Goalscorers

[Holmowl]

37 minutes ago, OwlinOldham said:

 

Might be a bit controversial in saying this but I think Bannan is maybe part of the problem. 

For me the only way he can play is if its a 5 man midfield and he has 2 box to box players either side of him in the middle. We dont have that and we cannot accommodate the luxury of a deep lying play maker right now. 

As good as he is, I would consider leaving him out for a few games and seeing if a combo of the other CMs can get us playing further up the pitch and see if this makes a difference.

Is he deep-lying? 
 

If he is, what on Earth does that make Hutch? He’s often our deepest man.

[Guest]

We look like this when Hutch and Bannan play.

 

                     GK

             CB CM CM CB

RB                                        LB

            massive hole 

RW                                       LW

                   ST ST

Edited January 2, 2020 by Guest

[S36 OWL]

11 minutes ago, Emerson Thome said:

 

Apart from Mitrovic, Fletcher is as good or better than all of those. The problem is at full back and on the flanks.

 

Also the midfield and other forwards need to chip in with more goals.

 

Bamford = 10 league goals, rest of Leeds = 33 goals

Austin = 8 league goals, rest of West Brom = 40 goals

 

Grabban = 14 goals, rest of Forest = 20 goals

Watkins = 17 goals, rest of Brentford = 24 goals

Mitrovic = 18 goals, rest of Fulham = 22 goals

Fletcher = 12 goals, rest of Wednesday = 25 goals

 

You can see the clear gulf between the top top and the chasing pack in these numbers.

 

Take away Fletcher and the rest of our strikers have managed Seven goals between them all season. 

 

That is why we are nowhere near being a top six team. 

[OwlinOldham]

2 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

Is he deep-lying? 
 

If he is, what on Earth does that make Hutch? He’s often our deepest man.

 

I would say he is, he drops deep at almost every chance and usually tries to dictate play from inside our own half. 

As for Hutch, hes clearly a CB shoehorned into the Defensive midfield roll. He should be part of the back line in a 3-5-2 along with Borner and Iorfa. Lees is good but not as good or comfy with the ball as them 3 are.

[N0rtherner]

42 minutes ago, Mr Farrell said:

Rather have 2 full backs.

 

25 years of shiite ones wears you down.

 

Get two of those to overlap wingers and deliver quality crosses to our current strikers and I firmly believe our strikers will be scoring more.

We can't keep asking to sign more strikers when we play hoofball from back 8-9 to the top 1-2.

[N0rtherner]

14 minutes ago, GerOwl said:

We look like this when Hutch and Bannan play.

 

                     GK

             CB CM CM CB

RB                                        LB

            massive hole 

RW                                       LW

                   ST ST

 

It's funny because it's true!

[Bigblueowl]

22 minutes ago, Emerson Thome said:

 

Apart from Mitrovic, Fletcher is as good or better than all of those. The problem is at full back and on the flanks.

 

Also the midfield and other forwards need to chip in with more goals.

 

Bamford = 10 league goals, rest of Leeds = 33 goals

Austin = 8 league goals, rest of West Brom = 40 goals

 

Grabban = 14 goals, rest of Forest = 20 goals

Watkins = 17 goals, rest of Brentford = 24 goals

Mitrovic = 18 goals, rest of Fulham = 22 goals

Fletcher = 12 goals, rest of Wednesday = 25 goals

 

You can see the clear gulf between the top top and the chasing pack in these numbers.

This. 

Bannan, Reach, Luongo, Harris, Murphy should be hitting between 4-6 a season 

Hutch, Lees, Borner 2-4 a season the rest none attackers 1 or 2 each. 

The rest down to the forwards!!!!

It's so apparent we have not replaced the kieren Lee of old who popped up the box and got five or six a season with us until his injury! Luongo possibly has this in him! 

[trev]

44 minutes ago, Mr Farrell said:

Rather have 2 full backs.

 

25 years of shiite ones wears you down.

Yup.

 

When we had the lad on loan from Newcastle you could see the difference having a proper footballer as a full back made. 

 

Shame he got injured.

 

But whilst we have Palmer and Fox we won't go anywhere. They don't have the attacking ability or mindset to support our wingers properly. Which means our wingers get outnumbered constantly.

 

Sure they can be decent at defending (Fox has improved), they just don't provide enough offensively.

 

Both look incredibly uncomfortable on the ball it's scary.

