2 proper wingers and a centre back

[DesWalker]

20 minutes ago, Hack-Abusi said:

Thats a good shout Des, i'd forgot he was at palace. Injured or just not playing?

 

 

 

He has had injury problems and the palace fans don't rate him.  Brum were sniffing in January at a reported fee of 4m.

 

Wages would be big as he went to palace on a free so not sure if the numbers would stack up (3/4m fee plus big wages), but this is the type of player we've been crying out for since Antonio left.

 

The lack of pace last night was soul destroying.

[curren]

This thread could have been started after the playoff final last season.

12 months on and £20+m later we are still needing wingers and a central defender

[beloved_aunt]

1 hour ago, samowl said:

Agreed. No good having the guns without the bullets. We need players to feed our strikers. Plus a brute of a midfielder. We're too soft and too nice 

 

Have you ever seen Sam Hutchinson play football?!?!?

[beloved_aunt]

1 hour ago, gurujuan said:

The problem is, you can't just add two wingers and a centre back, although I agree we may need them. We don't have a central midfield pairing that would allow us to play with two wingers playing wide. Without the wingers tucking in,  Lee and Bannan are two lightweight, we'd be overrun. Hutchinson and Lee would give us more bite, but would it be creative enough Ditto Hutchinson and Bannan. If we are going to play 4-4-2, then we need to get different midfield options, as well as wingers and a centre back. Maybe even a decent strike partner who brings the best out of Hooper or Rhodes. 

If you want to upgrade our full backs, then we are already looking at major investment and upheaval again Do we need that?

 

This is the problem, we're always trying to shoehorn Bannan/Lee/Hutch into CM which is understandable as they're all class players, but you can't do that and play two up front without some imbalance. 

[meggoisgod]

anyone got JJ's number?

[gurujuan]

41 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said:

 

This is the problem, we're always trying to shoehorn Bannan/Lee/Hutch into CM which is understandable as they're all class players, but you can't do that and play two up front without some imbalance. 

 

You've hit the nail on the head, trying to accommodate two up front is the cause of most of our problems

[Guest Kagoshimaowl]

2 hours ago, BD2OWL said:

And a manager.

 

Should see us ok next season.

 

You cannot have the likes of Rhodes, Fletcher & Winnall in the side and put one decent cross a game in.

 

 

 

Definitely agree with the cb and wingers.  I'd go for two new full backs too!

[Claudio Tankisco]

The vast majority of our set pieces were awful last night.

[marshy]

1 hour ago, Bannofan said:

As I've said in another thread, it's easier to talk about the players we should keep, rather than who should go.

 

No way should we sign another player until we have had a proper clear out. The size of our squad means players don't feel part of a ' team' , there doesn't seem to be a great team spirit ( in my opinion) .

 

Lets start with the ' must stays'

 

Westwood

Lees

Lee

Bannan

Winnall

Hooper

Rhodes ( because we haven't got a choice, committed to the signing - if we could get our money back or cancel the deal - do it . No slight on Rhodes, it's not his fault it hasn't worked )

 

 

I would also suggest keeping Palmer, Wildsmith, Hunt, Reach and Hutchinson - 100% players who, basically, I like!

 

Oh yeah, and offer Semedo a player/coach role

 

So basically..

 

Fox

Sasso

Loovens

Abdi

Joao

Mcmanaman

Buckley

Fletcher

Forestieri 

Nuhui (  with a tear in my eye)

Pudil

Mattias

McGugan

Emmanuelson

Wallace

Jones

 

Can all leave for me, some with a big ' thank you', others with a 'don't let the door hit you on the backside as you go'

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fox.why on earth did we sign him?

Sasso. ditto having been told we were ok at the back.

Loovens without doubt. Mr walking football reads game well but struggles now against young fast strikers.

Abdi, contracted I believe. Can be a good player. Great infact. Give him another go.

Joao, one hit wonder v Arsenal let go.

Macca and Buckley both loaned so will go back.

Fletcher on big money he's going no where.

Fessi better with that without. Rather have him playing for us than against. Had an injury and not fully fit imho.

Nuhui, let go. Should be well down the order. 

Pudil lacks any pace and got murdered last night. Not the first time.

Mattias, god knows what's gone off there. Never known a player been injured as much as him. Expensive waste.

Mcugan urby jones all let go.

Wallace give him one more year. At times hes been great gutted he went off.

[beloved_aunt]

31 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

 

You've hit the nail on the head, trying to accommodate two up front is the cause of most of our problems

 

Yep, a more natural way to set up our midfield would be something like:

 

                     Hutchinson

            Lee                   Bannan

Wallace/New winger          Foresieri

                   Lone Striker

 

This would allow us to be more attacking and dynamic and for Lee and Bannan to concentrate more on attacking that defending.  But it would mean have 5 strikers on the bench which we're not going to do.

