Stevie May

[gurujuan]

i gotta be honest im happy with the strikers we have, we need one more to compete with Nuhiu

(cameron Jerome or Kenwyne jones type) but the 3 lads Bus May & Lavery have loadsa potential between them imo. yes 1 of the 3 might end up being a dud but 1 of the 3 may also go onto great things. its true that none are proven at this level yet and it would be a risk to go into the season hoping they come good. but the other side of the coin is binning them and they do a daryl Murphy or a Danny Ings, and become prolific all of a sudden.

 

Lavery or Bus have not had ANY TYPE of run up top yet, the odd game here an there, but often in lavs case as a loan striker. so we havent even seen these fail cos they aint had a chance yet!

yes you could say weve seen S May fail, but Lord snoots has made some excellent points on May earlier in the thread and i agree all the way - tbh though, weve seen May fail with No wingers and a non creative CM. 

lets say the ethos last season was the strikers muck out going back but no bu99er helps them out going forward, 

 

for me, if we play attacking football (MC philosophy?) and we have CREATIVE players and the team has a creative mindset, these 3 will be queing up to get in front of each other, 

 

or put another way, can people see Lavery, May & Bus all being major flops in a good team next season? ...no chance.

I admire your faith

[GY-owl.4]

Thanks. 

having seen 100s of other young players at other clubs evolve and improve over the years, its hard not to be excited about a trio of 22 year olds who have all already represented their respective countrys in certain forms, 2 of the 3 at first team level. 

i just hope that, unlike last season, we can get the supply line sorted.

 

it is a risk to let these three spearhead the attack, as none of them are the finished article, but thats the point when talking of getting rid init...

none. of. them. are. the. finished. article.

 

all that said, if the chairman wants to spend his money on someone who will usurp these 3 with his already obvious known quality, ace, happy days. even if he does will i want to bin off 3 players who havent shown me enough reason to bin them off yet? no way.

Edited June 28, 2015 by GY-owl.4

[IstillhateSteveBould]

If we attack and create enough for Stevie to manage 12 or 13, Attey would get to 20 on the basis of this season's performances.

#justsayin

At championship level, May's goals to minutes ratio is better than Atdhe's. Plus he has a history of scoring goals regularly.

#stoptalkingoutofyourarsegeorge

[GY-owl.4]

the whole striker debate on this site is comparing one to the other, dissing one player to big up the other, LOADSA posters do it, its like a disease, 

 

george, while defending Nuhiu batters May, posters retorts are slaggin Nuhius weaknesses against Mays strengths, and round and round it goes... the result, nearly everyone hates at least one of our strikers! its madness.

 

dont get me wrong, folk are entitled to not rate a player, i aint got a problem with that.. but i wonder if half the folk on ere have been backed into a corner because of past posts they have made trying to defend their personal favorite?  

yes our strikers have missed sitters......WHO DOESNT?  with age and experience comes consistency,

 

but a lot of the criticism of our strikers on here has been nothing short of pathetic. 

[Hawkeye]

At championship level, May's goals to minutes ratio is better than Atdhe's. Plus he has a history of scoring goals regularly.

#stoptalkingoutofyourarsegeorge

His championship minutes per goals is better, true. But there's not much to pick between them over all season. You are also comparing apples with oranges - they are both strikers, but very different types of strikers, that operate and play very differently to each other.

Mays big advantage is he's young, he was successful at two lower level clubs (one in Scotland division 2) and I'm sure he can make the step up. But he's supposed to be a goalscorer, but didn't look anywhere near like the player we were expecting.

I'll be unhappy if we rely on the same four strikers that didn't really do the business last year.

[Athelwulf]

Look at the number of goals scored by the promoted teams last season. Can our current lads get that many? Doubt it.

[GY-owl.4]

Look at the number of goals scored by the promoted teams last season. Can our current lads get that many? Doubt it.

if you mean all goals, well yeah the promoted teams had centre backs and midfielders scoring, plus a much better SUPPLY to their strike force.

 

but i assume you mean from the forwards of the promoted teams, and of course you would be right.... but a few important factors need to be taken into account... evolution of a young player going into a new season and improvement in the supply line for starters..

 

last season we all continued to hammer our strikers while accepting the supply was nothing like good enough (until their confidence was already shot)..

was one problem not starving the other?

 

 i fully understand that you doubt they will score as many as watfords front 3, so do i.. but you only doubted it, you didnt say they cant....... which is correct because we havent seen nothing like enough of Lavery (up top) & Bus to say they defo cant.

