DEFENSIVE FOOTBALL

[Guest becauseofboxingday]

The way the players celebrated Tommy Millers goal at Plymouth suggests they haven't given in to me. They definitely looked like they care so I don't agree that this is the problem.

Crystal Palaces form dipped because they lost a few decent players including the vitally important Victor Moses.

Portsmouth players played with incredible spirit and ended up in an FA Cup Final.

It is the easy way out to claim that the form of teams dips in Administration. This is because the Administrator usually sells the best players.

If Wednesday players are not trying they need to take a hard long look at themselves (although I don't believe this). I would expect a Wednesday player to be trying his utmost if nothing else for their own self interest "If Wednesday go into Administration I better make bloody sure that other clubs are coming in for me".

[Guest]

They were lied to about the true financial picture as were we. They and we were shafted. They and we have admin to face unless a deal gets done.

We were all up in arms about this shafting a few weeks ago now we just want to take it out on the players and the manager.

Regards

Lee

Any agent worth his salt would have realised that our club could encounter serious financial problems this season and put this across to their players.

You have mentioned the word flounce in this thread. If the players gave up pre Brentford as soon as this came out then I would regard this as a major flounce.

They are getting paid on time and the club have made public this fact - why would they simply stop trying just like that?

If this is the case then once again we have kept and recruited players with no backbone and a manager incapable of motivating his squad.

The performances pre-Brentford were far from impresssive. We were very lucky to beat Bury and get a point at Colchester and the home wins were far from convincing.

If Irvine doesn't want the players to lump it then he must get this across or drop them - the way we play comes down to him. I would rather watch the kids from the academy trying in the first team than the pro's who are apparantly not trying if this is the case.

[Guest Triplej2]

If Irvine came back now hed get slaughtered, and thats with his successor having been mostly pants as well. But the Winding up order and subsequent revealing of the finances we've had has made most people see the light.

He created a squad at Preston devoid of passion, pace, youthfulness, depth and creativity, and mortgaged our future to do it. £5m on transfer fees, £12m wage bill for a £9m turnover company. added £15m debt. We gambled on Irvine, and that was unforgivable by our board, but that doesnt make Irvines failure less.

It's this trait of deep denial, obsessiona behaviour and not being able to admit his mistakes which made lee Strafford a very dangerous man to be Chairman of SWFC.

[Lee Strafford]

i would love to know what LS honestly thinks of some of those pre season / early season performances, surely he can not think we were actually good to watch or deserving of when we hit top spot, the only decent football i have seen played all year was by carlisle against us

They were rubbish. Sflaphorpe away was a classic example. The irony being the contrast between our mental approach that day and when we went back in the cup.

The were two drivers to pre season though [1] the focus was primarily fitness building relationships woth a lit of new players and [2] as I have already confirmed the players and staff were disrupted by the way the lee grant deal was bodged and what that said about the winding up order (that we did not know about, but they will have done because of the transfer embargo, at that point) and what it said about the "American deal that was going to close by the end of august".

I thought we played good stuff but more importantly showed determination and resilience and applied ourselves well pre Brentford.

But I have made peace with what constitutes football at this level (players dont have the same attitude, managers can no longer dictate like they used to be able to, noone dominates fir 90mins and a typical game is more about mistakes than creating as most teams do not have lots of very good players, and just as importantly I am not comparing to the early nineties.

Everyone has a right to see things about style diffrently but our issue has not been style its mentality and there is a clearly identifiable root cause to that problem and it ain't a boring, dour, honest, hardworking, well respected by his peers Scotsman that most Preston players and fans would welcome back tomorrow.

Yes I appointed him and no I am not defending him just because I appointed him, I asking you guys to act like grown men that can think and to realise that your energiies are misdirected and it's making things worse whether we go into admin or get a deal done. I am saying this for the same reason I have done everything this past few years because I care about our club.

One last time, I am not saying the players and staff are blameless and should get off scott free, but I am saying that the witchhunt is misdirected and it's damaging things further.

Our approach should have been "right we have been shafted by the board (again) now let's pull together and dig our way out of this, oi you lot in the dessing room we are gonna cut you some slack but you need to get ontop of this or things will not turn out good for any of us, oi you lot in the boardroom unless you can demonstrate that you are capable of establishing our trust and executing on anything get out now".

What have so many of us done??? "tommy spurr you are poo poo", "fellow fan I don't think you should protest against the stooges", "wednesdayite are crap", and now despite everything we know about how you blow up a football team and seeing it be done thus past few weeks it's "Irvine out".

I truly despair.

