DEFENSIVE FOOTBALL

[Rob100]

I think we all agree with this analysis of the players and manager but what Lee is saying is that right at this moment all our efforts as a fan base should be directed towards getting the stooges out or we wont have a club to debate about. LETS JUST GET OUR WEDNESDAY BACK !!!!!!!!!!

[BRADDAZ]

If anyone thinks the players have showed no effort in these games then they've obviously got eyes painted on. One thing you cannot throw at the majority of this team is a lack of effort.

And it's not the boards fault that he persists with O'Connor & Potter, whilst moving the voted best player in the division in August out on the left wing.

It's also not their fault that a 30+ year old midfielder, who's played at a good level all his career in centre midfield, is chucked on the left wing, despite being one of only a few players in the squad with genuine quality.

It's also not their fault that Jones at left back on Saturday in the first half and Otsemebor all game last night were reluctant to overlap and get forward.

It's not the boards fault that Irvine set up the team like he did down at Plymouth. I honestly don't know what he was playing... Mellor left? Sedgwick as an attacking right winger? O'Connor & Potter... again?

The board have poo poo loads to answer for and they're without doubt the massive reason we're in the flipping state we're in. But one thing you cannot level at them is the complete and utter throw being served up to us on the pitch since Irvine took charge.

[Beholder]

I think we all agree with this analysis of the players and manager but what Lee is saying is that right at this moment all our efforts as a fan base should be directed towards getting the stooges out or we wont have a club to debate about. LETS JUST GET OUR WEDNESDAY BACK !!!!!!!!!!

But the are already out, so we are knocking on an open door.

We are also told by HW that the demands the loan note holders are making are not excessive and take into consideration the financial situation at the club.

Lee Strafford says this is not the case and the loan note holders are making excessive demands.

We need to know the truth on this matter before we can start protesting don't you think?

In the meantime, Irvine has shown nothing since he arrived to make us believe he can turn this areound. The main priority in my eyes is to get rid of him.

[Beholder]

If anyone thinks the players have showed no effort in these games then they've obviously got eyes painted on. One thing you cannot throw at the majority of this team is a lack of effort.

And it's not the boards fault that he persists with O'Connor & Potter, whilst moving the voted best player in the division in August out on the left wing.

It's also not their fault that a 30+ year old midfielder, who's played at a good level all his career in centre midfield, is chucked on the left wing, despite being one of only a few players in the squad with genuine quality.

It's also not their fault that Jones at left back on Saturday in the first half and Otsemebor all game last night were reluctant to overlap and get forward.

It's not the boards fault that Irvine set up the team like he did down at Plymouth. I honestly don't know what he was playing... Mellor left? Sedgwick as an attacking right winger? O'Connor & Potter... again?

The board have poo poo loads to answer for and they're without doubt the massive reason we're in the flipping state we're in. But one thing you cannot level at them is the complete and utter throw being served up to us on the pitch since Irvine took charge.

[Lee Strafford]

23rd July 2010 - News breaks Sheffield Wednesday served winding up order.

Lost 2-0 Barnsley

Lost 1-0 Doncaster

Won 2-0 D & R

Won 1-0 Bury

11th August 2010 - High Court - Part paid - DELAYED

Drew 1-1 Colchester

Won 1-0 Brighton

Lost 4-2 Sflaphorpe

Won 5-0 Harltepool

Won 1-0 Notts County

Lost 1-0 Brentford

8th September 2010 - High Court - PAID

Lost 1-0 Carlisle

Lost 3-2 Plymouth

Lost 1-0 Southampton

Drew 0-0 Oldham

So its suggested that we started playing badly when the tax bill was paid, but not when the news first broke or when the hearing was delayed for a month because we couldn't afford it? I think that's a load of poo poo.

The one constant though - is the poo poo we have watched under Irvine that goes a lot further back than the pre-season friendlies.

Now we are getting somewhere. Put all the pre-season games in.

Now put in the date of when the winding up order was lodged.

Now put in the date of when Lee Grant was sold.

Now put in the date of when Club9 & Dennis Hobson were told that they were wasting their time (because of the American deal that was going to close by the end of August) as the club was not interested in anything less than a £10m deal.

&

Now go back and read and listen to what the club said from July 23rd onwards. Do you think that the players and staff were told something different to the propaganda that we were fed???

