Official :6 English teams agree to Super League

[Bannofan]

Lot's of interesting debate on TalkSport again today, you can't miss Simon Jordan at the moment, he's right on the money at the moment.

 

He's asking what fans actually want these days?..to have success and see the best players in the world at your club you need these detached, mercenary billionaire business men, oligarchs and Middle Eastern crown families in charge of your club.

 

It's a good point..as a Sheffield Wednesday fan I'm not happy with our owner as it stands due to the dodginess and the ignorance of the footballing side of things.

 

Change that to us in the premier league and we are paying international superstars £350k a week - what's that got to do with Sheffield Wednesday?  Christ, I didn't identify with us when we were signing Chris Waddle, Des Walker, Andy Sinton, Petter Rudi, Wim Jonk  etc .

 

Whilst I want us to be good, I have never wanted to see  us in the Premier League, as we would either get hammered every week, or become a dumping ground for mercenary has been footballers who have never heard of Sheffield, never mind the actual club. 

 

At the play off final, I had a real maelstrom of emotions - I wanted us to beat Hull, but feared I would lose my club if we did.

 

Maybe I'm a sentimental old fool, but there are a lot of us about.

 

I wonder, though, if us sentimental fools are now completely outnumbered by a generation brought up on the Premier League and Champions League, and the need for success at any cost. 

[SiJ]

19 minutes ago, FreshOwl said:

what I didn’t like about the ESL was that it was a closed shop. This wouldn’t be that. I’d much rather see Celtic and rangers than Watford or Burnley 

So you are all for a certain type of elitism then.

[owl_83]

5 minutes ago, Bannofan said:

Lot's of interesting debate on TalkSport again today, you can't miss Simon Jordan at the moment, he's right on the money at the moment.

 

He's asking what fans actually want these days?..to have success and see the best players in the world at your club you need these detached, mercenary billionaire business men, oligarchs and Middle Eastern crown families in charge of your club.

 

It's a good point..as a Sheffield Wednesday fan I'm not happy with our owner as it stands due to the dodginess and the ignorance of the footballing side of things.

 

Change that to us in the premier league and we are paying international superstars £350k a week - what's that got to do with Sheffield Wednesday?  Christ, I didn't identify with us when we were signing Chris Waddle, Des Walker, Andy Sinton, Petter Rudi, Wim Jonk  etc .

 

Whilst I want us to be good, I have never wanted to see  us in the Premier League, as we would either get hammered every week, or become a dumping ground for mercenary has been footballers who have never heard of Sheffield, never mind the actual club. 

 

At the play off final, I had a real maelstrom of emotions - I wanted us to beat Hull, but feared I would lose my club if we did.

 

Maybe I'm a sentimental old fool, but there are a lot of us about.

 

I wonder, though, if us sentimental fools are now completely outnumbered by a generation brought up on the Premier League and Champions League, and the need for success at any cost. 

I was born in the 80's and I have seen us lift the League cup, qualify for Europe, finish in the Top 3 of the old 1st division, seen us have England Internationals in our team etc.

 

You know what memory I am most fond of? Visiting the likes of Yeovil and Colchester away, having a few pints, having a good day out with mates and having a laugh. I had an Owls Away Card in 2003-04 and so for the next couple of seasons I had priority for tickets and managed to go to ever match home and away for two seasons. I could afford it at the time and enjoyed it a lot. I can't afford to do that now but would love for those days to return.

 

If football swallowed itself up and we went back to the days of having 4 divisions of 24, I would not complain one little bit. Neither would I complain if it meant AFC Wednesday would have to form for some reason. It hurts that I struggle to afford home matches, never mind away matches and it hurts that so do a lot of fellow owls.

[FreshOwl]

2 minutes ago, SiJ said:

So you are all for a certain type of elitism then.

I just said it would be good to see them in the PL, the logistics of that I don’t know, you don’t have to deep it 

[SiJ]

3 minutes ago, FreshOwl said:

I just said it would be good to see them in the PL, the logistics of that I don’t know, you don’t have to deep it 

But it is the same thing, right?

 

It's why we find ourselves in a position where super leagues are a viable threat.

 

The fans only want to watch games between the top sides, no one else matters etc.

 

We all fall into the trap; we've been conditioned over the last two or so decades to think more and more like this. How many of us roll our eyes when Super Sunday involves Southampton or Burnley etc? 

 

[Guest LondonOwl313]

12 minutes ago, owl_83 said:

I was born in the 80's and I have seen us lift the League cup, qualify for Europe, finish in the Top 3 of the old 1st division, seen us have England Internationals in our team etc.

