Westwood & Hutchinson

[Guest LondonOwl313]

Just now, billyblack said:

Fergie just transfer listed them. Beckham, Stam, didnt Keane happen that way as well? Not much point transfer listing Hutch as window is shut and hes out of contract in summer. Dropped him from squad, what else can he do.

Think Keane was basically pulled into a room and told he was going and then he left on a free on a week later. The Hutch thing has been going on since December, if his decision was made on him then, would have made sense for him to go in January whether that’s paid off or sold on to another club. He needs to say that he won’t play again while I’m manager for this reason.. or if that’s not the case, and the door is open, what actually needs to happen.. we’ve just taken 5 points from the last 9 games against poor teams. I just can’t imagine a Bruce, Big Ron or SAF conducting the type of press conferences on these issues that Monk does

[The only way is S6]

4 minutes ago, billyblack said:

Fergie just transfer listed them. Beckham, Stam, didnt Keane happen that way as well? Not much point transfer listing Hutch as window is shut and hes out of contract in summer. Dropped him from squad, what else can he do.

Fergie is the benchmark. Look at those names / personalities.

Shown the door. 

[Offside_Owl]

6 minutes ago, The only way is S6 said:

And where did fatty Ross’s career go after that? I can’t remember a queue to sign him. 

Let's see where these two go next. 

[The only way is S6]

Just now, Offside_Owl said:

Let's see where these two go next. 

I think KW will get a good deal with another decent club tbh.

Hutch? Maybe an average championship club around London. If they’re not playing for us regardless, we might as well spend the £x thousands wages on new players. 

[Guest]

9 hours ago, SiJ said:

It is also worth remembering that Westwood was crap this season and Hutchinson often ends up playing far too deep. 

 

Basically, we need to move on from these two. 

 

Long-term I agree but currently we have a goalkeeper in poor form and midfielders like Lee who is sadly no longer up to it regularly and Pelupessy who has sadly never been up to it.

The short-term is we are in trouble if we get a points deduction and need to make use of what we have available. 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Ian said:

But the facts are that the ball ends up in our net more often when Westwood plays than when Dawson does

 

Their records this season are almost identical. Dawson was way ahead - Westwood rightly got replaced when his form dropped........

[billyblack]

1 hour ago, The only way is S6 said:

Fergie is the benchmark. Look at those names / personalities.

Shown the door. 

Quite right. Dont care how good you are. Out of line, out of team. Thats the way ir has to be

[billyblack]

8 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Long-term I agree but currently we have a goalkeeper in poor form and midfielders like Lee who is sadly no longer up to it regularly and Pelupessy who has sadly never been up to it.

The short-term is we are in trouble if we get a points deduction and need to make use of what we have available. 

Not if the other players available are out of line. Absolutely not. 

[billyblack]

1 hour ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Think Keane was basically pulled into a room and told he was going and then he left on a free on a week later. The Hutch thing has been going on since December, if his decision was made on him then, would have made sense for him to go in January whether that’s paid off or sold on to another club. He needs to say that he won’t play again while I’m manager for this reason.. or if that’s not the case, and the door is open, what actually needs to happen.. we’ve just taken 5 points from the last 9 games against poor teams. I just can’t imagine a Bruce, Big Ron or SAF conducting the type of press conferences on these issues that Monk does

Maybe not. But hes made his position clear and thats that. No ambiguity there. 

[Steve Down South]

11 hours ago, theowlsman said:

 

Principles or points.

 

Hmmmm, it’s a difficult one.

I’d go for principles every time, totally fed up with short term sticking plaster solutions.  Having said that, my principles might have been tested if these two were top players but they are not.  Westwood maybe 2 or 3 seasons ago, but not now, and don’t think Hutchinson has ever justified the tag - whole-hearted but limited in midfield.

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, billyblack said:

Not if the other players available are out of line. Absolutely not. 

 

Just tell us what is so bad to never pick them again then. 

Hutchinson was arguably man of the match the last time he played, also the last time we won.

[oldishowl]

It’s easy this football lark.

 

Fall out with the manager, refuse to do the job he asks you to do , have a row because you have not been offered a new contract or whatever has happened , doesn’t matter I will just stay at home and pick x thousands a week up.

 

What a job.

[bobness]

1 hour ago, The only way is S6 said:

Fergie is the benchmark. Look at those names / personalities.