Try this one - when (in advance of the court date) do you think the players and staff were told that the (American) investment had fallen through and we were in the poo poo???

Or even this one - Is Howard lying in the statement of "If I were not he this club would be in admin next week"????

If you think this is all a load of poo poo then we are truly lost as no one will ever being able to build our club back up as we are not capable of participating in any such journey.

Regards

Lee

[BRADDAZ]

A couple of simple questions Lee, if you'd be so kind to answer.

1) Do you think the players have put 100% effort into the last two home game?

2) Do you still think they wanted to win the last two home games?

[Guest madforitowl]

Instead of arguing with me without even thinking go look at palaces points per game before and during admin.

You will then realise how wrong you are - god only hopes that the rest of the grown ups acting no different than that moron screaming "but teale has got a bentley" will wake up too.

One last time - Stop being flippingstupid!!!!!!!!!!! Pre brentford was for us the same event as when palace and Portsmouth went into admin. Ignore this and keep behaving like so many of us are now and we will be proper fooked as we will not pull our club out of admin and we will not work with any new owner.

Stop throwing poo poo arround about the quality of play as we were all gonna be unhappy until we were watching Hirst sheridan and waddle again - the issue is that the players collectively are not applying themselves the way they were before the poo poo hit the fan and that lost the games and now there is a confidence problem and our reaction is to hammer them when they were not the ones that fooked it all up.

I am telling you this from a position of knowledge and having the inside track at all levels of the club (and bang upto date).

No we do not get to claim that we are ignorant of off field matters effecting on field as that is the whole flipping story of what fooked up our club and we have all seen so many other clubs go the same way.

FFS - man up and be proper Yorkshire not the poisonous poo I have been watching this past few weeks. Support the staff and players and make sure that change is effected at the top of our club. Our energies should be focused at demanding that new owners are fast tracked in (not held back by unreasonable demands) and that in the absence of this a new regime is in place to take us through and out of admin.

Regards

Lee

Couldnt be arsed to read the rest of thread but lee stop talking crap for once. You have dropped a you know what by bringing mr negative to the club and you know it. Palace by the way lost a lot of players in the period of admin so stop making out it was because of the off field problems. Lose your better players and you start losing more games thats what happened to palace. And before you come back at me saying admin money probs dont help i actually agree but not to the extent we are perforning.

Lee you may be a very good business man that im not doubting but because you was chairman for a brief time dosnt make you a expert on footy. Beacuse lets clear a few things up and thats one we have not played any good footy this season at all we have a manager who has not got a clue about playing proper football and a manager who has no motavational skills at all. And secondly while ever he stays we have more a chance of going down than staying up.

[dorian gray]

Lee I honestly believe you appointed AI in good faith at the time because he was one of, if not the best candidate available to us (I'm sure also that you would take others council in this matter). I was at the time lead to believe that the majority of other candidates were, lets say less enthusiastic about the job if the club did not have any new financial backing or investment. As far as I'm concerned if you gave it your best shot from what was available then we have to live with that, if we had played 10 and won 10 there would be of course none of this, and you may, or may not have been praised for it. Sadly it is not so, AI appears to have signed some quality players the likes we have not seen for some years, Mellor, Morrison, Heffernan, to name but 3, add to that Weaver and Coke and the quality of squad compared to last seasons is much better, and for that we must all thank those involved in the season ticket sales push to raise the revenue. However, to buy what appears to be a number of quality ground playing footballers in, and then play long ball tactics without a proper target man seems to me to beggar all belief, needed to support such a target man in this method of football is or are 1 or 2 forwards with proper sprint pace to get to the knock on or breakdown ball, the rest of the side needs to be fit and raring to go to win the majority of the 50/50's. If you don't believe me ask HW, probably in my opinion one of the best exponents of the more direct game, which allowed us to wreak havoc during his managerial years at s6. But AI has bought 2 slow wingmen who can't beat a fullback in Teale, and Sedgwick, from what i've seen of them they may not even be able to remember beating a fullback on the outside, these are the wrong type of player for this style of game. At the start of the season I said to a friend, and on here that I couldn't see how we were going to supply quality ball to the forwards, as it turns out we are now supplying next to no ball at all. Whilst watching the D&R game and seeing Tudgay used as a target man I thought well this isn't pretty but so far so good (I'm not too bothered about the need for 20+ passes to get to their penalty area), however I did wonder what plan B was if Tudgay was out, or if the opposition stopped his knock ons. Two slow wingmen, a lightly built target man, and what I thought was a side that at that point hadn't yet looked fully fit, I could see from the stands that we weren't unbeatable, at least this tactic wasn't. A month or so later after some hairy moments against Colchester and Brighton we were treat to the horror show at Brentford where we were found out to say the least, this followed up by Carlisle, Plymouth, and Southampton. With the exception of the Hartlepool freak result of 4 shots for 5 goals, the chickens had fully come home to roost. Still after what is now a month of fruitless attempts to continue with the same tactic we find ourselves in serious trouble, a good many Wednesdayites on here and in the ground are seriously concerned about AI, and what he has planned next, or even if anything at all is planned. By all means point out the present boards position in the situation at the club, and your belief (and a good many others too) that the sooner new owners are in the better, but, in no way can AI find much solace in pointing a finger in the direction of the board for what is going on in the field of play, the coincidence of our fall off in results with the tax payment situation (and morale) is very little, it is far more likely that opposition scouts saw our tactic cupboard was empty other than basic Sunday morning football, and the fall in morale is more likely decent players thinking this guy knows nothing, and that guy being AI.