Regards

Lee

[Plonk]

TBH If the players are "sulking" because theyve been "shafted by the board" it makes me even angrier against them. And the board , Its not an either or situation Lee its both!

[Guest Stereophonics]

So the players cannot be bothered to give their best because they are annoyed at the bored. What about the fans that pay good money.

I understand that the problems cannot help but I am pretty sure that when a player steps onto a pitch they don't think 'you know what, the board are a bunch of cvnts so I'm not going to win this tackle'.

[Mick]

Yes I appointed him

I truly despair.

Regards

Lee

Man you've got balls the size of water melons.

[jambler]

What a load of bolocks to be honest.

1) this is a thread about defensive football isn't it?

2) yes, whatever line of work you are in, if there is uncertainty from whats going on for who you work for, then there is a chance you could be worried.

3) IGNORE MY 2) THIS IS A TOPIC ABOUT HOW THE TEAM ARE DOING, AND ABOUT DEFENSIVE FOOTBALL.

For godsake Lee, this isn't a lets snipe at every single person that says anything against you, whether it be a 'so called' abusive commet, or any other kind of comment.

The 'me against the world' attitude will not get you anywhere.

Edited September 29, 2010 by jambler

[***HIRSTY***]

I didn't realise that LS had instant access to AI's dressing room. . .

You should stick to the politics, because trying to spin events on the pitch is slightly harder - largely due to the fact that we can see that poo poo with our own eyes.

Ahmen

[i used to be sc_owl]

TBH If the players are "sulking" because theyve been "shafted by the board" it makes me even angrier against them. And the board , Its not an either or situation Lee its both!

I'd second that.

[Guest BirdonaMaguire]

They were rubbish. Sflaphorpe away was a classic example. The irony being the contrast between our mental approach that day and when we went back in the cup.

The were two drivers to pre season though [1] the focus was primarily fitness building relationships woth a lit of new players and [2] as I have already confirmed the players and staff were disrupted by the way the lee grant deal was bodged and what that said about the winding up order (that we did not know about, but they will have done because of the transfer embargo, at that point) and what it said about the "American deal that was going to close by the end of august".

I thought we played good stuff but more importantly showed determination and resilience and applied ourselves well pre Brentford.

But I have made peace with what constitutes football at this level (players dont have the same attitude, managers can no longer dictate like they used to be able to, noone dominates fir 90mins and a typical game is more about mistakes than creating as most teams do not have lots of very good players, and just as importantly I am not comparing to the early nineties.

Everyone has a right to see things about style diffrently but our issue has not been style its mentality and there is a clearly identifiable root cause to that problem and it ain't a boring, dour, honest, hardworking, well respected by his peers Scotsman that most Preston players and fans would welcome back tomorrow.

Yes I appointed him and no I am not defending him just because I appointed him, I asking you guys to act like grown men that can think and to realise that your energiies are misdirected and it's making things worse whether we go into admin or get a deal done. I am saying this for the same reason I have done everything this past few years because I care about our club.

One last time, I am not saying the players and staff are blameless and should get off scott free, but I am saying that the witchhunt is misdirected and it's damaging things further.

Our approach should have been "right we have been shafted by the board (again) now let's pull together and dig our way out of this, oi you lot in the dessing room we are gonna cut you some slack but you need to get ontop of this or things will not turn out good for any of us, oi you lot in the boardroom unless you can demonstrate that you are capable of establishing our trust and executing on anything get out now".

What have so many of us done??? "tommy spurr you are poo poo", "fellow fan I don't think you should protest against the stooges", "wednesdayite are crap", and now despite everything we know about how you blow up a football team and seeing it be done thus past few weeks it's "Irvine out".

I truly despair.

Regards

Lee

Most Preston fans would welcome him back? stroll on, most were well shut, they told us how he was and did we listen? No we said he wouldn't be like that at SWFC well guess what it's exactly how they said it would be, dire, uninspiring with a backbone of the side shakier than a parkinsons sufferer.

Fans of this club for some bizarre reason have cut too many people some slack be it the players, the manager, the board whomever for far too long and after being led back into the 3rd tier for the second time in five years have had enough, most of us can no longer justify paying extortionate prices for 3rd tier and 4th rate football, the cost of going away is slowly seeing out away followings dwindle (Saturday excepted) and as a man who reads the internet religiously you cannot help but see that the fans are turning their back on the club with many citing the "football" on offer.

We've pulled together in the past and where has it got us? un-workable up the arse royally by every tom wee pipe and harry involved with the club, players that would rather kick a advertising hoarding than help us stay up, footballers who stroll around thinking WE owe them a living.

