bigthinrob Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 6 hours ago, 83owl said: So it’s monks fault we didn’t get any points from the game because he didn’t get sent to the stands. Brilliant. Come on fair's fair. It's obvious what Ronio was getting at. We are way too accommodating to offences against us, We are becoming a soft touch & I said last night it is starting to cost us. I find it absolutely amazing that none of the players (or manager) reacted to what was basically GBH on Palmer. Our game management afterwards wasn't great either. The ref would have been clearly conscious of his fu*k up. In the following ten minutes the ball should have been all around their penalty area with us looking for a penalty & constantly in the ref's ear. To be honest, a bit of old fashioned retribution on Hoillet wouldn't have gone amiss either. It would have been extremely difficult for the ref to have given us a red shortly after letting him off. (Yeah ok, haven't totally convinced myself of that with their track records)!!!! And it would have kept the crowd involved that were already incensed at the challenge & decision. Either way, we just let it go, they then proceeded to lay down at every opportunity to take the sting out of it & we let them. I said last night, teams are gaining massive territorial advantage by falling down in key areas of the field (Stoke obvious example) & we just can't seem to do it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 hours ago, bigthinrob said: Come on fair's fair. It's obvious what Ronio was getting at. We are way too accommodating to offences against us, We are becoming a soft touch & I said last night it is starting to cost us. I find it absolutely amazing that none of the players (or manager) reacted to what was basically GBH on Palmer. Our game management afterwards wasn't great either. The ref would have been clearly conscious of his fu*k up. In the following ten minutes the ball should have been all around their penalty area with us looking for a penalty & constantly in the ref's ear. To be honest, a bit of old fashioned retribution on Hoillet wouldn't have gone amiss either. It would have been extremely difficult for the ref to have given us a red shortly after letting him off. (Yeah ok, haven't totally convinced myself of that with their track records)!!!! And it would have kept the crowd involved that were already incensed at the challenge & decision. Either way, we just let it go, they then proceeded to lay down at every opportunity to take the sting out of it & we let them. I said last night, teams are gaining massive territorial advantage by falling down in key areas of the field (Stoke obvious example) & we just can't seem to do it. Gamesmanship. Or cheating and being horrible as we used to call it. Sadly the game has moved on from the days of Corinthian spirit and we seem to have been left behind a bit. For a long time now we seem to have not had any players as a group with a nasty streak. We don't want thugs and leg breakers of course but we do need players who will try and influence games, influence referees, and make coming here a Germany horrible experience for the opposition. It's about mentality and personality really isn't it. We've got a lot of nice guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigthinrob Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said: Gamesmanship. Or cheating and being horrible as we used to call it. Sadly the game has moved on from the days of Corinthian spirit and we seem to have been left behind a bit. For a long time now we seem to have not had any players as a group with a nasty streak. We don't want thugs and leg breakers of course but we do need players who will try and influence games, influence referees, and make coming here a Germany horrible experience for the opposition. It's about mentality and personality really isn't it. We've got a lot of nice guys. What always amazes me, is that we are the epitome of fair play, not arguing, not feigning injury. We are the nice guys of football & often end up with more yellows than the Millwall's, Cardiff's, Derby's etc etc etc. It's unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted December 30, 2019 Author Share Posted December 30, 2019 14 minutes ago, bigthinrob said: What always amazes me, is that we are the epitome of fair play, not arguing, not feigning injury. We are the nice guys of football & often end up with more yellows than the Millwall's, Cardiff's, Derby's etc etc etc. It's unbelievable. Clough used to say he was proud his players never went off alarming or haranguing refs...and that in doing so his team got more respect from referees. That might have been so back in the day when refs were refs. These ego driven narcissistic cowards of the modern era are more bothered about not upsetting famous people it seems to me. Sadly. It's time we started the same routines ad other do. It's been proven, sadly really, to work. This image to me always sums up "effecting the coutcome" An absolute classic example there. There are loads though. Refs are human. (Just) They can and will be influenced. Some teams always come to mind. Even the beautiful Barcelona. Not averse to the ten man ref surround. And Manchester United of course, especially under old red nose. Any Pulis team. It's rife isn't it. Every league in every country in the world. I'm afraid old Clough will be turning in his grave and the number of teams who have turned into Leeds Uniteds. .. But that's how it is. Being nice and respectful gets you bugger all these days. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronio Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 hours ago, bigthinrob said: Come on fair's fair. It's obvious what Ronio was getting at. We are way too accommodating to offences against us, We are becoming a soft touch & I said last night it is starting to cost us. I find it absolutely amazing that none of the players (or manager) reacted to what was basically GBH on Palmer. Our game management afterwards wasn't great either. The ref would have been clearly conscious of his fu*k up. In the following ten minutes the ball should have been all around their penalty area with us looking for a penalty & constantly in the ref's ear. To be honest, a bit of old fashioned retribution on Hoillet wouldn't have gone amiss either. It would have been extremely difficult for the ref to have given us a red shortly after letting him off. (Yeah ok, haven't totally convinced myself of that with their track records)!!!! And it would have kept the crowd involved that were already incensed at the challenge & decision. Either way, we just let it go, they then proceeded to lay down at every opportunity to take the sting out of it & we let them. I said last night, teams are gaining massive territorial advantage by falling down in key areas of the field (Stoke obvious example) & we just can't seem to do it. Well, at least some posters get what I was saying. As you say, we are too accommodating to offences against us. Seen a fair few instances of this happening this season especially with obvious penalties, which we never really moan about immediately after the incident. I thought as Monk was a defender himself, he knows what a proper tackle is and should be and what could be considered a leg breaker. Watching the game yesterday, I expected some kind of reaction from the manager immediately after the tackle went in, it may have rallied the players and in turn the fans. Could very well have been a different scoreline had they been reduced to 10 men. A key moment in the game which we failed to capitalise on. The top managers with a nasty streak, would have been all over that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigthinrob Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Lord Snooty said: Clough used to say he was proud his players never went off