box-2-box knowing they've got protection behind (Wallace is having to fill their at the moment but I think Lee will make a big diff when he comes back) Abdi (or I can imagine Hooper, FF, Boyd all doing the same) gets to play in the hole and make play close to the strikers It also means we can play two up front and have our full backs overlap. Have we, almost by accident, stumbled across a new playing formula and will CC keep it at Fulham? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 It was glaringly obvious in the first half that the diamond has its flaws. No width what so ever. In the second half, it got better because we on top on forced the issue and started with a bit of tempo in the middle that it brought their wingers infield which afforded Reach (who actually looked like a footballer for 45 minutes) a lot of space on the left. Thankfully we kept giving him the ball and with the amount of time he was afforded, even Adam Reach could put a decent ball in. We looked alot better for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 First half you could say was a diamond. 2nd half was definitely more of a 433. Carlos has used this a few times now, and we've looked much better on every occasion. I really like it. It gives us bodies in midfield and the width comes from fullbacks and forwards. And how much better did Bannan look last night without the responsibility of trying to dictate the game from a deep central position? Praying that Carlos sticks with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwlofOliveGrove Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Having 3 strikers on the field forced the issue for me. Loved watching it. Problem is how vulnerable it leaves us at the back. Given better opposition we might have shot ourselves in the foot...but I'd still rather watch that than what we we saw this season up to the 45min mark last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Whichever formation we play will have its advantages and disadvantages. The Diamond worked well I thought against Chesterfield and in patches versus QPR. Ironically it didn't do us quite as much good last night against a team playing a 'standard' 4-4-2. Last night was a bit of an anomaly as most opposition don't play 4-4-2. They come with 5 in the middle. I think starting against that with a Diamond will give us a platform most weeks. I think the big plus point was that we changed it subtly from the Diamond to a 4-3-3 second half giving us control of centre midfield but also giving us width. Some might not have noticed the forwards making very dofferent movement on the second period to the first and a a chap near me out tje improvment down to "they've probably had a right b0llocking" Anyway It's. .......that sort of tactical flexibility and in game management that will really help us get results over the season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pazowl55 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 16 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said: Hope we stick with the diamond at Fulham. I can't be the only one who thinks we've played better with this shape than a flat midfield 4. I think it allows us to get the best out of more of our best midfielders and play them all in their natural positions. Hutchinson/Jones both best when sitting in front of the back four breaking up play and passing it simple. Lee/Bannan both get to play in the middle and go box-2-box knowing they've got protection behind (Wallace is having to fill their at the moment but I think Lee will make a big diff when he comes back) Abdi (or I can imagine Hooper, FF, Boyd all doing the same) gets to play in the hole and make play close to the strikers It also means we can play two up front and have our full backs overlap. Have we, almost by accident, stumbled across a new playing formula and will CC keep it at Fulham? Dont think we have stumbled on it by accident. Carlos deserves a bit of credit as it must be something he has been working on. He also said Boyd can't play in this formation and there will be times that we will play 4-4-2. Which has me thinking Fulham maybe one of them. If he plays 4-4-2 then fine. But he must have Bannan on the left as it's the key to this whole new way of playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southie_Owl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 4-3-3 has to be the way, especially when we have a player like FF that would love playing on the left of the front 3. And Bannan can play left side of the midfield 3 Reach and Hunt need to be the full backs to provide the width. Hopefully we have now improved the centre backs area. Anyone just needs to watch Southampton or Liverpool play to see how 433 can be effective in attacking football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greengrass Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Everyone loves a diamond, especially women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgmetcalf Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Um nope, but I'd still play Hooper in the hole behind the front 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elyowl1 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 On another day Sunderland could have scored more and Hooper had a hatrick , certainly more enjoyable than last season to watch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieB Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 45 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: First half you could say was a diamond. 2nd half was definitely more of a 433. Carlos has used this a few times now, and we've looked much better on every occasion. I really like it. It gives us bodies in midfield and the width comes from fullbacks and forwards. And how much better did Bannan look last night without the responsibility of trying to dictate the game from a deep central position? Praying that Carlos sticks with it. Agree, really like the 4-3-3 formation and hopes Carlos sticks with it at home especially. I do think the diamond could still be very useful but preferably away from home on tighter pitches (QPR, Fulham etc). I think our pitch at Hillsborough is too wide to play the diamond without leaving us so exposed out wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlZfan84 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 If we go down to Fulham and play the diamond/4-3-3 we'll get absolutely mullered. They've too much pace in their team. I think he'll revert back to a 4-4-2 on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briggowl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Could FF even be considered in the AMC position? Probably his ideal place, along with Abdi, Mattias and Hooper doesn't look too shabby there either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch McLovin Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 I think it has its advantages and disadvantages. Advantage gets the best out of Bannan and we can play 3 strikers as we have loads. Disadvantage is very vulnerable at the back our wingers don't really fit and Jordan Rhodes won't score in this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southie_Owl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 13 minutes ago, owlZfan84 said: If we go down to Fulham and play the diamond/4-3-3 we'll get absolutely mullered. They've too much pace in their team. I think he'll revert back to a 4-4-2 on Saturday. 4-4-2 didn't work out too well at Preston. I think if we line up like that at Fulham we can expect another 1-0 or 2-0 defeat I'd rather we go to Fulham and have a go and make them worried about our attack too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pazowl55 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 We will definitely take the game to Fulham I feel. But have to be wary of the counter attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wednesday_Jack Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 The diamond as a glaring weakness IMO...our ability to win the second ball is terrible. The gap between the Jones and the top of the diamond is to big and gives lots of space for oppositions midfield. When it works its effective but it does need a little tweaking to make us a little more solid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southie_Owl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 14 minutes ago, pazowl55 said: We will definitely take the game to Fulham I feel. But have to be wary of the counter attacks. I hope so, most likely we will start out in the usual deep lying 442, go a goal or two down in the first half. Then change it to 433 second half and get a goal back but it will be too late Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred mciver Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 That diamond needs a better base such as Bridcutt or another muscle man as midfield holder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ever the pessimist Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Not averse to the diamond formation, however it is ridiculous that we are sill seemingly scratching about the best formation(s). I also think that with Fulham's pace out wide it may not be the ideal time to play so narrow - unless we think that their crossing is poor enough for us to let them have possession out wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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