So what was it last night then?

[northeastowl]

To me the players already look fed up of Pulis’ tactics. Every time Huddersfield had the ball we just sat off them, not one player moved towards the player with the ball. It was literally keep shape at all costs.

As soon as went 1-0 down we’d lost.

[Musn't Grumble]

3 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

He inherited the family silver, has dropped it on the floor, then tried picking it up and accidentally knocked it into a massive pile of dog poo, tripped over his own laces and tumbled to the ground and as he goes to pick the mucky silver up it gets run over by a tractor and then falls down a drain

 

 

 

He's certainly rattled it about a bit to see if the players respond and they clearly either haven't responded or they do not have the ability to respond.

 

Whether he can coach anything more out of them is looking doubtful.

 

For example, Windass playing up front on his own last night seemed disinterested. I've put more effort in running for the bus.

 

Whatever you think of Big Dave, he would have at least put a shift in by sprinting across the front line and pressing the defenders back to their own box. 

[SallyCinnamon]

1 minute ago, northeastowl said:

To me the players already look fed up of Pulis’ tactics. Every time Huddersfield had the ball we just sat off them, not one player moved towards the player with the ball. It was literally keep shape at all costs.

As soon as went 1-0 down we’d lost.

As soon as we go 1-0 down we’ve lost for the past two seasons. It’s not just under Pulis. We lose that game under Monk too. 

[@owlstalk]

2 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

As soon as we go 1-0 down we’ve lost for the past two seasons. It’s not just under Pulis. We lose that game under Monk too. 

 

 

Pulis was brought in to stop that happening - not make it happen more regularly

[blueandwhitematt]

I don't think the players lack effort from what I've seen since Pulis has come in.

 

I think we witnessed last night was a combination of a few things, including 1) as we've said for a while now, many of the players we have are wildly inconsistent.  You can't trust them to string two performances together, and when most of your squad is like that, you're asking for huge trouble.  2) they are clearly knackered - its no excuse, but Pulis doesn't remotely rate the back ups.  He might have no choice now but to throw some in - they can't do any worse and maybe one or two will surprise him given a chance?  3) although I don't think we lack effort, we do lack players going 'the extra yard' to either take the game by the scruff of the neck or make something happen.  When you don't have any of those in your squad, again you're in trouble. 4) leadership - there isn't any.  At all.

 

They looked lost last night.  We have a smattering of average Championship players, who I think could raise their game with some quality brought in around them.  We then have an even larger group of L1/L2 standard players, who there isn't much we can really work with.  You can trace the majority of our on-pitch issues to the horrendous recruitment we've done over the past few years - I think we've had 'worse' squads in recent history, but not any as lop-sided in terms of what any team actually needs.  

[gurujuan]

14 minutes ago, cowl said:

 

Teams at the bottom will usually get beaten by teams at the top no matter what they do. Obviously, when they do lose it's always the other tactical approach they should've gone with.

But again, you're just restating your objection to the approach. It's a different issue to that of assessing a single performance's success. The reality is that it absolutely wasn't the case that Norwich ‘were always going to find a way through’; we looked comfortable, and they, on the contrary looked to have run out of ideas.

 

I've watched many games in which when we have conceded I felt ‘it was coming’. It's frustratingly frequent and very familiar feeling so I know it full well. I didn't feel that at all when Norwich scored. Anger and annoyance as per usual at conceding, but not a sense of us only getting what we deserved.

Here I do agree, I was a little more optimistic that Norwich had run out of ideas, and we might just hang on. However, they do possess players who can produce a moment that Pulis sides aren’t set up to counter. They kept playing and probing, and eventually Vrancic found his radar and prized us open. 
Interestingly, at that point, did you think we would go upfield and regain the lead, or that we would concede again and surrender the points?

[Musn't Grumble]

6 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

Jos signed one player - Pelupessy - who didnt play last night.

 

Bruce, who always escapes these threads - signed Iorfa, Borner, Harris, Luongo - 4 who did.

 

Why does Steve Bruce always get away scot free in these threads?

 

 

 

Yes but Jos must surely have had opportunities for recruiting the right players - "his style" of players - but he obviously thought that the youngsters at the time we good enough when clearly they weren't.

[gurujuan]

Just now, Musn't Grumble said:

 

Yes but Jos must surely have had opportunities for recruiting the right players - "his style" of players - but he obviously thought that the youngsters at the time we good enough when clearly they weren't.