[kingsidney]

40 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said:

 

Have you ever seen Sam Hutchinson play football?!?!?

Sam's more of a third central defender than beast midfielder. He sucks play back 20 yards when he plays. 

[gurujuan]

38 minutes ago, beloved_aunt said:

 

Yep, a more natural way to set up our midfield would be something like:

 

                     Hutchinson

            Lee                   Bannan

Wallace/New winger          Foresieri

                   Lone Striker

 

This would allow us to be more attacking and dynamic and for Lee and Bannan to concentrate more on attacking that defending.  But it would mean have 5 strikers on the bench which we're not going to do.

 

Yes, I don't understand Carlos's new found obsession with 4-4-2, and even less, the way he wants it played. He is a capable coach who has written a manual on 4-2-3-1 as a way of playing. Brighton, who along with Newcastle, have the best players, do play a more orthodox 4-4-2, but they have the players to play that way. It's disappointing when you see the more sophisticated approach of our play off rivals, Huddersfield, Reading and Fulham. We seemed like Luddites compared to them, and it's not as if we don't have a coach who can do it

[cookeh]

 

Westwood

Lees - Loovens - Sasso

Hunt - Bannan - Jones - Reach

Hooper - Rhodes - Forestieri

 

Should work fine. We'd need back up at centerback, and ideally someone to come in for Loovens as he's 34 in a few months.

 

My main 'worries' are the players we just can't fit in a team at once. Really good players, but there's way too many to get in an 11.

Lee, Wallace, Abdi, Fletcher, Winnall.. all good enough to deserve a starting spot, but some will have to be left out if we are to find a balanced side.

 

Fox and Palmer are decent enough as back up for the wide positions.

Wallace, Lee and Abdi (even Matias) all there competing as the linking players, with Hooper and Nando.

Lee and Hutch an cover the defensive mid positions.. tho neither has the distribution of Bannan.

Winnall and Fletch are there if we need to change things or if Rhodes is injured.

Defensive back up is the only real worry.

 

Does mean we move on the likes of:
Pudil, McGugan, Urby and Nuhiu. MacManaman and Buckley are gone as their loans end. Don't think anyone will cry too hard over that list.

 

It seems like the easiest way to transition into an attacking side that uses our strengths:

too many central linking players (Hooper, Nando, Lee, Abdi)
wide players who are neither out and out wingers, not solid defensive fullbacks
providing plenty of options for Bannan's distribution

[Swiss Toni]

No point getting in wingers with Carlos at the helm as he clearly doesn't like or trust using them. You can see from the dugout that Carlos and Joao are always pushing their hand together to signal to the players to keep it compact. That's why they use CMs as narrow wide men.

[aeroswfc]

Cool. 

[Gresh]

A proven winger with a bit of pace and who can cross a decent ball; but they don't come cheap.

[Guest samowl]

4 hours ago, gurujuan said:

 

I don't disagree, and regarding the recruitment, yes the buck stops with Carlos. My point was though, it might be more effective, and cheaper, to change the way we play, rather than make wholesale changes

That's the problem. CC won't change the way we play. So if the Manager won't change. Change the Manager 

[Guest samowl]

3 hours ago, curren said:

This thread could have been started after the playoff final last season.

12 months on and £20+m later we are still needing wingers and a central defender

Bang on 

[Hack-Abusi]

58 minutes ago, DesWalker said:

 

He has had injury problems and the palace fans don't rate him.  Brum were sniffing in January at a reported fee of 4m.

 

Wages would be big as he went to palace on a free so not sure if the numbers would stack up (3/4m fee plus big wages), but this is the type of player we've been crying out for since Antonio left.

 

The lack of pace last night was soul destroying.

Absolutely agree - if we were gonna spend £10m on a striker why not chuck it at someone like Nakhi Wells or someone like Abraham or can't think of anyone else haha

[kendoddsdadsdogsdead]

I've said this in my other posts, but we DO NOT play with traditional wingers.

 

We got Macca and Buckley on loan (Both proven wide players) presumably to play 442, and give us width and crossing ability. However, for whatever reason (injuries aside), did we ever play to that system ?

 

Presumably both were brought in to p!ay that role, but when they were not in the side, where was the natural width to come from ?

 

If CC remains and sticks with 442, and has players at the club who are genuine wingers, please play them like that, not done hybrid version which stifffles their natural game. Our strike force is very very good for this level, and they need service to thrive on. Getting quality crosses into the box gives them a chance.