 

 

 

 

 if Lavery had played for a diff championship team this last 2 seasons, (say brum or cardiff) scored his 8(?) goals for the club over 2 injury hit yrs, (some great goals in there) and had his 2 loan spells (plymouth & chez) where he scored goals at both, not to mention making his (unofficial) debut for his country -   and we just signed him today... imo there would be a jizzfest on here, honest i do.

 

but because hes already ours and we got money now...MEH 

[Philb125]

If we have £5 million hypothetical pounds to spend, and blank spaces on the team sheet, not because the players are untested or maybe not good enough but because we have no players for that position.

Then the first spot I'd like money spent would be the blank spots. I'd also like the blank spots to be a player that was top 6 quality or the ability to be that within 2 years.

Overhauling every position in one transfer season is impossible, it's tough in the four remaining in this two year promotion plan, so replacing three young forwards to me in window one makes very little sense.

If we had to go out and buy those three again right now, from other clubs how much would we pay? Bear in mind how much a decent unproven at prem level left back has just cost.

To say we've seen enough to know they won't cut it rules out them improving (age on their side), support players improving (if rumours and players linked come off certainly looks better than last years) or the old adage of needing a full preseason and a bit of confidence.

Maybe just maybe one of them has 20 goals in them this season, if not I won't be calling for their heads as I imagine they'll get better even if they come up short. Take a look at Deeney first two championship seasons, Ings first one.... Pelle at Soton too, some players just need to be supported. Supported by the rest of team, their manager and hardest to imagine by their fans.

[modboy]

we have too many average strikers at the moment that we are going to struggle to recoup their outlay on hence why May out on loan would probably be our only financially sensible option.

 

We definitely need someone who can actually head a ball plus i would compliment that with a "been there, done it" experienced striker who can help teach the youngsters, no idea who though,

[james o connor]

People are quick to write off players but I'd give may another chance. Like others have pointed out Ings and deeney didn't set the world alight at first. And As I've repeatedly pointed out , all the half witted know it alls on here slagged off Afobe who is a better striker than our current crop put together. I think it's sometimes worth waiting and being a bit patient. Nuihu is as good as he's ever getting and yes it true so,e of the chances he misses are embarrassing. He does however bring something different to the fold and whilst I wouldn't want him as first choice striker, i think as an option he's quite useful

[owlse]

#bump

[Dagmeister]

At championship level, May's goals to minutes ratio is better than Atdhe's. Plus he has a history of scoring goals regularly.

#stoptalkingoutofyourarsegeorge

 

If you're going to massage cup goals out of your calculations surely there are the obligatory penalties, tap-ins and scuffed shots to be deducted also.

[nolan_swfc]

Bump

[Geörge Whitebread]

IshSB, we did the whole goals ratio thing to death during the season. You know as well as I do that Atdhe has better goals-to-games, goals-to-minutes, and goals-to-attempts ratios than Stevie.

You accuse me of #talkingoutofmyarse, but how am I wrong? Nuhiu scored 57% more goals than May. So if May scored 12.74 goals (12-13), assuming the same return/performances, as I said, Nuhiu would be on 20. #itsnotrocketscience

 

For some reason you Nuhiu-haterz appear to think that scoring against teams ABOVE Championship level shouldn't count, while goals against teams that will be playing at a lower level next season should. That's not because it makes Stevie look better and Attey look worse, by any chance, is it?

 

And Atdhe is a second/supporting forward that brings plenty more to the team, while our entire transfer kitty last summer was pished up the wall, based solely on Stevie's supposed goalscoring prowess. Stuart Gray has paid the ultimate price for that mistake!

 

If he can't score as many as the "worst player to ever pull on a Wednesday shirt" (according to some) it's probably fair to say that he's not exactly pulled up trees, and even fairer to say that it'd be good if he were replaced by someone better. How anyone could think any different is beyond me.  

 

If we're going to have any chance of promotion this season, we need a proper goal scorer. It's as simple as that. 

[IstillhateSteveBould]

IshSB, we did the whole goals ratio thing to death

This entire argument has been done to death. I won.

[Ronio]

the whole striker debate on this site is comparing one to the other, dissing one player to big up the other, LOADSA posters do it, its like a disease, 

 

george, while defending Nuhiu batters May, posters retorts are slaggin Nuhius weaknesses against Mays strengths, and round and round it goes... the result, nearly everyone hates at least one of our strikers! its madness.

 

dont get me wrong, folk are entitled to not rate a player, i aint got a problem with that.. but i wonder if half the folk on ere have been backed into a corner because of past posts they have made trying to defend their personal favorite?  

yes our strikers have missed sitters......WHO DOESNT?  with age and experience comes consistency,

 

but a lot of the criticism of our strikers on here has been nothing short of pathetic. 