 

2 good footballing full backs would also give more options to our midfield and allow the whole team to move up the pitch. I don't think our midfielders trust Palmer or Fox and I don't blame them.

 

 

[OwlinOldham]

38 minutes ago, GerOwl said:

We look like this when Hutch and Bannan play.

 

                     GK

             CB CM CM CB

RB                                        LB

            massive hole 

RW                                       LW

                   ST ST

 

Literally this . The space between midfield and strikers is crazy at times. 

 

This has to have such an impact on the quality of chances created for the front 2. 

[Guest LittleG]

1 hour ago, mcmigo said:

Rhodes and Winnall have no place in our squad and should be sold or paid up for the sake of their careers and the club. 
Nuhiu is worth retaining as a sub option as he is such a wild card of a player. He is useful to bring on to retain a lead, or to throw the ball into the box for if we need a goal. I agree that he has lost form recently and therefore should not be starting.

we should try a couple of forward players from the stiffs against Brighton . Borukov and maybe the kid Damba who was in the programme v Cardiff, and start blooding one from the bench over rest of this season. That leaves the need to recruit one more striker.

 

If we want to move forward then all three (Rhodes, Winnall, Nuhiu) need to go; none of them are good enough, even for 10 mins.

[Guest LittleG]

1 hour ago, OwlinOldham said:

 

Think hes a phenomenal player and one of the best we have had for a long time. However, whilst hes playing deep like he does (for whatever the reasons), the forwards are likely going to suffer more than they would if he was in the final third playing the clever and quick passes we know he has in his locker. I do think when we play Borner and Iorfa at CB they actually push us up the pitch with their comfort on the ball. They also like to bring the ball out unlike Lees so Maybe this is the answer to getting Bannan further up the pitch? 

Agree him and Hutch play too deep; perhaps the manager might intervene and tell Bannan to play further forward. 

[Inspector Lestrade]

1 hour ago, OwlinOldham said:

no point having a goal scorer if the service they are provided with is below par.

Im firmly starting the believe that our goals problem is more than just not having the right forwards and more to do with the midfield supply to them. 

There are numerous threads on here about how the middle 2 play too deep and if you think about it, this is likely a big reason why our forwards dont score so many.

Imagine how many more goals Fletchers clever play and movement would have got him if the balls played in to him were 5 yard through balls and clever cut backs. Instead its all 30 yard wonder balls in to him because the midfield is playing alongside the defence. 

Not saying its likely but a more positive midfield might also bring on one or two of the other strikers we have too. Winnall for example was a machine at this level whilst Hourihane was high up in the middle of the park supplying him. 

 

How about the attackers start taking responsibility and start to attack, Winnall put himself about to some degree but the ballboys put in more effort than Nuhiu and Rhodes.  None of them picked the ball up in midfield and ran with it with any conviction.  The only way our attack will improve is by replacing them.

[Luke]

People keep blaming the strikers

While ever Hutchinson and bannan are playing ,we could have aguero and vardy upfront and we wouldn't get promoted 

 

 

[Jim]

Fletcher has been reasonably consistent throughout his time here. This season is one of the best of his career.

 

Nuhiu is a marmite type of player. He has his strengths but also has his weaknesses. He’s not really good enough to be starting games on a regular basis.

 

Winnall has lost his way, simple as that. The only way he’ll get his career moving is if he gets a move elsewhere. It’s questionable whether he’ll get that before the end of the season.

 

Rhodes was on a downward spiral before he moved here. Confidence wise it was high at the start of the season due to the success of his loan at Norwich last time out. Unfortunately Bullen didn’t grasp this early doors and by and large it’s been another waste of a season so far for him and for us. We need to move him on this month or just partner him with Fletcher as often as possible between now and the end of the season.

 

Forestieri will probably stay for the rest of the season and most likely will have his moments but he’ll probably be on his way in the summer?

 

As for the debate with regards to Bannan. He’s arguably our best player. There’s pluses and minuses to how we use him but it would be madness to drop him. That said I wouldn’t be surprised if another club came in for him this month. If so then the club have a massive decision to make.

[OwlinOldham]

9 minutes ago, Inspector Lestrade said:

 

How about the attackers start taking responsibility and start to attack, Winnall put himself about to some degree but the ballboys put in more effort than Nuhiu and Rhodes.  None of them picked the ball up in midfield and ran with it with any conviction.  The only way our attack will improve is by replacing them.

