FA Cup 2024

[owls maniac]

24 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

On balance I think VAR is needed.  The game at prem level is played right on the edge and very quickly as the players and tactics have evolved.  I just think the job is too hard for officials to get decisions right without it.  
 

But they are still making a right testicles of it even with the technology. Except now they are sucking the joy out of celebrations and looking for reasons to disallow goals. 

[BIG D]

The one that gets me and it went in our favour was Gregory in the play off final.

Pre VAR no one would have even discussed it but they usually give those and then they didn't. A few moments later came the sending off (rightly so) and the rest is history.

[Southie_Owl]

2 hours ago, DJMortimer said:

The game should never even have made it as far as extra time in the first place. That penalty against Wan-Bissaka was a nonsense decision made by someone in an era where it's expected defenders arms should be permanently pinned to their sides. But I suppose in that case VAR had little option given that the referee had already pointed to the spot.

 

Yeah i get some people wanted a fairy-tale story and Man Utd to lose,  but its never a penalty. Unless we expect players to have detachable arms to avoid the ball being kicked at it.  

[punkskaphil]

29 minutes ago, BIG D said:

The one that gets me and it went in our favour was Gregory in the play off final.

Pre VAR no one would have even discussed it but they usually give those and then they didn't. A few moments later came the sending off (rightly so) and the rest is history.

 

Unusually, given the way VAR has been used since it was brought in, the two decisions in the Play-off Final that went in our favour were actually the correct decisions according to what VAR is designed to do. If it was used in that way more often then I think people might have warmed to it a bit more.

 

In the case of the possible penalty, although Gregory did catch the Barnsley player's foot, it was such a marginal thing - literally a tiny fraction of a second to see and with both players challenging honestly for the ball - that the referee calling it wrong wasn't a 'clear and obvious error' so VAR shouldn't intervene. Had the ref called it as a penalty on the field, VAR wouldn't have overruled him either. We were lucky it went in our favour, but VAR was actually used correctly as it was such a tight decision at the time of the event.

 

The sending off was a bit more straightforward though. People were complaining that the replays showed that the Barnsley player didn't actually go in studs-first and so it should've been overturned, but he'd actually jumped into the challenge and was completely out of control, regardless of where his studs were pointing. In fact, there's more of a case that if the ref hadn't show a red card on the field, VAR may even have even sent him to the pitchside monitor to reassess.

 

The thing we've seen with VAR is that far too often the officials are using it incorrectly and have lost sight of what it's actually for. With the exception of the offsides, it's not supposed to be used to find the absolute 100% correct decision. It's there to correct the massive obvious errors (or, in some cases, incidents that the on-field officials haven't seen because it's happened behind their backs).

[matthefish2002]

3 hours ago, SnowyOwl13 said:

I'm gonna whisper it quietly but if it was Manchester United getting ruled out in the same way, there wouldn't be the same anger and upset. 

 

I think you are right but cant help feeling when a decision even on VAR is that close it would have gone in Manchester United favour.

Yes use VAR to get rid of the once a season howler but using it the way they do and taking 2-3 minutes over it is not in the spirit of football.

[latemodelchild]

I still want to know how they decide which frame they use. When is the ball deemed to be played? That decision makes a massive difference when we're looking at centimetres and less at the other end of the pass. 

[Miffed]

when a decision goes to VAR the panel should be given 30 seconds to look at it, otherwise the on field decision should stand. If they can’t decide within that time frame (and need multiple angles and lines) then it’s neither clear nor obvious. 

 

[SiJ]

It really was a shame. 

 

Arguably the greatest comeback in FA cup history and then bloody VAR gets involved and determines he was offside by millimetres. 

 

I just hate the fact that VAR  has become an excuse for officials to find the slightest potential fault with a goal. 

[BIG D]

No one will ever convince me this is 100% correct. 
 

[Miffed]

11 minutes ago, BIG D said:

No one will ever convince me this is 100% correct. 
 

just as @latemodelchild is alluding to…. How can you be certain that this is the exact frame that the ball was played and not the frame before or after?

 

Plus they aren’t even the lines they use in the VAR room apparently, these are just the BBC’s interpretation. It’s all a stinking pile of mess 

[scram]

Must be really tough as cov can seeing that.

[ThruThinAndThinner]

20 hours ago, SnowyOwl13 said:

I'm gonna whisper it quietly but if it was Manchester United getting ruled out in the same way, there wouldn't be the same anger and upset. 

 

Possibly, because that would have been very unusual. As I said in my post above, if Man U had scored that exact same goal instead, it most probably wouldn't have been ruled out.

 

VAR or no VAR, the smaller clubs never seem to get the rub of the green in these situations - remember Chesterfield's "Lampard goal" in the 1997 FA Cup semi v Boro? That would have put them 3-1 up and they would have probably got to the final on the back of it.

[ThruThinAndThinner]

12 hours ago, scram said:

Must be really tough as cov can seeing that.

 

Gut-wrenching. I don't especially like Coventry or their current manager, but on this occasion I do feel for them.

[latemodelchild]

So having delved into it a bit all I can find is that there's a 50 frame per second camera that they use to determine when the ball is played. They chose one of those frames to pause the action. 

 

Ball is travelling towards the midfielder. He strikes it right footed with some power. The ball has to touch his foot, compress, stop travelling in one direction and be propelled in the opposite. This all takes time to happen, albeit a short time. If that takes a second then there are 50 frames within that action that can be used. If they use the 1st frame or the 50th frame the action at the other end of pass will be different. 

 

2 players running at speed in opposite directions will be in different positions within that second. It might only be a cm or so but that's the margins they're looking at so it's vital that they get it right. 

 

Would it be out of the realms of possiblility that they've got it wrong on occasions? I'd say not. Would it be out of the realms of possiblility that the action is frozen in a way that gives certain times an advantage? Nah, evens itself out doesn't it? And if you belive that I've got some magic beans for sale. 

[FTBUTO1867]

After the tarring of our entire fanbase by Coventry fans after the deplorable actions of a couple of individuals, laughed my head off when their last minute winner was chalked off.

 

Hate VAR as it sucks the life out of the fan experience but that's the rules, so suck on it.

[Bannofan]

On 23/04/2024 at 07:39, latemodelchild said:

 Nah, evens itself out doesn't it? And if you belive that I've got some magic beans for sale. 

 

There's an argument going around saying that 30 mins earlier Coventry benefited from VAR with the handball penalty decision. 

 

That for me is more clear cut though, you only have to see that replayed once to be know its a penalty under the current rules.

 

This offside decision though..it just isn't offside even with the graphic they used. Baffling.  

 

 

[helmut_rooster]

On 23/04/2024 at 07:25, ThruThinAndThinner said:

 

Possibly, because that would have been very unusual. As I said in my post above, if Man U had scored that exact same goal instead, it most probably wouldn't have been ruled out.

 

VAR or no VAR, the smaller clubs never seem to get the rub of the green in these situations - remember Chesterfield's "Lampard goal" in the 1997 FA Cup semi v Boro? That would have put them 3-1 up and they would have probably got to the final on the back of it.

 

Remember that well mile behind the line bounced out linesman flag for you would assume a goal, yet Ellery I think gives a free kick other way for nothing.