HirstWhoScoredIt Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 (edited) I went last night and the first thing I would say is that Wednesday did everything that could be expected. Played with tempo, attacked and scored goals. However, we were playing against extremely poor opposition. They stood off us in midfield and they were woeful in both full back positions. So definitely, lets not carried away. The diamond is an interesting option for us though. Too many of our players are not suited to 4-4-2. Reach doesn't offer enough going forward for a wide midfielder yet doesn't appear a good enough defender to be an orthodox full back. Hunt is happier attacking than defending. Hutch leaves his midfield partner too isolated. Forestieri seems more suited to playing deeper but apparently prefers playing central. Abdi can't nail down a role that suits him. Carlos apparently prefers even his wide midfielders to be fluid, interchange and come inside. Preferring possession over penetration by getting behind the full backs. Certainly Wallace, Boyd and Matias seem likely to be happier in a more fluid formation. Therefore we can argue over 3-4-3, 3-5-2, 4-3-3, 4-2-3-1 etc etc but it seems clear that Wednesday have players that appear likely to be more suited to a more fluid formation than 4-4-2. With the sheer amount (and quality)of strikers we have, I always believed Carlos was unlikely to move to a formation that only played one of them. Since settling on 4-4-2 Carlos has stuck to it resolutely, therefore maybe 3-5-2 is too much of a leap of faith. Furthermore, the diamond is very similar to 3-5-2 when used properly. Therefore, maybe the diamond is the answer. Hutch can truly protect the back four enabling the full backs to bomb on. Hutch plays so deep, it will effectively be a back three at times. Jones is a more than capable deputy for the "anchor" role. Bannan, Lee, Abdi, Wallace and Boyd all appear to be more than capable of being the sides to the diamond. Boyd, Abdi, Mathias and Forestieri (and even Hooper) are all capable of being the point of the diamond. It seems to suit the fluid interchange of midfielders demanded by Carlos far more than than 4-4-2. The likes of Lee, Bannan, Boyd and Wallace all have the work rate to afford the full backs protection when defending. my one doubt is still left back, no matter which formation we play. I am not convinced about Pudil when faced with a decent winger, nor am I convinced he has the legs required to continuously bomb forward in this formation. I am also not convinced that when we are under pressure, Reach is good enough defensively. Interesting to see if Carlos is brave enough to persist with this on Saturday. Edited August 9, 2017 by HirstWhoScoredIt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 The main drawback of the formation is that it lacks width. As we don't have that anyway, despite playing with two wingers, it's not an issue for us Might be worth trying it out for a few games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beloved_aunt Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I have often thought that playing the diamond would get the best out of several of our midfield players. Hutchinson/Jones can sit deep protect the defence and play to their strengths. Lee/Bannan can both play centrally where they want to and have the freedom to attack knowing theres a guy sitting behind Abdi/Forestieri can pull strings in the hole And we still get to play two of our many strikers up front. Only problem is what do you do with Wallace/Boyd/Reach/Matias? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earlsfieldowl Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 10 hours ago, Lord Snooty said: Always thought Wallace would be excellent off a front pairing given half a chance. But agree that Fernando will always get picked. That's how it is. Where is Boyd fitting in this scheme? He will shoehorn FF in somehow - for me it has to be on the left. If someone else has to drop out so be it - CC has to start being more pragmatic. As for Boyd, I agree...wonder if CC has even considered it, or just sees him as another player to chose when the faves get injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 43 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said: I have often thought that playing the diamond would get the best out of several of our midfield players. Hutchinson/Jones can sit deep protect the defence and play to their strengths. Lee/Bannan can both play centrally where they want to and have the freedom to attack knowing theres a guy sitting behind Abdi/Forestieri can pull strings in the hole And we still get to play two of our many strikers up front. Only problem is what do you do with Wallace/Boyd/Reach/Matias? Matias could be a useful impact sub, and the others could potentially be used as part of the diamond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 8 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said: I have often thought that playing the diamond would get the best out of several of our midfield players. Hutchinson/Jones can sit deep protect the defence and play to their strengths. Lee/Bannan can both play centrally where they want to and have the freedom to attack knowing theres a guy sitting behind Abdi/Forestieri can pull strings in the hole And we still get to play two of our many strikers up front. Only problem is what do you do with Wallace/Boyd/Reach/Matias? Reach as attacking fullback against lesser side. Boyd and Wallace both capable of playing one of the tucked in side roles of the Diamond. Both probably capable of playing in the hole too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beloved_aunt Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Just now, Lord Snooty said: Reach as attacking fullback against lesser side. Boyd and Wallace