Shown the door. 

 

It takes balls 

[owlsdreamer]

12 hours ago, WAWAWUTO17 said:

Westwood situation obvious. Out of contract at the end of the season and weve no intentions of renewing it. Better for Dawson to play. 

 

Hutchinson out of contract also. However I do think he should be playing regardless of us renewing his contract. Still the best CDM at the club.

Both being Paid mega bucks in the meantime.

Its formed a pattern over time..Westwood seems to think he can please himself

 

 

[DJMortimer]

1 hour ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Think Keane was basically pulled into a room and told he was going and then he left on a free on a week later. The Hutch thing has been going on since December, if his decision was made on him then, would have made sense for him to go in January whether that’s paid off or sold on to another club. He needs to say that he won’t play again while I’m manager for this reason.. or if that’s not the case, and the door is open, what actually needs to happen.. we’ve just taken 5 points from the last 9 games against poor teams. I just can’t imagine a Bruce, Big Ron or SAF conducting the type of press conferences on these issues that Monk does

 

You seem to have made your mind up who is to blame (and absolutely exclusively) and are judging everything through that prism. The fact is, you have no idea who has said or done what, and without that information you are essentially guessing on the basis of nothing but prejudice. It's quite possible you are spectacularly wrong. I'm not pretending to know any better than you, but there does at least seem to be a precedent for these two players in the fairly recent past.

[billyblack]

28 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Just tell us what is so bad to never pick them again then. 

Hutchinson was arguably man of the match the last time he played, also the last time we won.

I dont know, i wasnt there.  Its between Monk and Hutchinson. If Monk thinks hes crossed the line the fair enough. Who are we to say otherwise.

[Guest LondonOwl313]

8 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

You seem to have made your mind up who is to blame (and absolutely exclusively) and are judging everything through that prism. The fact is, you have no idea who has said or done what, and without that information you are essentially guessing on the basis of nothing but prejudice. It's quite possible you are spectacularly wrong. I'm not pretending to know any better than you, but there does at least seem to be a precedent for these two players in the fairly recent past.

My point isn’t who has or hasn’t done what.. it’s about transparency so we can move on from the situation. If they’ve done things that mean they shouldn’t ever be selected for the club again then so be it.. but we need to know. It serves nobody well to have calls for them to come back after every poor performance from Dawson or Pelupessy. And unless we’re told categorically what’s going on then people will call for it

[billyblack]

9 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

My point isn’t who has or hasn’t done what.. it’s about transparency so we can move on from the situation. If they’ve done things that mean they shouldn’t ever be selected for the club again then so be it.. but we need to know. It serves nobody well to have calls for them to come back after every poor performance from Dawson or Pelupessy. And unless we’re told categorically what’s going on then people will call for it

We dont need to know. We found about fergies stuff in books afterwards.

[83owl]

2 hours ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Yeah we don’t.. but the management of it is poor. Monk shouldn’t be dropping veiled hints at stuff in press conferences, it’s just demotivating for the players. 
 

Sir Alex would deal with it either by having it out with the player behind the scenes and moving on by putting an arm around them like Cantona, or he’d say no player is bigger than the club and they’d be out ASAP, and it would be sorted quickly. What we’ve kind of done here is left things ambiguous, nobody knows what’s going on.. is he staying or going, if he’s off, why didn’t he go in January or why haven’t the contracts being paid up. Need to be decisive and clear on why stuff is happening.. this is just limbo

Monk hasn’t got the choice to just get rid of players. The players fergie got rid of were top level players, generally they want to play so they will move on.
 

First of all nobody will pay KW or SH anywhere near what they get here and second we have a chairman that doesn’t sell “family”. Monk is stuck either way.

[DJMortimer]

1 hour ago, LondonOwl313 said:

My point isn’t who has or hasn’t done what.. it’s about transparency so we can move on from the situation. If they’ve done things that mean they shouldn’t ever be selected for the club again then so be it.. but we need to know. It serves nobody well to have calls for them to come back after every poor performance from Dawson or Pelupessy. And unless we’re told categorically what’s going on then people will call for it

 

I'm constantly bemused by the complete naivety and lack of realism (and in some cases self-righteousness) when it comes to demands for the club to conduct it's business in that kind of way. As we don't know what has (or hasn't) happened, then how can we so earnestly provide counsel on the best way to deal with it?