[Plonk]

Lee Appreciate you are trying to back your man , and I have no doubt that all the off field stuff is having an effect.

But we will have to agree to disagree on Irvines ability. Its not proving to be a good apointment. Maybe when this poo poo is over (if it ever is) I (we) will be proved wrong and AI will turn out to b a great manager and HMSPTL will be back in full sail

I hope so but doubt it.

[SiJ]

Now we are getting somewhere. Put all the pre-season games in.

Now put in the date of when the winding up order was lodged.

Now put in the date of when Lee Grant was sold.

Now put in the date of when Club9 & Dennis Hobson were told that they were wasting their time (because of the American deal that was going to close by the end of August) as the club was not interested in anything less than a £10m deal.

&

Now go back and read and listen to what the club said from July 23rd onwards. Do you think that the players and staff were told something different to the propaganda that we were fed???

Try this one - when (in advance of the court date) do you think the players and staff were told that the (American) investment had fallen through and we were in the poo poo???

Or even this one - Is Howard lying in the statement of "If I were not he this club would be in admin next week"????

If you think this is all a load of poo poo then we are truly lost as no one will ever being able to build our club back up as we are not capable of participating in any such journey.

Regards

Lee

Explain the crap that we were served up last season.

AI wins 5 out of 7 and then it all goes so wrong.

Explain that one then.

What off the pitch incident triggered us getting relegated with a whimper?

The 1.5 million right?

You appointed AI to keep us up.

Or are you trying to tell me that AI never had a chance of keeping us up.

If so, why offer the manager a 3.5 year contract?

He seemingly had no chance according to you.

If it was such a hopeless cause then you should have left Sean Mac in charge.

[BRADDAZ]

your wasting your time braddaz i have asked nicely twice to him to answer 2 simple questions but has not answerd them. avoiding or skirting round them u decide.

A simple Yes or No answer will do Lee. Cheers.

[Guest]

Now we are getting somewhere. Put all the pre-season games in.

Now put in the date of when the winding up order was lodged.

Now put in the date of when Lee Grant was sold.

Now put in the date of when Club9 & Dennis Hobson were told that they were wasting their time (because of the American deal that was going to close by the end of August) as the club was not interested in anything less than a £10m deal.

&

Now go back and read and listen to what the club said from July 23rd onwards. Do you think that the players and staff were told something different to the propaganda that we were fed???

Try this one - when (in advance of the court date) do you think the players and staff were told that the (American) investment had fallen through and we were in the poo poo???

Or even this one - Is Howard lying in the statement of "If I were not he this club would be in admin next week"????

If you think this is all a load of poo poo then we are truly lost as no one will ever being able to build our club back up as we are not capable of participating in any such journey.

Regards

Lee

Was Brian Laws dismissed because by your words he had given up and was unable to motivate the team under the circumstances? Did Alan Irvine come in as manager of a club that clearly had and still has financial difficulties which would obviously be made worse by relegation? Did the club sign a number of good attacking players in the summer? Are the tactics employed playing to the strenghts of the players that have been recruited? Is it not the managers job to separate off field matters from the job in hand on the field and motivate the players?

