Bannan - with and without

[Owls2k]

11 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

 

 

 

Personally, I am far from convinced by Joey. IMO Lee is twice the player and even Jones is better.

 

There we go, I love it when there's an agreement on Owlstalk. 

 

Stats are great, but stats like the one you quoted tend to lack perspective and are blind to outside factors, as impressive as that record is.

 

Joey hasn't been over here long so I'm interested to see how he does next season. It's also interesting that the club didn't disclose his contract length, which makes you wonder if we see him as 'one for a the future' or a stop gap solution, my guess is he'll have a deal until next summer with us having an option of another year if he performs well.

 

 

[SallyCinnamon]

Yet he still gets stick from the morons who sit round me.

 

Awesome player and would walk into every side at this level.

[Sticky belly]

I agree, he’s not perfect he sometimes dwells on the ball too long and sometimes needlessly gives it away at times. But his passing is absolutely crucial for us and he is the heart beat for us. He’s that important to us that when he went off against Fulham I knew we would lose that game then. I’ve noticed he actually plays better when FF plays, another quality player on his wave length and they both trust each other with the ball. 

 

Regarding the stats with Joey and him together then you carry on playing them together, if the bridge ain’t broken then you don’t fix it do you?

[Lawrie Madden]

4 minutes ago, Sticky belly said:

I agree, he’s not perfect he sometimes dwells on the ball too long and sometimes needlessly gives it away at times. But his passing is absolutely crucial for us and he is the heart beat for us. He’s that important to us that when he went off against Fulham I knew we would lose that game then. I’ve noticed he actually plays better when FF plays, another quality player on his wave length and they both trust each other with the ball. 

 

Regarding the stats with Joey and him together then you carry on playing them together, if the bridge ain’t broken then you don’t fix it do you?

I don’t use stats at all just my eyes 

 

Pelupessy allows Bannan to play higher up the field where he most influences the game and is less likely to dwell on the ball

 

Bannans terrific work ethic is usually unappreciated too he does an enormous amount of chasing back and defending 

[StudentOwl]

19 minutes ago, Lawrie Madden said:

I don’t use stats at all just my eyes 

 

Pelupessy allows Bannan to play higher up the field where he most influences the game and is less likely to dwell on the ball

 

Bannans terrific work ethic is usually unappreciated too he does an enormous amount of chasing back and defending 

This exactly

 

I have to disagree with a lot of people's assessments on Lee replacing Pelupessy in this team and current setup. And I'm saying this as Lee with my favourite Wednesday player. Kieran is, without doubt, a better player than Joey. But Pelupessy acts as a linchpin, a sitter, an anchor... he doesn't go tearing around after the ball but his presence within that zone he occupies allows others to tear around instead. If you only include players that have had 10 or more appearances this season, Pelupessy is our second-highest player for interceptions per game, behind Loovens (fourth if you include all players, with Clare and Hutch above him). He's shutting out passing lanes and positionally a lot better than I think he gets credit for. Compare with Lee, one of the finest players I've seen in a Wednesday shirt in my short time watching us, who is 12th for average interceptions when including players with 10+ games. It's not his style... he's a real box to box busybody. Admirable, but it means that Bannan starts sitting deeper to get the ball.

 

IMO, football is about the best 11 as a unit on the pitch, not just the best 11 on the pitch. With our current setup, with FF effectively making the forward thrust of a midfield 3, we need a player like Pelupessy alongside Bannan. Lee's energy, drive, commitment and even forward presence would be far more appreciated at RWB. That'd allow him to get forward more frequently and allow Bannan to not keep dropping back. 

[hertsowl]

2 hours ago, zico.b said:

I've just had visions of a jam jar with notes stuffed in it. On the front is a peeling sticker with 'Naughty Fund. DO NOT TOUCH!'

 

Joking aside, I've always wondered what happens to the fines - does it get distributed to charities?

Yes, I believe It's split between a number of good causes nominated by the players.

[SiJ]

For every technically gifted footballer, you need a water carrier. 

 

That's what Pelepussy is. 

 

Surprised that some don't really see that. Furthermore, the lad has only been here for a few months. 

 

Give him time. 