 

You know what memory I am most fond of? Visiting the likes of Yeovil and Colchester away, having a few pints, having a good day out with mates and having a laugh. I had an Owls Away Card in 2003-04 and so for the next couple of seasons I had priority for tickets and managed to go to ever match home and away for two seasons. I could afford it at the time and enjoyed it a lot. I can't afford to do that now but would love for those days to return.

 

If football swallowed itself up and we went back to the days of having 4 divisions of 24, I would not complain one little bit. Neither would I complain if it meant AFC Wednesday would have to form for some reason. It hurts that I struggle to afford home matches, never mind away matches and it hurts that so do a lot of fellow owls.

It’s funny but whenever anyone mentions when they enjoyed going to the games the most, they nearly always go for the time when they’re about 16-25. Lots of older owls say they enjoyed the 70s or 80s more than the 90s, it can’t be a football thing. It’s probably got something to do with having that independence, experiencing new things, going out with your mates before any responsibility. Was definitely easier doing an all day drinking session when that was the case  

[sonofbert2]

Whenever there is a major crisis companies/businesses seize the opportunity to do stuff they’ve been thinking about doing but probably wouldn’t, in normal times, get away with so easily.

 

I have a mate who is a flight captain with Virgin who also trained new pilots on a certain type of plane.  Following 911 they retired the whole fleet of that particular aircraft.

 

The European Super League has been coming for years.  The big clubs don’t need or want normal supporters.  They don’t spend enough and are more trouble than they are worth in comparison to worldwide TV rights, playing games abroad and sports tourist type fans.

 

The same managers and clubs who disrespect the FA and League Cup are quite happy to play to full houses in far flung countries in pre-season tournaments.  The template has been built by stealth for years.

 

This latest move was a powerplay.  There will eventually be Premier 1 and Premier 2 based on club size, fanbase and sustainability including both Rangers and Celtic which feeds into an enhanced version of the Champions League and everyone else will be left to die.

 

Been coming for years.

[Ronnie Starling]

I see that the pundits with their affiliated clubs are trying to talk down the punishments as it will punish the fans. These fans were quite happy to enjoy the successes of their owners decisions so they have to accept the punishment of poor decisions as we have had to with our points deduction.

[The only way is S6]

38 minutes ago, FreshOwl said:

what I didn’t like about the ESL was that it was a closed shop. This wouldn’t be that. I’d much rather see Celtic and rangers than Watford or Burnley 

Agree. If criteria is worldwide following which appears to be why serial failures Spurs were in there, Celtic & Rangers would walk into any league on that basis. 

[SiJ]

I hear a lot about how the European model isn't sustainable. That the only way to save it is through radical reform. 

 

If true, that's because it has been made that way through greed and avarice from the clubs and governing bodies.

 

 

 

 

[SiJ]

Just now, Ronnie Starling said:

I see that the pundits with their affiliated clubs are trying to talk down the punishments as it will punish the fans. These fans were quite happy to enjoy the successes of their owners decisions so they have to accept the punishment of poor decisions as we have had to with our points deduction.

That's because these pundits operate in a bubble.

 

Most of them probably don't even know about the amount of punishments dished out in the EFL.

 

In their minds, everything is back to *normal* and that's all that matters to them.

 

The utter guff span by media outlets regarding a great victory for the fans. They are either completely blinkered or intentionally being ignorant.

[owlinexile]

44 minutes ago, FreshOwl said:

what I didn’t like about the ESL was that it was a closed shop. This wouldn’t be that. I’d much rather see Celtic and rangers than Watford or Burnley 

 

I'm not sure Watford or Burnley fans would agree with you.

[sheffield_dave]

I'm torn on Celtic & Rangers. 

 

It comes from a similar place to the ESL stuff, yet I'm not opposed to it. Mainly because Celtic & Rangers being exposed to Premier League money would put a seriously massive cat amongst the stuffy elite pigeons, and I think it would be a laugh. As a passive viewer of the Premier League, it would become an overnight more interesting league to me with them in it.

 

I also think the merging of some leagues across Europe isn't a terrible idea and in some ways is both practical and to be expected. I recall some legitimate talk recently of the Belgium and Dutch leagues merging? 

 

The ESL was an awful idea but widespread and quite drastic reforms to the game are due. I'm open to them despite being hugely apposed to the ESL. The current model isn't working and hasn't been for years. The "normal" that people think they fought for and won this week still stinks. 

[Guest LondonOwl313]

4 minutes ago, sonofbert2 said:

Whenever there is a major crisis companies/businesses seize the opportunity to do stuff they’ve been thinking about doing but probably wouldn’t, in normal times, get away with so easily.

