Carlos to Stay!!!!

[Athelwulf]

1 hour ago, hazza88 said:

Attractive football got us to the final last year

 

But then we apporached it like we have the laat couple of games which left us in the championship

Yes, but Hull knew how to stop us. Arsenal play attractive football, but I doubt Hull would have stopped them. That's because Arsenal have got better players than us. What we got away with last season was never going to be repeated this. We were an unknown quantity, with a new manager and 15 new players.

[JanikowskiSWFC]

Listen, I'm ok with him staying, but people have to be realistic here. We don't have the quality needed yet to make top 2 when you consider the other teams that are going to be competing with us such as Fulham, RDG/HUD loser, Hull, etc. It's not going to be as easy as some people think and honestly, I wouldn't be shocked if we finish in the playoffs again unless we make some signings that actually make the team work, not 10 mil for a player who doesn't want to take a penalty in a playoff semi final.

[gurujuan]

47 minutes ago, Athelwulf said:

 

Yes. I think the mistake he made was to believe that he could play Hutch in defence, so no CB was signed. Then he discovered that he couldn't do without him in the middle. Let's say Carlos stays, and we want him to play open and offensively. Who's good enough, now we're no longer underestimated? It's a poser. Westwood is, Lees is, and the forwards are definitely. But the rest are going to divide opinion. We're not currently strong enough all-round to play as we did last season and go up. That's certain, and that's why Carlos has done what he's done. The way we played against Norwich is how he'd play every week if he could, but you'd need a better team than we've got to do that game in game out in this league.

 

I don't really know who is good enough, because I don't feel we've played in a way that's got the best out of them. The thing is, there's no one size fits all. We could play a system that could bring Abdi, Forestieri, and, if fit, Matias into play, but that would require playing two holding players and just the one striker. If we switched to a more orthodox 4-4-2, which might suit Winnall and Rhodes, then we don't have the right type of wingers or central midfielders. I feel we have to decide which way we are playing, then get the right players in and hone it to perfection. At the moment, this compromise suits no one

Edited May 18, 2017 by gurujuan

[19owl08]

1 minute ago, Athelwulf said:

 

Yes. I think the mistake he made was to believe that he could play Hutch in defence, so no CB was signed. Then he discovered that he couldn't do without him in the middle. Let's say Carlos stays, and we want him to play open and offensively. Who's good enough, now we're no longer underestimated? It's a poser. Westwood is, Lees is, and the forwards are definitely. But the rest are going to divide opinion. We're not currently strong enough all-round to play as we did last season and go up. That's certain, and that's why Carlos has done what he's done. The way we played against Norwich is how he'd play every week if he could, but you'd need a better team than we've got to do that game in game out in this league.

 

Agree with a lot of what you're saying. 

 

I think our start to the season wasn't helped by the final loss. It takes 2 weeks out of the players rest period. They then also have the psychological side of getting so close but not getting over the line. Majority of our players just didn't seem in form or fit.

 

Had we started the season strong, we most likely would have finished top 2. We have also had some key injuries to deal with.

 

People will read my posts tonight & think I'm a happy clapper. I'm not. I'm one of the biggest moaners around but I'm trying to look at things with a level head.

 

Carlos has showed he can get a team to play attractive attacking football. He can also get them to play & win ugly. He now needs to blend the two.

 

I would give him a 3rd season but it would be a promotion or bust season. The core of the squad is there, have a full pre season & find a formula.

[gurujuan]

38 minutes ago, 19owl08 said:

 

Agree with a lot of what you're saying. 

 

I think our start to the season wasn't helped by the final loss. It takes 2 weeks out of the players rest period. They then also have the psychological side of getting so close but not getting over the line. Majority of our players just didn't seem in form or fit.

 

Had we started the season strong, we most likely would have finished top 2. We have also had some key injuries to deal with.

 

People will read my posts tonight & think I'm a happy clapper. I'm not. I'm one of the biggest moaners around but I'm trying to look at things with a level head.

 

Carlos has showed he can get a team to play attractive attacking football. He can also get them to play & win ugly. He now needs to blend the two.

 

I would give him a 3rd season but it would be a promotion or bust season. The core of the squad is there, have a full pre season & find a formula.

 

Yes, this Personally, I don't think we need to look much further than our misguided recruitment in the summer, and again in January, to see why we weren't able to build on last seasons success. Better recruitment, might have meant we were able to marry our flair and creativity, to a more pragmatic approach. Definitely the way forward, as you say

[themaskedowl]

The debate is all well and good but remember it's not our decision to make so don't get too wound up in it. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by themaskedowl

[Guest hazza88]

25 minutes ago, Athelwulf said:

Yes, but Hull knew how to stop us. Arsenal play attractive football, but I doubt Hull would have stopped them. That's because Arsenal have got better players than us. What we got away with last season was never going to be repeated this. We were an unknown quantity, with a new manager and 15 new players.

You're right I can't disagree!

 

Just feel disappointed and over the last couple of game underwhelmed but a good season overall I just want more!!!

[19owl08]

There's a few rumours that Southampton want Carlos. Weird isn't it that he's no good for some of our fans but a Premiership team who generally get it right of late see something good in him.

 

If they are indeed after him & offer, I wouldn't blame Carlos for going.

[19owl08]

1 minute ago, hazza88 said:

You're right I can't disagree!

 

Just feel disappointed and over the last couple of game underwhelmed but a good season overall I just want more!!!

 

Fair play for admitting this!! I feel exactly

the same, I walked away from the ground thinking yes it's time he leaves.