both capable of playing one of the tucked in side roles of the Diamond. Both probably capable of playing in the hole too. Probably true, I think Boyd generally played at 10 for Peterborough so he could probably do that position. And we'll always need impact subs and diff options for diff games. I'd give this system a run for a couple of weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheffield_dave Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 FINALLY Regarding width, our continued failure to sign a fast "traditional" winger has actually done us a favour in terms of switching to a diamond midfield. I'm yet to see any evidence that Reach or Matias are top class wingers in a flat 4, and I believe both Wallace and Boyd have the work ethic and attributes to play more centrally. The benefit of having Abdi or FF sat behind a front pairing from Hooper/Rhodes/Fletcher/Winnall VASTLY outweighs the "cost" of losing our "wingers". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coopswfc76 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I thought we looked very good with a diamond but think we need a CB with a bit of pace who can pass a ball urgently if were to change our style of play. On Saturday I'd use Lees and Hutch at CB purely as they are quicker and better ball carries than Loovens unfortunately though that means leaving our best defender out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 I don't see how it will work any differently to how we currently play. Unless we really commit to playing whoever is at the tip of the diamond, as an attacking player. And I can't see Carlos going for that. When the opposition has the ball I'm sure we'll end up as flat a 442 as you can see to prevent Hutch/Jones being outnumbered. And what about width? Everyone moans about a lack of quality coming in to the box from wide areas. With this we'd see even less. For me the main problem is simply having too many strikers. We're forced to play with 2 and it hampers the rest of the side. I'd love to see Carlos sacrifice a striker, play wide attackers who wouldn't have to get back and defend as much due to not relying on our fullbacks to attack so much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coopswfc76 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: I don't see how it will work any differently to how we currently play. Unless we really commit to playing whoever is at the tip of the diamond, as an attacking player. And I can't see Carlos going for that. When the opposition has the ball I'm sure we'll end up as flat a 442 as you can see to prevent Hutch/Jones being outnumbered. And what about width? Everyone moans about a lack of quality coming in to the box from wide areas. With this we'd see even less. For me the main problem is simply having too many strikers. We're forced to play with 2 and it hampers the rest of the side. I'd love to see Carlos sacrifice a striker, play wide attackers who wouldn't have to get back and defend as much due to not relying on our fullbacks to attack so much. Did you go last night? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Just now, coopswfc76 said: Did you go last night? No mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EcclesallOwl Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 4-1-2-1-2 is the perfect formation for us at the minute 3-5-2 when we have the ball with Hutchinson dropping in to make a back 3, with Hunt & Reach providing the width which works well as they're both better going forward than they are defensively Forestieri in behind the strikers Perfect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WC1Owl Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 There was a game last season where we switched to a diamond and it worked really well. Buggered if I can remember which one, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WC1Owl Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Heh, swear filter doesn't mind buggered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coopswfc76 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: No mate. We got loads of crosses in last night from Hunt and Reach mainly so was a massive improvement on previous games for that. Will it work in Championship well there's only 1 way to find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Think tank Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Would definitely be a better shape for us. I bet we resort to the usual on Saturday, hopefully not though! Still think 4-2-3-1 would suit us much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueOwl Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 If we do play the diamond again I hope we see Abdi at the tip for the first half and Fernando for the second as Abdi needs minutes for fitness and Fernando will inject some energy into our late attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveyboy66 Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 It will be interesting to find out if we can switch to this mid game because if we can then we have a perfect plan for most away games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Fessi Posted August 9, 2017 Share Posted August 9, 2017 Very excited to see if we could play the diamond vs better opposition, Hunt/Reach both naturally get forward a lot so we wouldn't struggle for width, Wallace & Bannan would be tricky when they drift out or come inside - creates so much space for FF to do his magic in the middle and pull the stings. Plus we get to see arguably our best striking combination upfront together. Westwood Hunt Lees Loovens Reach Jones Wallace Bannan FF Hooper Fletcher Plenty of attacking options on the bench to mix it up, Boyd / Wallace, Abdi / FF, Rhodes / Fletcher, Winnall / Hooper, Lee / Bannan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now