 

I have a mate who is a flight captain with Virgin who also trained new pilots on a certain type of plane.  Following 911 they retired the whole fleet of that particular aircraft.

 

The European Super League has been coming for years.  The big clubs don’t need or want normal supporters.  They don’t spend enough and are more trouble than they are worth in comparison to worldwide TV rights, playing games abroad and sports tourist type fans.

 

The same managers and clubs who disrespect the FA and League Cup are quite happy to play to full houses in far flung countries in pre-season tournaments.  The template has been built by stealth for years.

 

This latest move was a powerplay.  There will eventually be Premier 1 and Premier 2 based on club size, fanbase and sustainability including both Rangers and Celtic which feeds into an enhanced version of the Champions League and everyone else will be left to die.

 

Been coming for years.

Having a premier league 2 instead of the Championship would be quite good. Would make it more competitive as parachute payments could go, and then have PL2/Championship clubs write it in to contracts that wages have to be reduced on relegation to league 1. No cliff edge between PL and Championship.. makes more sense for there to be one between championship and league 1 if anything.

 

Would basically create a two tier football league but that’s probably right given about half the clubs are a decent size and the other half are smaller town clubs.

 

They could then also reduce the number of teams in the top league down to 18 and the second tier down to 20. So the money gets split fewer ways. It’s inevitable these big clubs will want to play more European games so that would help free up time for that, and then an expanded Champions League.

[owlinexile]

3 minutes ago, sheffield_dave said:

I'm torn on Celtic & Rangers. 

 

It comes from a similar place to the ESL stuff, yet I'm not opposed to it. Mainly because Celtic & Rangers being exposed to Premier League money would put a seriously massive cat amongst the stuffy elite pigeons, and I think it would be a laugh. As a passive viewer of the Premier League, it would become an overnight more interesting league to me with them in it.

 

I also think the merging of some leagues across Europe isn't a terrible idea and in some ways is both practical and to be expected. I recall some legitimate talk recently of the Belgium and Dutch leagues merging? 

 

The ESL was an awful idea but widespread and quite drastic reforms to the game are due. I'm open to them despite being hugely apposed to the ESL. The current model isn't working and hasn't been for years. The "normal" that people think they fought for and won this week still stinks. 

 

Why should the second oldest Football League in the world merge itself out of existence just to pander to fake TV fans?

 

It's not going to happen.

[sonofbert2]

2 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Having a premier league 2 instead of the Championship would be quite good. Would make it more competitive as parachute payments could go, and then have PL2/Championship clubs write it in to contracts that wages have to be reduced on relegation to league 1. No cliff edge between PL and Championship.. makes more sense for there to be one between championship and league 1 if anything.

 

Would basically create a two tier football league but that’s probably right given about half the clubs are a decent size and the other half are smaller town clubs.

 

They could then also reduce the number of teams in the top league down to 18 and the second tier down to 20. So the money gets split fewer ways. It’s inevitable these big clubs will want to play more European games so that would help free up time for that, and then an expanded Champions League.

 

It’s coming.

 

Now is the perfect timing.

 

The irony is that I think someone like us could be in the system on the basis of size and perhaps not merit at the expense of the likes of Rotherham or Luton for example.

 

How would people feel then?

 

Sunderland would be in ahead of teams like Hull City maybe.

 

There must be loads of teams currently, big names from the past, on the verge of going pop in the lower leagues currently.  It’s like when they announce “voluntary” redundancies when a firm is going bust.  

 

 

[sonofbert2]

14 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Having a premier league 2 instead of the Championship would be quite good. Would make it more competitive as parachute payments could go, and then have PL2/Championship clubs write it in to contracts that wages have to be reduced on relegation to league 1. No cliff edge between PL and Championship.. makes more sense for there to be one between championship and league 1 if anything.

 

Would basically create a two tier football league but that’s probably right given about half the clubs are a decent size and the other half are smaller town clubs.

 

They could then also reduce the number of teams in the top league down to 18 and the second tier down to 20. So the money gets split fewer ways. It’s inevitable these big clubs will want to play more European games so that would help free up time for that, and then an expanded Champions League.

 

This is the plan and has been for a while and has been for a while I think.

 

 

[BIG D]

It’ll come in this close season. Premier League 1 & 2 and no promotion/relegation from EFL League 1

[sonofbert2]

4 minutes ago, BIG D said:

It’ll come in this close season. Premier League 1 & 2 and no promotion/relegation from EFL League 1

 

We’ll be fine then.

 

[SiJ]

Let's be right here, if you gave the other 14 chairman in the PL the option of bringing up the draw bridge they'd be all over that sh*t.

 

It's all pigs in the trough; it's just some are bigger than others.