alarming or haranguing refs...and that in doing so his team got more respect from referees. That might have been so back in the day when refs were refs. These ego driven narcissistic cowards of the modern era are more bothered about not upsetting famous people it seems to me. Sadly. It's time we started the same routines ad other do. It's been proven, sadly really, to work. This image to me always sums up "effecting the coutcome" An absolute classic example there. There are loads though. Refs are human. (Just) They can and will be influenced. Some teams always come to mind. Even the beautiful Barcelona. Not averse to the ten man ref surround. And Manchester United of course, especially under old red nose. Any Pulis team. It's rife isn't it. Every league in every country in the world. I'm afraid old Clough will be turning in his grave and the number of teams who have turned into Leeds Uniteds. .. But that's how it is. Being nice and respectful gets you bugger all these days. They say a picture paints a thousand words. These examples sum it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Wonk Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 12 hours ago, nevthelodgemoorowl said: Never seen the centre of the South Stand all go up in outrage together before. The referees have a little cosy private club where the pay is excellent and in the main better performing newer younger applicants on merit are NOT encouraged ! The only time I’ve seen such outrage on the south stand was the infamous NO BOVRIL debacle a few seasons ago... i literally witnessed 2 octogenarians squaring up to each other...to say the atmosphere was volatile is putting it mildly! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owl 44 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) Cardiff fans were arguing on Twitter that Harris should have had a red card instead of a yellow. What the feck were they watching? I didn't even think it was a yellow card. Edited December 30, 2019 by Owl 44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulva Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Lad for Derby has just got sent off for an almost identical tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigblueowl Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Harris gets a yellow for being pushed from behind by a Cardiff player into another Cardiff player! A Cardiff player gets a yellow for an extremely late dangerous tackle that could of easily been a broken ankle! Bizarre! I would love to see the refs notes afterwards! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigthinrob Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 16 minutes ago, vulva said: Lad for Derby has just got sent off for an almost identical tackle. I think it would be a red 19 times out of twenty, as would Dawson's challenge on FF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigthinrob Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Bigblueowl said: Harris gets a yellow for being pushed from behind by a Cardiff player into another Cardiff player! A Cardiff player gets a yellow for an extremely late dangerous tackle that could of easily been a broken ankle! Bizarre! I would love to see the refs notes afterwards! "As in the Forestieri incident with Dawson I was clearly vindicated in my decision making". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toooldforthis Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Law 12 SERIOUS FOUL PLAY A tackle or challenge that endangers the safety of an opponent or uses excessive force or brutality must be sanctioned as serious foul play. Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play. It doesn't even say that contact has to be made... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bouncing Owl Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Anyone got a video of it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wexowl Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 I suppose " if you can't beat them join them " mentality seems to be necessary" dog eating dog" etc. Would it was different. Recently V Bristol City Loungo booked for perceived trip on young substitute who actually stumbled himself no contact from our player. The honest thing to have done ,particularly when ref was reaching for card was for him to own up and say" ref he didn't touch me I just fell". I suppose it will never happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumboldowl Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 9 hours ago, fpowl said: I just think the referees should have to become accountable for there decisions and have to justify them every game pre and post managers and players are interviewed I think if you interview the referee after the game they would be less likely to make such howlers also VAR is not the answer especially in the current format we’ve seen it’s ruining the premier league how about the referees have 1 hour after the final whistle to review the big decisions obviously they won’t be able to overturn goals as they change the result but they can overturn the red card/ no red card decisions before submitting their reports they can then stand there like managers and players a like and be interviewed I’m getting a little fed up of these so called officials being told it’s a hard job and they need better protecting all that’s happening is they are given licence to make poor decisions then hide behind how difficult it is or the game is ruined is getting slowed down and ruined by that VAR nonsense which asks the questions what on earth is the point of the linesman in the premier league needs a massive review All that you say here is absolutely correct. The trouble is that it has been said many, many times before, but nothing has ever been done about. The mighty EFL are too busy with other things rather than putting their own house in order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modboy Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Fans didn't really get involved either to influence the ref. Possibly due to our players deciding they'd rather have a drink of water instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowl Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 12 hours ago, alanharper said: Just the 28 yellow cards in the last 8 seasons, Neil. https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/junior-hoilett/leistungsdatendetails/spieler/58993 Hutch gets that in a season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Tibbs Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 11 hours ago, swinners said: "you'd have to ask the referee", thing is though, no one ever does, do they? They always get away Scott free from stuff like this. Who asks them? When I used to ref at Concorde or Graves Park, if I made an unpopular decision (and I didn’t need VARs help), the protagonists would greet me after the game. Sometimes, it took a while, but eventually it all calmed down. People appreciate honesty and a two way conversation. I made mistakes, just because I only had one pair of eyes. That cup game in Chezzio tho, thought I was gunna get lynched... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrie Madden Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 19 hours ago, vulva said: Lad for Derby has just got sent off for an almost identical tackle. Just been chatting with my Brother ( he's a paramedic and was working the game Sunday and was on the South Stand side right at the side of the dugouts ) Robinson didn't see the tackle clearly and asked the 4th official for advice. The 4th official said to Robinson that he thought Palmer was making the most of it when he was smacking the ground with his hand whilst down Robinson asked which colour card the 4th official said "definitely yellow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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