ArmchairOwl Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 minute ago, Mishowl said: So he's lying? I wouldn't know. Do politicians lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairOwl Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Just now, Mishowl said: So you don't believe what he says but you don't know if he is lying.......OK. It might be true, it might not be, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairOwl Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 minute ago, Mishowl said: So you initially said you didn't think it was true and now you are saying it might be.......OK. I said I don't believe everything I hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystic Neg Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Owling said: If people above Carlos are signing players that Carlos doesn't want, then Carlos probably won't play them. Player signings IMO should be left to the manager. But if the guys above Carlos are signing them without consulting him they must expect Carlos to play them and demand that he does. If they can't do that they've either got a backwards process or the wrong coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmchairOwl Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 3 minutes ago, OutspokenTom said: But if the guys above Carlos are signing them without consulting him they must expect Carlos to play them and demand that he does. If they can't do that they've either got a backwards process or the wrong coach. Makes sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmowl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 2 hours ago, pgmetcalf said: Thing that stumps me most is that we get a free kick in their half and pass it back into our half instead of hoofing it near their box. What's worse is that we pass it back and then hoof it, why? Yep Im stumped by that one too. If we had Hansen and Koeman as CBs I would just about understand why we pass it back from advanced free-kicks and throw-ins, but to,pass it all the way back to Lees, Loovens and Westwood to lump it forward beggars belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmowl Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 3 hours ago, HirstWhoScoredIt said: I don't rate Carlos, I have made this clear. I think a top manager would've got us promoted last season. However, that is just my opinion. I can't prove I'm right, nobody can prove I'm wrong. Opinions about faster tempo, different formations, lack of pace, team selection, favoured players etc etc are again simply that - opinions. However there are two things that I just simply cannot get my head around. 1. Numerous people on here (me included) said before the Preston match that it would be absolute madness to pick Hutch. Until we signed a new centre half - he had to be wrapped in cotton wool! This is just basic management theory - risk v reward. The potential risks of playing him were large. The rewards of playing him were few when Jones is a perfectly capable deputy. How on earth can Carlos justify having to play a Pudil at centre half because of this choice that he made? We could see it! Why couldn't he? 2. The signings last season made virtually nil impact. When it really counted in the play offs he basically reverted to the 'Wembley team'. With that in mind, the signings this season had to make a difference. He assures us that Boyd was his top target. Boyd played in nearly all of the pre-season matches. Boyd started at Preston. Boyd has started nearly every match for Burnley over the past three seasons. Two of these in the PL and the other in a promotion winning team. Yet after just one match, he has dropped his only signing for the last three matches. I am absolutely baffled by these two things. There is no obvious clear strategy, clear thinking or clear process. I have no faith in Carlos and win, lose or draw at Fulham - he should be sacked. He isn't going to get us promoted. Great post. You put put so clearly what I have in my head, but gets scrambled when I put finger to keyboard. As for clear strategy, does he gave a clear strategy on who on earth to partner consistently out of his four (he thinks he has 5 sadly) strikers? That one is a real mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOT jack whitham Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 7 hours ago, HirstWhoScoredIt said: I don't rate Carlos, I have made this clear. I think a top manager would've got us promoted last season. However, that is just my opinion. I can't prove I'm right, nobody can prove I'm wrong. Opinions about faster tempo, different formations, lack of pace, team selection, favoured players etc etc are again simply that - opinions. However there are two things that I just simply cannot get my head around. 1. Numerous people on here (me included) said before the Preston match that it would be absolute madness to pick Hutch. Until we signed a new centre half - he had to be wrapped in cotton wool! This is just basic management theory - risk v reward. The potential risks of playing him were large. The rewards of playing him were few when Jones is a perfectly capable deputy. How on earth can Carlos justify having to play a Pudil at centre half because of this choice that he made? We could see it! Why couldn't he? 2. The signings last season made virtually nil impact. When it really counted in the play offs he basically reverted to the 'Wembley team'. With that in mind, the signings this season had to make a difference. He assures us that Boyd was his top target. Boyd played in nearly all of the pre-season matches. Boyd started at Preston. Boyd has started nearly every match for Burnley over the past three seasons. Two of these in the PL and the other in a promotion winning team. Yet after just one match, he has dropped his only signing for the last three matches. I am absolutely baffled by these two things. There is no obvious clear strategy, clear thinking or clear process. I have no faith in Carlos and win, lose or draw at Fulham - he should be sacked. He isn't going to get us promoted. 