Agreed.

 

i acutally think all our strikers are alright.  Each have their own strength and probably suit a specific style of play.  

 

Having said that, we will probably be looking to bring in another striker over the summer, either way, we do have lots of potential up front for once.

[Daavies;]

I know exactly what you mean.

Listen, I'm not here to try and defend the lad and make out he's something he's not. And there were chances last season which I would have expected him to finish that he didn't and had my head in my hands.

The snatched shot and trying too hard to leather it, often resulting in a soft miskick akin to a back-pass, I think is down to pressure (maybe pressure he put on himself I couldn't say) . But I think there was definitely a case of him trying too hard at times and not being relaxed.

The lads at Watford , i think anyone in the division would have liked in their side. There was a real pace and power about them, and I agree that May might not have fitted their mould and system.

But I look at a side like Bournemouth with their slick style, and the cute service from the like of Arter and Richie and I think may would have at minimum got double the tally he got for us.

I see Pitman was well into double figures and I don't think he's a great player. Good. Not great.

But for the sake of argument, I think if those players had done a direct swap I think that the goal tallies would have swapped.

I'm rambling now!

But I just think that with a progressive attack minded coach, some midfield players with a bit of cunning , guile and vision to their play then we'd see a much greater goal haul from all our forwards.

I don't want to hark to the past all the time, but I was once talking to Big Ron Atkinson when he was at Villa. He was talking about his love of strikers (He's worked with enough in his time) and he said the key , as far as he was concerned was to make sure that they were always the most relaxed players on the pitch.

Relaxed players score goals and they don't brick it.

Pressure does strange things and last season, (admittedly I only got to a handful of away games but all the home ones) and from where I was sat the paucity of our chances was so few and far between it was almost as if i could see the burden weight on their shoulders when one did come along.

It might well be that Nuhiu , May , Lavery , Bus and whoever else will soon be on their way to make way for better quality players.

If so then great there will be no complaints from me. I am desperate for us to do well.

But UNTIL we get in the better standard model i think it would be unwise of us to shift on a player who has cost the best part of a million pounds when we haven't really had the opportunity to let him develop and see what he might be actually capable before we have seen if he can fulfill whatever potential it is in him that Gray and Co saw.

How dare you put such a well thought out and brilliant comment on this board. Agree with absolutely everything.

[Buzz]

Don't let may go!...............We will regret it!

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

Agreed.

 

i acutally think all our strikers are alright.  Each have their own strength and probably suit a specific style of play.

 

Having said that, we will probably be looking to bring in another striker over the summer, either way, we do have lots of potential up front for once.

 

100%. One of the problems we had last season was that none of our strikers were well suited to the style of football we played.

 

Nuhiu looked by far the most comfortable, but the problem was that he did a lot of his good work miles away from the opposition's goal and often lacked the pace to get into the box in time to capitalise on the attacks he'd helped to build. May chased every ball, but he relies on service, and once he realised that wasn't forthcoming, he started to tense up and his finishing went awry. It felt like a lot of his energy went into defending from the front, when he would have been a much more potent attacking force if he could have played with a bit more selfishness. As for Lavery and Bus, neither got enough game time to make a judgement either way, really.

 

If we can get all of our strikers playing closer to the opposition's goal next season, they could cause teams many more problems than they did last time out. 

Edited June 29, 2015 by areNOTwhatTHEYseem

[Ronio]

100%. One of the problems we had last season was that none of our strikers were well suited to the style of football we played.

 

Nuhiu looked by far the most comfortable, but the problem was that he did a lot of his good work miles away from the opposition's goal and often lacked the pace to get into the box in time to capitalise on the attacks he'd helped to build. May chased every ball, but he relies on service, and once he realised that wasn't forthcoming, he started to tense up and his finishing went awry. It felt like a lot of his energy went into defending from the front, when he would have been a much more potent attacking force if he could have played with a bit more selfishness. As for Lavery and Bus, neither got enough game time to make a judgement either way, really.

 

If we can get all of our strikers playing closer to the opposition's goal next season, they could cause teams many more problems than they did last time out. 

I agree.  

 

The key for me is the supply.  Get some decent quality wingers who can make something happen and put in a decent cross, and we will probably see our strikers thrive and score a lot more goals, even if they are tap ins.  

 

You are right, a lot of the time our strikers had to pretty much create their own chances time and time again.  For once it would be nice for a winger to be pinging pin point balls into the box for our strikers to put away.  

 

Hopefully this will be rectified in the summer,