 

But after a long thought & considering everything it just seems foolish & too risky to get rid of him. We only have more building to do if he goes.

[Owling Wolfe]

3 hours ago, Holmowl said:

You don't remember that Hooper wasn't a first pick early season?

 

It was FF/Fletch up top.

And, for me, that was the problem. FF is not a striker, he is better running at defenders from the wings.

[Elderly Owl]

Ok! Cold light of day and some semblance of rational thought will tell you that we were simply unlucky and the game might have gone either way. Had we not lost 7 players over 6 games (quite astonishing when you think about it because otherwise we may well have been in the automatic promotion places) had Hooper not been injured, had Wallace not been injured, had Abdi been available....we have been so unlucky but that (as they say) is the game we follow. Even then, an own goal from a cross that was off target! Just not our year I'm afraid!

 

Why don't all the bloody moaners stop sticking the boot into the best manager we've had in years and understand that sh*t happens sometimes. You have to build, It's not crap team + cash= instant fix. 

Grow up ! We lost and we move forward.

[slinger208b]

4 hours ago, Holmowl said:

 

Carlos doesn't learn.

 

Dont you see that by now?

 

He tried positive approach first season did well.

 

Changed it this season against the teams some fans unrealistically expected us to thrash when we lost and did better.

 

I'd say that's learning...

[edwinowl]

Dust settled for me and i said months ago if we didn't get up then he should go. 

Done a great job but came up short for me.  Let's be honest we haven't played that well as a whole. 

Still think this, it's time for someone new with fresh ideas. 

Look at Huddersfield with Wagner on a budget.  

Lets take our time get the right man in. 

Player recruitment is the only issue with delaying it. 

[james o connor]

I think Carlos is ready to try something new and somewhere else. For me it would suit both him and the club , I feel and it looks like he feels he's gone as far as he can 

[slinger208b]

5 hours ago, Athelwulf said:

I agree. But although we've got arguably the strongest forward line in the division, that's not matched in other areas of the field, especially defence. We were underestimated last season, but not this. If we want to get back to playing open, attacking football, that defence has got to be transformed. I understand why Carlos does what he does...it's just that it's not his game. He's on record as saying he'd rather win 10-9 than 1-0. If we'd wanted safety first, we'd have been better keeping Gray. Shift the dead wood, and start at the back. That back line wouldn't have a chance in the PL even if we did get promoted.

 

I'm for Carlos staying but the point about winning 10 9 over 1 0 doesn't sit right.

 

If they weren't just words why didn't he try that this session?..

 

[Stoop]

Not for me

 

He was at fault last night

 

Changed what had got us 6 wins on the spin, for a lineup and system that hasn't worked for the last 2 seasons

[j17tjp]

5 hours ago, Daavies; said:

All about opinions football. I think everyone is making rash and sudden statements tonight which in a few days time, may look back on in a different light. Let's just let the dust settle then re-evaluate in 2 weeks time with clearer heads.

 

The most sensible thing I've read since the match ended. 

 

I had a quick look last night on OT and saw tantrums (about Carlos FF Rhodes & Hutch etc) 

and decided just to go to bed & sleep on it. 

I still love Carlos, I still love Wednesday - I don't think bitching about our own lads is necessary, one team had to lose

(& we missed a golden opportunity in first leg to test a 21yr old inexperienced keeper... but I'm not dwelling on that, loads of ppl on here were praising the result of 0-0. )

 

We'll go again in a few months, but getting rid of our manager & star players would not be progressive. 

 

We're All Still Wednesday Aren't We ?

[Athelwulf]

Last season we often did play open attacking football. But are we good enough all round to do that and go up? The ex-PL teams have better all round players. So Baz would be six inches taller and 3 stones heavier, for example. Hooper would have pace, etc.

[shezzas left peg]

5 hours ago, Athelwulf said:

The problem is that to play attractive AND go up you've got to be a Newcastle/parachute club with better all-round players.

Brighton play a mix of both good positive stuff and solid defence. In this league you need a mix of both. Flair and creativity creates goals, defences keep clean sheets successful teams do both. For me Carlos has reached his level, as players do wich  I alluded to in another thread, he's made us a solid hard to beat top six side, I don't quite think he's at the level take us to that next level. 

Edited May 18, 2017 by shezzas left peg

[VictoryBell]

I wouldn't have Carlos's future at Hillsborough high on the agenda if I were Mr C but I might, if I were Carlos. He must be thinking "I've got a good rep at the moment in lots of important boardrooms in English football. If I don't win promotion in 2017/18 then that good rep will go down and - here or somewhere - I want to manage an English premiership club" (that seems to be the dream for most managers, it seems).

 

For Wednesday, it seems to me, this is a bit like the end of the 82/83 season when Big Jack was replaced by Wilkinson. He decided he had had enough of trying to get us into the 1st division (though I think his ambition was to spend more time fishing). Anyway, I think it was more his decision to go than the board's.

 

Not the same footballing world, 'tis true, but (blinding light of revelation bursts forth from the heavens) getting an outstanding replacement for a very effective manager was the masterstroke then and needs to be, now.

 

I would be very very sad to see Carlos go and I think that, under him and with Mr C's backing we can  and - very likely will - steamroller the championship next season, especially as there is nothing to fear from any of the clubs coming down from the premiership and we did the double over Newcastle this season, remember!

 

So, for what it's worth (nothing) I'm backing Carlos "until The Real Thing comes along" (cue for a song!)