 

Its a catch 22 though. Without support from the middle of the park, the attackers are left isolated against the oppositions back 4. Even worse, they have to come deep for the ball before turning the then try and attack. 

I know they have legs, but neither Rhodes or Nuhiu is ever going to drive forward from midfield at any sort of pace to make even a slight difference.

However, ff you say fill the middle of the park with midfielders (crazy i know), the forwards dont then have to come and get the ball and maybe they could then stand a better chance of attacking from the edge of the box rather than from just over halfway. 

I get what your saying but you first need steady and reliable supply before you can get goals from any forward. Middle of the park for us is a black hole and it must be having an effect on the numbers of real chances the guys up front are getting. 

[Inspector Lestrade]

1 minute ago, OwlinOldham said:

 

Its a catch 22 though. Without support from the middle of the park, the attackers are left isolated against the oppositions back 4. Even worse, they have to come deep for the ball before turning the then try and attack. 

I know they have legs, but neither Rhodes or Nuhiu is ever going to drive forward from midfield at any sort of pace to make even a slight difference.

However, ff you say fill the middle of the park with midfielders (crazy i know), the forwards dont then have to come and get the ball and maybe they could then stand a better chance of attacking from the edge of the box rather than from just over halfway. 

I get what your saying but you first need steady and reliable supply before you can get goals from any forward. Middle of the park for us is a black hole and it must be having an effect on the numbers of real chances the guys up front are getting. 

 

And that's why they need to go unless the ball is put on a plate for them then are infectual, the ball has been in around the area in the last three games for them to conjure up a little bit of magic. But nothing is offered by them.  

 

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

I do accept that they are here for the duration and won't be replaced wholesale. My only hope is that we can get FF back from injury and he gets back  to something like his best (not holding my breath) and that Fletcher maintains his form and we manage to get lucky with a loan signing.

 

The Three Stooges need to be forgotten about.   

[Bleeder]

1 hour ago, Holmowl said:

Is he deep-lying? 
 

If he is, what on Earth does that make Hutch? He’s often our deepest man.

 

....and therein lies the problem.

[ohgoditsjames]

For the entire time that we’ve had Rhodes we have NEVER consistently put proper crosses in and then we wonder why our strikers don’t score. We might put one or 2 decent crosses in per game but that simply isn’t good enough. 
 

We either try to walk it into the back of the net or lump it upfield from defence/goal keeper. 
 

We give the opposition far too much time to get back into their own box and block us.
 

We could have Ronaldo and Shearer and we still wouldn’t score.

Edited January 2, 2020 by ohgoditsjames

[adelphi1867]

3 hours ago, Tony Pulis said:

All the best teams at this level have a top quality striker:

Leeds - Bamford

West Brom - Austin

Forest - Grabban

Brentford - Watkins

Fulham - Mitrovic

If we seriously want to compete for a Top 6 spot this season, we need to sign a striker in January. It baffles me that although we have 5 strikers at the club, we only have 1 who is competent at this level (Fletcher). We should look to move on the other 4 as soon as possible, as they are just dead wood sat there collecting dust. As has been suggested before, Brewster, Nketiah and Adams will be available on loan this window, however competition will be stiff for them. Therefore, some targets that are a bit more realistic may be Isaac Success (loan), Shane Long (loan) or Conor Chaplin (permanent). Either way, whatever happens this window, we must keep hold of Fletcher, Iorfa and Bannan, if we want any chance.

No Sh*t Sherlock.

[JOCOWl]

4 hours ago, mcmigo said:

Rhodes and Winnall have no place in our squad and should be sold or paid up for the sake of their careers and the club. 
Nuhiu is worth retaining as a sub option as he is such a wild card of a player. He is useful to bring on to retain a lead, or to throw the ball into the box for if we need a goal. I agree that he has lost form recently and therefore should not be starting.

we should try a couple of forward players from the stiffs against Brighton . Borukov and maybe the kid Damba who was in the programme v Cardiff, and start blooding one from the bench over rest of this season. That leaves the need to recruit one more striker.

 

Can't agree in maintaining nuhui just so he can be a sub and play 10 mins here and there. As another poster put on a few days ago, if they're not deemed good enough to start in an eleven then offload them.....Or offer them a deal that reflects being a 10 min a week player. I can't remember him winning 1 header or holding up the ball once yesterday. Winnall won more and he's a foot shorter.