7 hours ago, HirstWhoScoredIt said: I don't rate Carlos, I have made this clear. I think a top manager would've got us promoted last season. However, that is just my opinion. I can't prove I'm right, nobody can prove I'm wrong. Opinions about faster tempo, different formations, lack of pace, team selection, favoured players etc etc are again simply that - opinions. However there are two things that I just simply cannot get my head around. 1. Numerous people on here (me included) said before the Preston match that it would be absolute madness to pick Hutch. Until we signed a new centre half - he had to be wrapped in cotton wool! This is just basic management theory - risk v reward. The potential risks of playing him were large. The rewards of playing him were few when Jones is a perfectly capable deputy. How on earth can Carlos justify having to play a Pudil at centre half because of this choice that he made? We could see it! Why couldn't he? 2. The signings last season made virtually nil impact. When it really counted in the play offs he basically reverted to the 'Wembley team'. With that in mind, the signings this season had to make a difference. He assures us that Boyd was his top target. Boyd played in nearly all of the pre-season matches. Boyd started at Preston. Boyd has started nearly every match for Burnley over the past three seasons. Two of these in the PL and the other in a promotion winning team. Yet after just one match, he has dropped his only signing for the last three matches. I am absolutely baffled by these two things. There is no obvious clear strategy, clear thinking or clear process. I have no faith in Carlos and win, lose or draw at Fulham - he should be sacked. He isn't going to get us promoted. Top post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobness Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 7 hours ago, Owling said: If people above Carlos are signing players that Carlos doesn't want, then Carlos probably won't play them. If this were true then DC is an absolute nutter, as he continues to approve massive wage packets for players who likely won't make it onto the pitch (based on Carlos' track record over the previous two seasons). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinger208b Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 7 hours ago, HirstWhoScoredIt said: I don't rate Carlos, I have made this clear. I think a top manager would've got us promoted last season. However, that is just my opinion. I can't prove I'm right, nobody can prove I'm wrong. Opinions about faster tempo, different formations, lack of pace, team selection, favoured players etc etc are again simply that - opinions. However there are two things that I just simply cannot get my head around. 1. Numerous people on here (me included) said before the Preston match that it would be absolute madness to pick Hutch. Until we signed a new centre half - he had to be wrapped in cotton wool! This is just basic management theory - risk v reward. The potential risks of playing him were large. The rewards of playing him were few when Jones is a perfectly capable deputy. How on earth can Carlos justify having to play a Pudil at centre half because of this choice that he made? We could see it! Why couldn't he? 2. The signings last season made virtually nil impact. When it really counted in the play offs he basically reverted to the 'Wembley team'. With that in mind, the signings this season had to make a difference. He assures us that Boyd was his top target. Boyd played in nearly all of the pre-season matches. Boyd started at Preston. Boyd has started nearly every match for Burnley over the past three seasons. Two of these in the PL and the other in a promotion winning team. Yet after just one match, he has dropped his only signing for the last three matches. I am absolutely baffled by these two things. There is no obvious clear strategy, clear thinking or clear process. I have no faith in Carlos and win, lose or draw at Fulham - he should be sacked. He isn't going to get us promoted. I don't understand your point about hutch. I'm reading that wrapping him in cotton wool means don't select him. Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthndav Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) I have no evidence but I've sometimes thought we brought players that could potentially be dangerous if other teams acquired them. A spoiling tactic if you will. Or I'm giving far too much credence to a clear lack of strategy. Afterall, even the most coincidental events start to form patterns that could be seen to be a strategy if viewed over a long period of time. Edited August 17, 2017 by Anthndav Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HirstWhoScoredIt Posted August 17, 2017 Author Share Posted August 17, 2017 7 minutes ago, slinger208b said: I don't understand your point about hutch. I'm reading that wrapping him in cotton wool means don't select him. Why not? In case we end up playing Pudil at centre half???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quinnssweetshop Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 talent unused, wasted, out of position, black balled, stifled..... need I go on ? And some fools on here are celebrating last nights result. He has to go, and soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulva Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 The team, squad and club is going to have to take 1 step back to take 2 steps forward. We need a clear out, starting with FF. Some youth, energy needed etc. Ship out or pay off the likes of FF, Nuhui, Joao, Matias, Abdi, McGugan etc and get a load of kids out on loan. Might take us a season to adjust, but the squad needs to evolve. It's stale. We played well 2nd half yesterday, but this team peaked around the time of the playoff semis against Brighton, and we haven't got any better, whilst those around us have. Weve re come a long way in the last 3 years. It's time to kick on again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brando17 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 8 hours ago, HirstWhoScoredIt said: I don't rate Carlos, I have made this clear. I think a top manager would've got us promoted last season. However, that is just my opinion. I can't prove I'm right, nobody can prove I'm wrong. Opinions about faster tempo, different formations, lack of pace, team selection, favoured players etc etc are again simply that - opinions. However there are two things that I just simply cannot get my head around. 