Changed my mind on sacking Jos - (Here me out)

[sherlyegg]

2 minutes ago, ReadingOwl said:

So you think the Chairman picked him, or his advisors chose him, because he was the standout candidate?

TBF 'they' found cc, he was hardly well known

[Finney on the Wing]

13 minutes ago, Mountain Owl said:

The major problems at our club lies at the very top with a chairman who is arrogant, won't listen and has made a whole list of horrendous decisions. One of those was the appointment of Jos who appears to fall out easily with senior pro's and is tactically woefull and still hopelessly naive of what the championship is all about. Any decent chairman would have sacked him after the Norwich embarressment. As for who would take the job I can guarantee they would queing up and banging on the door because anyone who knows football knows if you can kick start this club the momentum can be massive. Look at what Big Jack and Big Ron both did when we were on the road to doom.

 

Not sure that this Jos falling out with senior pro's is actually true - I reckon they're being forced out by people higher up than Jos.

 

As for the Norwich game, we were fine for 50 mins, possibly the better of the two teams, then just total capitulation from the lads, not Jos.

 

Big Jack stepped in at a very low point in the clubs history and couldn't fail really as we were that low to start with.

 

Remember Big Ron actually took us down initially but again, like Jack, it was a rebuilding time so he could do it his way.

 

Jos has got his hands well and truly tied at the moment - personally, I hope he turns this around.

 

 

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, McRightSide said:

 

Take out our bad run and we’re doing well.

 

Delusion of the highest order

 

How to totally misinterpret an opinion in one hit!

 

What I said was you either measure his performance on the thirteen games or you measure it on the six game bad run. I have not made a positive case for the guy at all. I have said that there is no need to panic just yet and we are currently comfortable enough to wait and see how things develop. Because, as sure as eggs are eggs, there is always the possibility that the next guy is the same or worse. What then, sack him and find another?

[ReadingOwl]

Anyway, I’m leaving it.

 

I’ve shouted, on here, for the sacking of Irvine, Jones and Carvahal - Probably one of the first to do so in each case.

 

Im ambivalent with regard to the current manager staying/going. I have no idea whether he is good/bad. I don’t hold a candle for him - or, can argue that he actually is any good. Given a free hand - I have no idea.

 

I just don’t want you all to be disappointed when the cycle starts again.

 

If he goes, nothing will change.

 

We’ll get another “Nobody”. 

 

If it is change you all truly want - then look a bit deeper.

 

You are all being played - not trying to be controversial or insulting - but that’s my opinion.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Markowski77 said:

I've been like the majority of the fans over the past few weeks,  Jos out, jos is c-rap, he hasn't got a clue etc etc. But after the potential scenarios I think getting rid at this point would be the wrong thing to do. 

 

For instance

- Who do we get? They have no money to buy players, got to sell our so called marquee players, work under a very odd/bizarre situation that we only know the surface of. No manager would want the job it's a poisoned chalice

 

Jos isn't my choice and needs to go at the end of the season, however we know DC is higley unlikely to get rid anytime soon - so we've got to stick and ride out the storm, until the end of the season and hopefully avoid relegation of which I think we will. That Bolton team gave me hope that there are far worse teams then us this season

 

we need to achieve as many points as possible until the end of jan transfer window to give us some breathing space, because let's face it we are going to be selling players

 

Then we do a monumental rebuild in pre season,  manager, backroom staff, players the lot - achieve a new identity and philiospy that we can associate with SWFC. The new manager will be under financial restraints but at least will be able to pick his team

 

In the meantime we need to try and get behind SWFC, at the end of the day it's our club and we support them through thick and thin, managers & chairmen change he supporters never do

 

WAWAW

 

 

 

Well that as shocked me. I wasn't aware of those facts. 

[Morepork]

I agree with the sentiment that JL is working to a pretty rigid script. We had/have no realistic promotion aspirations. As I see it, all JL has been asked to do is survive in this league, closely followed by a brief to show high earners the door. Not part of the brief is JL managing to highlight the fact that certain younger players may not be anywhere near as ready as the Chairman hoped. Bottom line is we are clearly looking to get as close as possible to a fresh start. The reason behind that could be a potential sale or another crack at promotion. Worryingly, we've seen absolutely nothing so far IMO to suggest we'd make a better go of another promotion push. It shouldn't be....but its a case of cross your finger and wait and see.......

[doubleo]

A new manager in the next few weeks would have the advantage that Jos had 12 months ago - half a season to find your best system for the talent available, identify the players you want to play, so you could have a regular starting 11, being able to arrange the pre season to suit so that you could start next season on the front foot.  Everything Jos hasn't taken advantage of.

[Watto]

1 hour ago, ReadingOwl said:

Jos is working within the constraints of the current Chairman, it seems to me.

 

I absolutely cannot believe that he has full autonomy.

 

Don’t see why he should carry the blame.

 

It’s a circus alright - but he isn’t the ring master.

 

If I'm not mistaken our Joss left a club in Germany because he wasn't happy with the going on's there , I wonder why if he's in a similar ( or lot worse ) position here he isn't thinking of doing the same.

Imo he won't walk because no one else wants him so we are stuck with him until Chansiri wakes up from his slumber and takes action.

[torryowl]

1 hour ago, ZicoSterland2 said:

If he is not managing and in charge of selections then he is here for the money only. His motivational skills obviously dont work and his tactics are horrendous. He gets paid for results and if they are poor he must accept the blame. If he is not in control then he should show some pride and walk.

if results over a period of time are poor then the managership certainly needs looking at …..not sure though that poor run of 4 defeats is a long enough period to be calling for his head …...prior to those 4 games we were doing well and since those 4 games we've played 2 of the better sides and a relegation rival and picked up 4pts which isn't a bad return …….he's no jack Charlton but he's doing as well as can be expected with the constraints he as to work under . 

