Holmowl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 4 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: Who plays out of position? Bannan's played maybe half his career as a left sided midfielder. Abdi played a considerable number of PL games as a wide midfielder. Abdi and Bannan are better in CM than wide. Reach, Boyd, Wallace and Nando are better wide than Bannan and Abdi. Nando is better wide than striker. Hooper, Fletcher and Rhodes are better strikers than Nando. So I think posters saying that we play too many out of position is very fair. imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimisticowl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 4-4-2 is simply a base formation, can you imagine Carlos stopping Fessi from going walk about? Hutchinson has a good football brain and can be trusted to break formation as and when it benefits the team, let's not get into a Wilkinson Wednesday boring ex schoolteacher syndrome. Trevor Francis wouldn't even have questioned Chris Waddle if he suddenly decided to switch wings, I appreciate that we don't have anyone of his quality, but we are a division lower and have to try to capitalise on the superiority of our squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 25 minutes ago, Costello 77 said: Perhaps the coach is describing the way he got round injuries to major players last season...And now he's got a full set to pick from, he can play a more expansive game? Yes, hopefully that will be the case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earlsfieldowl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 14 hours ago, Blue and white said: Last season we saw 2 versions of the 442 formation. The first was the turgid, unbalanced, poor footballing team that won games against lesser teams with God awful football, players played out of position and shoehorning was the common practice. The second was a balanced team, beat some of the best teams in the league, played good football, took us to 4th in the league and top of the form table for the second half of the season. When we play it right we play it very well. We played better when CC was forced to make changes...that purple patch towards the end of the season saw us play some good cohesive footy. But his first choice was pretty much the lineup that faced Huddersfield at home in the playoffs..and we all know how that ultimately worked out. Fine for 442 in principle - but CC has to select the right players in the right positions for it to really work properly. Will/can he do it this time round? We will soon see.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adelphi1867 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 It's nowt to do with formations, more to do with having good enough players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Wicket Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 hours ago, Holmowl said: I think we have some absolutely terrific players. Top drawer. Really exciting. I loved watching them in 15/16. Couldn't wait to take my seat. We added even better players, in Fletch, Abdi, Reach and Rhodes and yet our style of football got utterly depressing. Release the shackles and we we can look forward to wonderful players playing wonderful football. Release the shackles! That is the problem as I see it, I look back at last season we seemed to playing a safety first attitude that was almost a throw back to an Italian side of the 60s, we do have very good player right throughout the squad at this level. Seems Carlos likes to start cautious and then open up later in the game. Nothing wrong with it but I would like to see us do it the other way around and batter the opposition from the start get a lead and then manage the game out when it's late on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indoor Owl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 2 minutes ago, Jakes Grandad said: Release the shackles! That is the problem as I see it, I look back at last season we seemed to playing a safety first attitude that was almost a throw back to an Italian side of the 60s, we do have very good player right throughout the squad at this level. Seems Carlos likes to start cautious and then open up later in the game. Nothing wrong with it but I would like to see us do it the other way around and batter the opposition from the start get a lead and then manage the game out when it's late on. It's not Italian so much as it is Portuguese (kind of): Mourinho drew up the blueprint - negative football is bobbar to watch, but it can and does win games. We'll be more attacking than last year I think, but I'll be very surprised if we see something that isn't cautious football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Wicket Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 5 minutes ago, Indoor Owl said: It's not Italian so much as it is Portuguese (kind of): Mourinho drew up the blueprint - negative football is bobbar to watch, but it can and does win games. We'll be more attacking than last year I think, but I'll be very surprised if we see something that isn't cautious football. Agreed, but you need really need a plan to bring about chances for the front men, something we did not have last year hence Rhodes poor scoring record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Holmowl said: Abdi and Bannan are better in CM than wide. Reach, Boyd, Wallace and Nando are better wide than Bannan and Abdi. Nando is better wide than striker. Hooper, Fletcher and Rhodes are better strikers than Nando. So I think posters saying that we play too many out of position is very fair. imo Forestieri is not out of position up top. Bannan is not out of position on the left side of midfield. All you have is an opinion on who's better suited in those positions. Edited July 14, 2017 by IstillhateSteveBould Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sMacLean Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 I think the bit about needing top class players to play with 3 at the back is fair enough. Carlos clearly feels we simply don't have the players to operate it and the financial cost to alter it must be too great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlandished Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Of course it could all just be Carlos is indulging in a bit of this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 34 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: Forestieri is not out of position up top. Bannan is not out of position on the left side of midfield. All you have is an opinion on who's better suited in those positions. Did you know that when Bannan plays on the right of midfield, we average more points per game than when he plays in any other position? Funny thing stats, aren't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 17 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: Did you know that when Bannan plays on the right of midfield, we average more points per game than when he plays in any other position? Funny thing stats, aren't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmowl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 56 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: Did you know that when Bannan plays on the right of midfield, we average more points per game than when he plays in any other position? Funny thing stats, aren't they? Ooh I like a challenge. Off to look that one up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmowl Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 59 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: Did you know that when Bannan plays on the right of midfield, we average more points per game than when he plays in any other position? Funny thing stats, aren't they? 2 minutes ago, Holmowl said: Ooh I like a challenge. Off to look that one up. Tease! Not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The only way is S6 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 hours ago, adelphi1867 said: It's nowt to do with formations, more to do with having good enough players. I think we had good enough players last season, but not all fit at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, Holmowl said: Tease! Not true. When Bannan starts... ...on the right of midfield: 1.78 points per game ...in the centre of midfield: 1.76 points per game. Which, if you happen to have a debilitating over-reliance on stats, leads to the inevitable conclusion that Carlos should start Bannan on the right of midfield in order to maximise our points tally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronio Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 9 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: When Bannan starts... ...on the right of midfield: 1.78 points per game ...in the centre of midfield: 1.76 points per game. Which, if you happen to have a debilitating over-reliance on stats, leads to the inevitable conclusion that Carlos should start Bannan on the right of midfield in order to maximise our points tally. Out of curiosity, what's the points tally per game with Baz on the left of midfield? As I'm sure that's where he has been the most influential for us imo. With how Carlos sets us up, Hutchinson tends to drop back sitting in front of the back four then allowing Baz, Lee and Wallace to form a midfield 3 whilst the fullbacks overlap and attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, Ronio said: Out of curiosity, what's the points tally per game with Baz on the left of midfield? As I'm sure that's where he has been the most influential for us imo. With how Carlos sets us up, Hutchinson tends to drop back sitting in front of the back four then allowing Baz, Lee and Wallace to form a midfield 3 whilst the fullbacks overlap and attack. We average 1.58 points per game with Bannan starting on the left of midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronio Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 Just now, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: We average 1.58 points per game with Bannan starting on the left of midfield. I knew the stats would not be so kind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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