Stop using Palace as an example of what happens under admin circumstances as the major problem caused it caused for them was a loss of key players and staff, to my knowledge that has not happened to us in the past month.

Stop blaming the fans for having a go at the team. You have compared some of the comments made in this thread to be akin to the guy who verbally abused Spurr upon entering the ground last night - this is clearly not the same thing. Most people who have vented their frustrations about the tactics on here back the team 100% come kick-off and this club has received and continues to receive exceptional support given what has been presented to them for more than a decade.

The financial issues cannot have helped Irvine and the team but for them to be blamed as the complete cause and effect of what we have seen for the past month is just plain wrong. Instead of telling the fans that turn up in their thousands week after week to man up try directing this at the staff that fail to motivate the players that by your words have given up already.

Yes the board have a lot to answer for and this will no doubt be attempted to be addressed by fans at the forum this evening. There is also a whole oage dedicated to threads about the board on this forum and so I think people do get where the main crux of the problem is. This thread was/is/shoud be about how the team play and fans who have witnessed what I have week in week out have a right to debate this. You were in an ideal position to influence major change at this club and for whatever reason failed to do so. How are we supposed to truly beleive that we can instigate change from the outside if you failed to do so from within?

[Lincowl]

9 months notice - moron.

Very much proven and respected in the game - moron.

With regard to your last idiotic point - well you clearly are a moron - oh wait its braddaz form owlzone yup - moron.

Regards

Lee

Is this an ironic Dave Allen impersonation?

[SiJ]

To quote a wise man. . .

A perfectly good thread has been hijacked by. . ..

Oh. . .wait. . .

Edited September 29, 2010 by SiJ

[bigdan2003]

A couple of simple questions Lee, if you'd be so kind to answer.

1) Do you think the players have put 100% effort into the last two home game?

2) Do you still think they wanted to win the last two home games?

I'm not sure in what context you mean these questions, and i know i'm not Lee ...but i'd be interested to hear what people would do if their company went boobies up in the way Wednesday have, wage was under threat, future at the company was in jepordy, and generally the morale around the place was a bit poo poo..

Would this affect your morale? affect your ability to focus on your work?

End of the day, they are human, they have homes, family, and bills to pay...so, i can see where LS is coming from. I'm sure it's had a negative impact on the players, however, this doesn't mean Irvine is 100% blameless...as i said earlier, his team selections are frustrating.

[DamnedOwl]

I'm not sure in what context you mean these questions, and i know i'm not Lee ...but i'd be interested to hear what people would do if their company went boobies up in the way Wednesday have, wage was under threat, future at the company was in jepordy, and generally the morale around the place was a bit poo poo..

Would this affect your morale? affect your ability to focus on your work?

End of the day, they are human, they have homes, family, and bills to pay...so, i can see where LS is coming from. I'm sure it's had a negative impact on the players, however, this doesn't mean Irvine is 100% blameless...as i said earlier, his team selections are frustrating.

To be fair though I don't believe a single poster is claiming it wouldn't have an affect. Everyone seems to acknowledge that it would.

[London Owl]

some intresting thoughts on here too http://www.pne-online.net/forum/showthread.php?57423-Meanwhile-less-than-40-miles-away........

Looks as though we aint the first.........

[Guest]

I'm not sure in what context you mean these questions, and i know i'm not Lee ...but i'd be interested to hear what people would do if their company went boobies up in the way Wednesday have, wage was under threat, future at the company was in jepordy, and generally the morale around the place was a bit poo poo..

Would this affect your morale? affect your ability to focus on your work?

End of the day, they are human, they have homes, family, and bills to pay...so, i can see where LS is coming from. I'm sure it's had a negative impact on the players, however, this doesn't mean Irvine is 100% blameless...as i said earlier, his team selections are frustrating.

It would obviously be upsetting but doesn't explain the negative tactical approach. Does anyone beleive that the players who signed for us in the summer and their agents thought that joining this club would be a bed of roses and they all believed that right up until the end of August money was on its way in and there was nothing to worry about - even though we had a court case adjourned and had to sell one of our best players before a ball was kicked? Even Allister Campbell couldn't spin that one.

[dorian gray]

some intresting thoughts on here too http://www.pne-online.net/forum/showthread.php?57423-Meanwhile-less-than-40-miles-away........

looks as though this flapz never going to improve....

[chrispag]

whats this the rumbleing strafford show roger off