Oh and did you pay attention to Leicester and Norwich in the last couple of seasons, after a shaky start by the latter they steamrollered the division because they had a manager with a club and a playing career far and above Dullvines, Pearson and Lambert got what they needed a 25 goals a season man, a big target man to hit, we use 5ft8 Tudgay with the passing ability of Darren Purse.

Irvine is another in a long list of failures at SWFC.

[i used to be sc_owl]

Most Preston fans would welcome him back? stroll on, most were well shut, they told us how he was and did we listen? No we said he wouldn't be like that at SWFC well guess what it's exactly how they said it would be, dire, uninspiring with a backbone of the side shakier than a parkinsons sufferer.

Fans of this club for some bizarre reason have cut too many people some slack be it the players, the manager, the board whomever for far too long and after being led back into the 3rd tier for the second time in five years have had enough, most of us can no longer justify paying extortionate prices for 3rd tier and 4th rate football, the cost of going away is slowly seeing out away followings dwindle (Saturday excepted) and as a man who reads the internet religiously you cannot help but see that the fans are turning their back on the club with many citing the "football" on offer.

We've pulled together in the past and where has it got us? un-workable up the arse royally by every tom wee pipe and harry involved with the club, players that would rather kick a advertising hoarding than help us stay up, footballers who stroll around thinking WE owe them a living.

Oh and did you pay attention to Leicester and Norwich in the last couple of seasons, after a shaky start by the latter they steamrollered the division because they had a manager with a club and a playing career far and above Dullvines, Pearson and Lambert got what they needed a 25 goals a season man, a big target man to hit, we use 5ft8 Tudgay with the passing ability of Darren Purse.

Irvine is another in a long list of failures at SWFC.

That is the thing that is turning me away from football altogether.

There is just something about this club, and it doesn't matter who the manager is, who the players are... I just can't see us gathering enough momentum to run away with this division - even though on paper we should tear it up like Newcastle did the Championship last season.

[Pastor Kidneys]

Lee. I may not have lived in Yorkshire for 45 years. This has been entirely due to work which has been in North Derbyshire and the Peak district, but I wish to point out that I HAVE NOT LOST MY YORKSHIRE ROOTS . I have been, and always will be, a Yorkshireman. I was also watching Wednesday before you were a twinkle in your Father's eye, unless his eye was twinkling in 1947,so I think I can claim to be something of a Wednesdayite. Two attributes normally associated with a Yorkshireman are grit (or guts) and straight speaking.

I realise that there has been and probably still is 'trouble at' pit', something I encountered often in my working life. The fact that we still have some 'poo poo directors' annoys me intensely. I had a Manager who tried to make life as hard for me as possible, but I persevered. Last night, I did something that in all my days supporting the Owls that I have never done before. I refused to put myself out to watch a load of thieving wasters playing in my beloved Blue & White. Yes, thieving, because at no time have their pockets been threatened, but they have the nerve to pickup wages for not doing the job they are paid to do. Play football. This has nothing to do with the boardroom! It's about eleven men pulling on the shirt and doing the job they are grossly overpaid for! They feel they have a complaint, or feel unsecure, and so are upset? Try telling that to the thousands of Miners & Steelworkers (and others) who have lost their jobs but still scrape together enough to watch their beloved Owls.

I would like to think that change in the form of investment was around the corner, and I honestly believed that you could be our Moses and lead us to the promised land. I have supported you throughout, but I am afraid that the tone of your posting on here today hinders rather than helps this come about. If you can't come up with something constructive, keep your gob shut and stop abusing fellow posters who are more concerned with seeing their side win, than inflating their own ego. I do not consider your current attitude is helping investment come. in fact, were I an Investor I would be considering my position with people like you around.

Good post Buxtonian

[Rob100]

They were rubbish. Sflaphorpe away was a classic example. The irony being the contrast between our mental approach that day and when we went back in the cup.

The were two drivers to pre season though [1] the focus was primarily fitness building relationships woth a lit of new players and [2] as I have already confirmed the players and staff were disrupted by the way the lee grant deal was bodged and what that said about the winding up order (that we did not know about, but they will have done because of the transfer embargo, at that point) and what it said about the "American deal that was going to close by the end of august".

I thought we played good stuff but more importantly showed determination and resilience and applied ourselves well pre Brentford.

But I have made peace with what constitutes football at this level (players dont have the same attitude, managers can no longer dictate like they used to be able to, noone dominates fir 90mins and a typical game is more about mistakes than creating as most teams do not have lots of very good players, and just as importantly I am not comparing to the early nineties.