[ZicoSterland2]

20 minutes ago, ReadingOwl said:

 

So you think the Chairman picked him, or his advisors chose him, because he was the standout candidate?

 

A bloke who was “about to retire”.

 

I have no objection to people saying he’s rubbish.

 

But look at the methodology behind his appointment.

 

So what will change - has the Chairman or CEO issued a statement lately, promising us all a new dawn?

 

Who do you want in next - Another nobody?

I would take Holloway Gray Warburton on a 6month contract.  None would be over expensive all have had some success in this league and all are available with something to prove. They may not be the choices of the majority but all are realistic 

[ChinaOwl]

2 minutes ago, doubleo said:

A new manager in the next few weeks would have the advantage that Jos had 12 months ago - half a season to find your best system for the talent available, identify the players you want to play, so you could have a regular starting 11, being able to arrange the pre season to suit so that you could start next season on the front foot.  Everything Jos hasn't taken advantage of.

 

As it happens, my own feelings are that Chansiri and Katrien now looking for an exit strategy. If and when Chansiri goes my bet would be Jos will go with him. Thus, I just see Jos as a temporary fixture to keep us in the Championship whilst the books are balanced by getting certain high earners off the payroll. I do not foresee the job as a long term rebuilding operation. When I think that relegation is a realistic threat, I will be straight on the get rid bandwagon. For the time being, I am happy for Jos to take the flack whilst changes at the other level of the club take place. 

[ReadingOwl]

2 minutes ago, ZicoSterland2 said:

I would take Holloway Gray Warburton on a 6month contract.  None would be over expensive all have had some success in this league and all are available with something to prove. They may not be the choices of the majority but all are realistic 

 

OK - and what would the Club offer them, above and beyond, what is available to the current manager?

 

Would they be able to add to and untiluse the current squad fully?

 

Otherwise - why would they come, other than a short term wage and subsequent pay off?

[myHero]

1 hour ago, theowlsman said:

Sorry, don’t want to hear you out.

 

We’re already in dereliction of duty territory.

 

Should already have been booted out.

This really is like being stuck between a rock and a hard place. The case for the defence is, better the devil you know.

 

I can only argue that having a go at certain players for passing backwards or sideways is unfair as they are clearly under instruction. There are other negative tactics going off in other areas of the pitch also.

 

I personally think it's best our energies are spent on urging the team forward when they are on the pitch. They can't ignore 20k plus people telling them what we expect of them.

 

Back to the change of Manager issue. Let's consider we have Jos because Carlos left is in the lurch on Christmas Eve. If we'd been able to look during the previous summer there would have been more choice. Likewise, we'd have the same problems next week or next month of Jos was forced out, and in the process we'll damage the confidence of the players.

 

That said, if the signal is answered...

 

 

 

[NYCOWL]

If he'd said "Thanks, but I'm going to try a different route" after the Huddersfield game (Which I'd have advocated, I didn't see us getting any better) He could have gone out and got a Dean Smith, or the likes.

 

Instead he stubbornly hung on, until we are in the position that we couldn't attract a good manager if he knew what one looked like.

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, ZicoSterland2 said:

I would take Holloway Gray Warburton on a 6month contract.  None would be over expensive all have had some success in this league and all are available with something to prove. They may not be the choices of the majority but all are realistic 

So it's the old sticking plaster ploy.  We want stability not temporary fixes. Until we give this manager a fighting chance and get rid of the Shi*e he inherited and try and rebuild, what is the sense in getting someone else in. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, NYCOWL said:

If he'd said "Thanks, but I'm going to try a different route" after the Huddersfield game (Which I'd have advocated, I didn't see us getting any better) He could have gone out and got a Dean Smith, or the likes.

 

Instead he stubbornly hung on, until we are in the position that we couldn't attract a good manager if he knew what one looked like.

 

What does a good manager look like. Does he have a flashing light on his head or something so it gives us a clue. 

[ReadingOwl]

1 minute ago, CLswfc said:

So it's the old sticking plaster ploy.  We want stability not temporary fixes. Until we give this manager a fighting chance and get rid of the Shi*e he inherited and try and rebuild, what is the sense in getting someone else in. 

 

Sadly, and I sincerely mean, sadly.

 

I agree 100%.

[vulva]

He’s not a Sheffield Wednesday manager. Lance the boil. ASAP. 

 

Take away a few Reach 30 yarders and we’d be in the bottom 3. Reach larapering a few has kept him in a job. 

[NYCOWL]

1 minute ago, CLswfc said:

 

What does a good manager look like. Does he have a flashing light on his head or something so it gives us a clue. 

Is this a serious post?

[ZicoSterland2]

4 minutes ago, ReadingOwl said:

 

OK - and what would the Club offer them, above and beyond, what is available to the current manager?

 

Would they be able to add to and untiluse the current squad fully?

 

Otherwise - why would they come, other than a short term wage and subsequent pay off?

Its about utilising the tools you have at your disposal. Jos is not. Any of these I would back to do a better job. This squad is better than it is showing. That is down to the manager in any workplace the buck stops there. You are saying he is being blocked from playing certain players but he has stated he has no interference from above. This debacle is of his making and his inept tactics. If you dont see it that way we will have to agree to disagree .