Jos signed Hector, probably one of the best signings in recent times

[@owlstalk]

Just now, Musn't Grumble said:

 but he obviously thought that the youngsters at the time we good enough when clearly they weren't.

Did he though?

Or was he told there was no cash because we were in deeeeep trouble financially?

[mcmigo]

2 minutes ago, Musn't Grumble said:

 

Yes but Jos must surely have had opportunities for recruiting the right players - "his style" of players - but he obviously thought that the youngsters at the time we good enough when clearly they weren't.

I believe DC offered to buy Jos Gareth Bale, Marcus Rashford, Harry Kane, Virjil Van Dijk - Jos, the old fool, said we were fine with Ash Baker, Jordam Thorniley, Matt Penney and Fraser Preston.

 

You live and learn I guess.

[SallyCinnamon]

Just now, @owlstalk said:

 

 

Pulis was brought in to stop that happening - not make it happen more regularly

Happen more regularly is wildly inaccurate. It’s not happening more regularly.

 

Games lost under Monk after going 1-0 down - Luton, Wycombe, Rotherham, Bristol City, Middlesbro, Fulham, Swansea, West Brom, Brentford, Derby, Reading, Luton, Blackburn, Hull. That’s all the games we’ve lost after going 1-0 down under Monk in 2020 (not including 2019). We’ve turned it round once against Bristol City after the restart from Covid. That is the only time we’ve bounced back from going a goal down in his entire tenure. 
 

It has happened twice under Pulis - Preston and Huddersfield. He has been in charge 6 games.

 

Saying it has started to happen more regularly is wildly inaccurate. 
 

 

[@owlstalk]

Just now, SallyCinnamon said:

 It has happened twice under Pulis - Preston and Huddersfield. He has been in charge 6 games. 

 

 

33% of games then

 

So more often 

[Musn't Grumble]

1 minute ago, @owlstalk said:

Did he though?

Or was he told there was no cash because we were in deeeeep trouble financially?

 

 

Alas! We may never know! (although he did appear to use the same policy at St Pauli, until he left there in the summer after pulling up no trees)

[SallyCinnamon]

1 minute ago, @owlstalk said:

 

 

33% of games then

 

So more often 

As I stated above you’re wrong. 
 

You can’t compare Pulis’ 6 games with Monk’s year and a bit in charge. 

[Musn't Grumble]

2 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

I believe DC offered to buy Jos Gareth Bale, Marcus Rashford, Harry Kane, Virjil Van Dijk - Jos, the old fool, said we were fine with Ash Baker, Jordam Thorniley, Matt Penney and Fraser Preston.

 

You live and learn I guess.

 

So how many head coaches/managers move to a club and make no changes to the playing or coaching staff?

[cowl]

6 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Here I do agree, I was a little more optimistic that Norwich had run out of ideas, and we might just hang on. However, they do possess players who can produce a moment that Pulis sides aren’t set up to counter. They kept playing and probing, and eventually Vrancic found his radar and prized us open. 
Interestingly, at that point, did you think we would go upfield and regain the lead, or that we would concede again and surrender the points?

 

I've watched far too many football games to know what to expect once we'd conceded. This is very common with all teams no matter how they'd set up hitherto. Especially when it's the home team in the ascendancy.

[@owlstalk]

8 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

As I stated above you’re wrong. 
 

You can’t compare Pulis’ 6 games with Monk’s year and a bit in charge. 

I'm happy to settle for hearing you tell me ONE improvement that Pulis has made since arriving then.

 

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, Musn't Grumble said:

 

Yes but Jos must surely have had opportunities for recruiting the right players - "his style" of players - but he obviously thought that the youngsters at the time we good enough when clearly they weren't.

 

I thought we were under serious financial constraints and even an embargo during at least one window that Jos was here for, recruitment cant really be blamed on him.  

[striker]

13 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

As I stated above you’re wrong. 
 

You can’t compare Pulis’ 6 games with Monk’s year and a bit in charge. 

Why?

 

How do we assess Pulis tenure then? 

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, cowl said:

 

I've watched far too many football games to know what to expect once we'd conceded. This is very common with all teams no matter how they'd set up hitherto. Especially when it's the home team in the ascendancy.

 

I don't think it is that common for teams leading 1-0 to concede 2 goals in the last 10 minutes. It certainly seems more common in terms of happening to us than to us and definitely in relation to us doing it to other teams.