1. Numerous people on here (me included) said before the Preston match that it would be absolute madness to pick Hutch. Until we signed a new centre half - he had to be wrapped in cotton wool! This is just basic management theory - risk v reward. The potential risks of playing him were large. The rewards of playing him were few when Jones is a perfectly capable deputy. How on earth can Carlos justify having to play a Pudil at centre half because of this choice that he made? We could see it! Why couldn't he? 2. The signings last season made virtually nil impact. When it really counted in the play offs he basically reverted to the 'Wembley team'. With that in mind, the signings this season had to make a difference. He assures us that Boyd was his top target. Boyd played in nearly all of the pre-season matches. Boyd started at Preston. Boyd has started nearly every match for Burnley over the past three seasons. Two of these in the PL and the other in a promotion winning team. Yet after just one match, he has dropped his only signing for the last three matches. I am absolutely baffled by these two things. There is no obvious clear strategy, clear thinking or clear process. I have no faith in Carlos and win, lose or draw at Fulham - he should be sacked. He isn't going to get us promoted. very good post and unfortunately all true!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 38 minutes ago, slinger208b said: I don't understand your point about hutch. I'm reading that wrapping him in cotton wool means don't select him. Why not? I know Jones has his critics particularly on here but he's a proven player at this level as his CV suggests. Because of Hutch's injury issues, Jones ends up playing most of pre-season alongside Bannan, just like Pudil plays most of pre-season alongside Lees in Defence because of Loovens' problems then hey ho come Preston, Loovens and Hutch are straight back in undercooked and we get the performance and result that we did. Carlos reverts to Jones and Pudil against Chesterfield, we play well and win comfortably. You would expect more of the same against QPR. Oh no he reverts to type and neither player lasts the first half. I know it's not ideal with Pudil playing at centre half but with him and Jones playing we've looked a bit more like it. Now don't get me wrong Loovens and Hutch are top players and are a big reason why we are now where we are as a side but Carlos can't rely on them to play regularly and as has already being pointed out, chopping and changing for the sake of it clearly stops us from creating any momentum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 8 hours ago, Mishowl said: Carlos has reiterated on a number of occasions that he has the final say on transfers. Ive read a few times that Carlos makes suggestions but DC has the final say on transfers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 38 minutes ago, vulva said: The team, squad and club is going to have to take 1 step back to take 2 steps forward. We need a clear out, starting with FF. Some youth, energy needed etc. Ship out or pay off the likes of FF, Nuhui, Joao, Matias, Abdi, McGugan etc and get a load of kids out on loan. Might take us a season to adjust, but the squad needs to evolve. It's stale. We played well 2nd half yesterday, but this team peaked around the time of the playoff semis against Brighton, and we haven't got any better, whilst those around us have. Weve re come a long way in the last 3 years. It's time to kick on again. I think this might be right. I was happy to keep things together in the summer on the basis that there was the opportunity to bring in 4/5 players and keep things fresh. I think CC has tried to change things and whilst he is due criticism he now gets the kitchen sink thrown at him. You never really know the reaction to two play off defeats but so far we don't look as robust as Brighton did. On the one hand I think let's see where we are at after the window closes and a stronger defence may help. On the other I just think that the majority of fans have reached that point where it is bordering on unhealthy for the club and a change of manager whether it is Carlos's fault or not, might reduce the tension levels somewhat during games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldGigsChris Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Bluesteel said: Ive read a few times that Carlos makes suggestions but DC has the final say on transfers. So CC targets who he wants and DC decides whether he pays the cash? I've heard other managers say that the chairman asks them to give them names and values against them. Then the chair/negotiator gets the best player from them list for the best money. Do you reckon that's happening here? As discussed heavily above, I've also heard CC saying that he picks who we buy, but I'm also not sure whether I believe him or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Just now, Mishowl said: DC negotiates the contracts which is what you would expect. I've no doubt DC will pull the plug if wage demands are too high but this suggestion (not by you) that Carlos is simply handed players he does not want is, according to Carlos' interviews at least, rubbish. Does anyone really think he would still be in a job if DC (or whoever) was signing random players on big wages but Carlos was refusing to play them? I think it is a mix of both. On the whole Carlos provides his list of targets and presumably we go for them. So on the whole it is carlos if that's the case. I suspect Mcgugan, Rhodes potentially Urby might have been gifts from the chairman though. There was a lot of fan clamour around two of them. Prior to that the committee caused a few issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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