[cowl]

1 hour ago, StudentOwl said:

This exactly

 

I have to disagree with a lot of people's assessments on Lee replacing Pelupessy in this team and current setup. And I'm saying this as Lee with my favourite Wednesday player. Kieran is, without doubt, a better player than Joey. But Pelupessy acts as a linchpin, a sitter, an anchor... he doesn't go tearing around after the ball but his presence within that zone he occupies allows others to tear around instead. If you only include players that have had 10 or more appearances this season, Pelupessy is our second-highest player for interceptions per game, behind Loovens (fourth if you include all players, with Clare and Hutch above him). He's shutting out passing lanes and positionally a lot better than I think he gets credit for. Compare with Lee, one of the finest players I've seen in a Wednesday shirt in my short time watching us, who is 12th for average interceptions when including players with 10+ games. It's not his style... he's a real box to box busybody. Admirable, but it means that Bannan starts sitting deeper to get the ball.

 

IMO, football is about the best 11 as a unit on the pitch, not just the best 11 on the pitch. With our current setup, with FF effectively making the forward thrust of a midfield 3, we need a player like Pelupessy alongside Bannan. Lee's energy, drive, commitment and even forward presence would be far more appreciated at RWB. That'd allow him to get forward more frequently and allow Bannan to not keep dropping back. 

 

Said the same to my mate yesterday. Assuming he can be injury free for next season (big assumption), this might very well be how things pan out. In Lee and Reach you'd have two wing backs who can run all day, and that's not a bad place to start with wing backs.

 

Having said that, Hunt's impressed me this season. In fact, he's been decent ever since coming back from injury towards the end of last season - but there's the key word with Hunt: injury - he tends to get a lot. Niggles mostly, but it means there's an issue with reliability. Of course, we can but hope that he like so many others in the squad can put the injuries behind them with JL's more structured approach to training and fitness work.

[cowl]

Just now, SiJ said:

For every technically gifted footballer, you need a water carrier. 

 

That's what Pelepussy is. 

 

Surprised that some don't really see that. Furthermore, the lad has only been here for a few months. 

 

Give him time. 

 

I've been critical of him, but I think his game over the past 9 games (since the 2nd half at Leeds) has improved considerably. He looks more at ease with the pace of the Championship now.

 

At times yesterday I still felt as though we needed a more domineering presence in midfield - but this is as much to do with the downsides of playing a 3-4-3, which however fluid, there'll be times when we're going to look very light in the centre. Even so, Pelupessy's very mobile and it also counts for a lot in that position.

[SiJ]

Tbf we've missed a true physical presence in midfield since the play off final. 

 

Hutch doesn' count, as he's always flipping injured. 

 

Depends how we set up next season. Do we stick with the 5 at the back or does Jos revert to his preferred 4-2-3-1? 

 

I do agree that we need something extra in midfield. 

[I'm an Essex Owl]

The stats speak for themselves we are way way better with him playing than not. Bannan gives us forward momentum. He is (I would think acknowledged by most) far more effective the higher he is up the pitch (used to make me uncontrollably and excessively angry and want to flounce out off the ground when he kept picking it up off Loovens and Lees 5 yards out of our area then d i c k ing about with it before hitting a 60 yard hollywood ball straight to the other side) . He still gives the ball away unnecessarily too much IMO (and was very guilty of this on Sunday - actually thought him and FF were taking the wee wee a bit as they found it so easy yesterday - surprised neither got clattered for taking liberties out of Norwich at times) but he is a class act. Runs his socks off and makes us much more of dangerous side.

If Villa don't go up and Bruce survives then would not be surprised if they bid for him

 

[BigOwl]

So the key is keeping Bazza fit and supported enough to play further up the pitch. Bannan deffo seems to play higher and thus better when he has a solid reliable defensive midfielder sitting in there beside him.

Jones doesn’t do it full stop, Butters inspired little therefore leaving Hutch, Lee or Pelupessy for the role covering behind.

 

To say Joey has had to come straight into a new, faster paced and more physical league AND into a side shorn of its manager, senior players and confidence I feel he’s done a very good job.

Hutch is more physical and probably technically gifted but yet perhaps Bazza doesn’t have the confidence to push forward when Hutch is there. 

 

Lee can do this job well and we’ve seen the two in tandem work well BUT will we ever see Lee fit enough/injury free for long enough to rely on. 