Everyone has a right to see things about style diffrently but our issue has not been style its mentality and there is a clearly identifiable root cause to that problem and it ain't a boring, dour, honest, hardworking, well respected by his peers Scotsman that most Preston players and fans would welcome back tomorrow.

Yes I appointed him and no I am not defending him just because I appointed him, I asking you guys to act like grown men that can think and to realise that your energiies are misdirected and it's making things worse whether we go into admin or get a deal done. I am saying this for the same reason I have done everything this past few years because I care about our club.

One last time, I am not saying the players and staff are blameless and should get off scott free, but I am saying that the witchhunt is misdirected and it's damaging things further.

Our approach should have been "right we have been shafted by the board (again) now let's pull together and dig our way out of this, oi you lot in the dessing room we are gonna cut you some slack but you need to get ontop of this or things will not turn out good for any of us, oi you lot in the boardroom unless you can demonstrate that you are capable of establishing our trust and executing on anything get out now".

What have so many of us done??? "tommy spurr you are poo poo", "fellow fan I don't think you should protest against the stooges", "wednesdayite are crap", and now despite everything we know about how you blow up a football team and seeing it be done thus past few weeks it's "Irvine out".

I truly despair.

Regards

Lee

[Guest Stereophonics]

Even if off the field matters have affected the players, which I doubt then it is up to the manager to get the players to go out on the pitch and still do their jobs.

So even if Irvine was the right man at the time he isn't the man to manage us within the current culture of the club.

[Plonk]

A good manager would use the situation to motivate the players. A bad manager will allow himself to be demotivated by the situation and allow that to spread to his staff.

Do you Ferguson or Atkinson would allow poo poo like this ti upset the little darlings?

[Rob100]

Lee I agree with you completely here. The time has now come to get behind the campaign to out the 3 stooges. We have spent years blaming managers for our predicament when all along the real problem has been behind the scenes. Lets be careful here though . As fans we still have a right to object to our style of football and apparent lack of character and desire to win despite our problems. Whatever anyone feels we have to be the most loyal football fans in the country to have put up with so many years of crap. Lets please not fall out between ourselves now. Now is the time to spend all our energy in getting rid of the barriers to our reincarnation as a club. We must put aside our feelings about the team and just make sure that pressure is placed in the right places to make the investment happen. Then we have Our Wednesday Back and we can operate as a proper football club and judge Irvine and his team at that point only. Don't let the teams current poor form detract us from the number one aim of getting the fookers out

[g-owls]

So the players cannot be bothered to give their best because they are annoyed at the bored. What about the fans that pay good money.

I understand that the problems cannot help but I am pretty sure that when a player steps onto a pitch they don't think 'you know what, the board are a bunch of cvnts so I'm not going to win this tackle'.

Hear, hear!

For what seems like an eternity now we as supporters have backed this club to the hilt through crisis after crises, false promises and god damn awful football on the pitch.

All this talk of players being unsettled because of what's happeing off the pitch, IMO is utter bullshit.

A few months ago my dad's job was at risk, but did that stop him from turning up and not putting a shift in? Did it b0llocks.

Bottom line for me is A) The players aren't good enough and B) The tactics employed by the manager are utter dross, uninspiring and by large easy to play against.

[Furious George]

23rd July 2010 - News breaks Sheffield Wednesday served winding up order.

Lost 2-0 Barnsley

Lost 1-0 Doncaster

Won 2-0 D & R

Won 1-0 Bury

11th August 2010 - High Court - Part paid - DELAYED

Drew 1-1 Colchester

Won 1-0 Brighton

Lost 4-2 Sflaphorpe

Won 5-0 Harltepool

Won 1-0 Notts County

Lost 1-0 Brentford

8th September 2010 - High Court - PAID

Lost 1-0 Carlisle

Lost 3-2 Plymouth

Lost 1-0 Southampton

Drew 0-0 Oldham

So its suggested that we started playing badly when the tax bill was paid, but not when the news first broke or when the hearing was delayed for a month because we couldn't afford it? I think that's a load of poo poo.

The one constant though - is the poo poo we have watched under Irvine that goes a lot further back than the pre-season friendlies.

[Rob100]

Hear, hear!

For what seems like an eternity now we as supporters have backed this club to the hilt through crisis after crises, false promises and god damn awful football on the pitch.

All this talk of players being unsettled because of what's happeing off the pitch, IMO is utter bullshit.

A few months ago my dad's job was at risk, but did that stop him from turning up and not putting a shift in? Did it b0llocks.

Bottom line for me is A) The players aren't good enough and B) The tactics employed by the manager are utter dross, uninspiring and by large easy to play against.