For me Joey has the position to lose. He’s grown in confidence and understanding of what this league needs and he doesn’t seem to pick up injuries. Joey is also the perfect age for the job. Energy to burn and knows his task. 

Edited May 7, 2018 by BigOwl

[No 2 is r nilsson]

6 hours ago, aussieowl87 said:

 

Think Joey was brilliant yesterday. They are starting to click as a pair.

Joey has certainly grown into that role.  They seemed to give up loads of possession in the middle third but then defend the box well when it mattered, and then find the gaps going forward. Someone quoted Jos in another thread - it’s ‘effective football’. 

[aussieowl87]

1 hour ago, No 2 is r nilsson said:

Joey has certainly grown into that role.  They seemed to give up loads of possession in the middle third but then defend the box well when it mattered, and then find the gaps going forward. Someone quoted Jos in another thread - it’s ‘effective football’. 

 

I think if you also factor that Pelupessy was also doubling up with Ash Baker at times (given Joao didn't seem to track runners), he must have covered some mileage.

 

A grafter who makes work easier for those around him. Thankfully he isn't that wasteful in possession compared to others who try and play a similar role.

[No 2 is r nilsson]

17 minutes ago, aussieowl87 said:

 

I think if you also factor that Pelupessy was also doubling up with Ash Baker at times (given Joao didn't seem to track runners), he must have covered some mileage.

 

A grafter who makes work easier for those around him. Thankfully he isn't that wasteful in possession compared to others who try and play a similar role.

Throw in a few goals and we might just have a new Danny Wilson. 

[Essix Blue]

I think Pup is central to Jos’s plans next season due to his time on the pitch while he’s been here. I think he’s done well, and I think he’s suited to 3 CBs behind him. The like you say B.B. in midfield with him gives Baz a bit more scope - let’s be honest there isn’t a better passer of the ball at the club that Bannan. 

 

Question for me is, with those 2 in MF, can we play like yesterday with FF and 2 more strikers? Very attack minded with wingbacks thrown in too - or do we need another MFer in there and play FF up top with one other?

[Essix Blue]

10 minutes ago, Jamie_W said:

Some pre/post Carlos stats to be incorporated too surely? There was more going on than Bannan missing.

 

Love the stat of game time given to the academy players under CC then under JL. Says so much. 

[StudentOwl]

2 minutes ago, Essix Blue said:

I think Pup is central to Jos’s plans next season due to his time on the pitch while he’s been here. I think he’s done well, and I think he’s suited to 3 CBs behind him. The like you say B.B. in midfield with him gives Baz a bit more scope - let’s be honest there isn’t a better passer of the ball at the club that Bannan. 

 

Question for me is, with those 2 in MF, can we play like yesterday with FF and 2 more strikers? Very attack minded with wingbacks thrown in too - or do we need another MFer in there and play FF up top with one other?

Was thinking this earlier today. To be fair, if he comes back the same sort of player as before his injury, Lee would be perfect

 

"Balanced" midfield 3: Bannan, FF, Joey

"Attack" midfield 3: Bannan, FF, Lee

"Defensive" midfield 3: Bannan, Lee, Joey

 

I know it isn't necessarily bringing in the other "top" imposing CM that I think we all kinda feel we need going forward, but if money is tight we could do a lot worse than just working with what we've got when planning out this specific formation. I'd be happy with any of those three combinations starting a game in a 5-3-2 formation. In games where a different formation is played... yeah, we may need to recruit one more physical and defensive CM...

[Essix Blue]

2 minutes ago, StudentOwl said:

Was thinking this earlier today. To be fair, if he comes back the same sort of player as before his injury, Lee would be perfect

 

"Balanced" midfield 3: Bannan, FF, Joey

"Attack" midfield 3: Bannan, FF, Lee

"Defensive" midfield 3: Bannan, Lee, Joey

 

I know it isn't necessarily bringing in the other "top" imposing CM that I think we all kinda feel we need going forward, but if money is tight we could do a lot worse than just working with what we've got when planning out this specific formation. I'd be happy with any of those three combinations starting a game in a 5-3-2 formation. In games where a different formation is played... yeah, we may need to recruit one more physical and defensive CM...

 

I’ll be honest, B.B. Lee and FF would leave me slightly nervous for our defending

[Bluey9]

Pretty sure he came back about the same time as Forestieri