parajack Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, @owlstalk said: Literally nobody has suggested it's the mark of success It's an indicator of not being rubbish And when you compare it to the results before that it's an indicator of significant improvement Stop trying to spin what people are actually saying into something you want to suggest they're saying Ime not spinning anything i have expressed an opinion,which you seem to disagree with FINE...dont put words in my mouth..Many on here have quoted being unbeaten as an improvement,and heading in the right direction. I have disagreed and said why nothing more Edited December 8, 2021 by parajack 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigash_swfc Posted December 8, 2021 Share Posted December 8, 2021 Players didn't give up. If anything, they tried harder. We got outplayed. Huge wake up call. A brill point and clean sheet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owls2k Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 (edited) 13 hours ago, DoesJackHunt said: We had gone down to ten Men away away at Portsmouth (which is miles away) on a cold winters night. They are doing ok themselves. They deserve praise for coming away with a point don’t they? why is that bad management? Of course they (including Moore) deserve credit for coming away with a point and showing battling qualities after the sending off. However, Moore's Wednesday management career didn't start at Pompey away after 70 minutes, I'm judging on much more than that. That opening half an hour was horrendous, and that was after last week's complete embarrassment - there was no 'reaction' to that showing and result whatsoever. The players looked like they'd met on the bus, and this included Bannan and Luongo, arguably the most talented two players on the pitch. Had Pompey been at full strength and/or had a striker who knew where the net was we'd have been out of the game, and deservedly so. My feeling is that the players like Moore and the players themselves in the most part put in a shift, but we have zero attacking guile and verve, which is what we should have with the attacking options we have at our disposal. We're underperforming and the manager needs to do much better. Edited December 9, 2021 by Owls2k 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parajack Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 7 minutes ago, Owls2k said: Of course they (including Moore) deserve credit for coming away with a point and showing battling qualities after the sending off. However, Moore's Wednesday management career didn't start at Pompey away after 70 minutes, I'm judging on much more than that. That opening half an hour was horrendous, and that was after last week's complete embarrassment - there was no 'reaction' to that showing and result whatsoever. The players looked like they'd met on the bus, and this included Bannan and Luongo, arguably the most talented two players on the pitch. Had Pompey been at full strength and/or had a striker who knew where the net was we'd have been out of the game, and deservedly so. My feeling is that the players like Moore and the players themselves in the most part put in a shift, but we have zero attacking guile and verve, which is what we should have with the attacking options we have at our disposal. We're underperforming and the manager needs to do much better. Agree 100%....comical antics in front of goal in different circumstances...and lack of any pressure n their GK at corners,allowing him to catch BB corners... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parajack Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 16 hours ago, DoesJackHunt said: Ok but I don’t get why its the WW and Rovrum thing that’s frustrating you. We don’t have a divine right to be better than them. Why if they do better than us does it define our season ? Why? because they are the two teams closest to us in circumstances,relegated teams from the Championship,not good enough to stay there(sometimes called YO YO Teams) but too good for Div1... We however despite our multiple woes were still only relegated by an EFL deduction,still retain 7 Players who were first team last Year,have a NI International Gk on loan from a PL Club,and the rest of our players either Championship or PL standard,on loan or otherwise. We have arguably the best midfielder in the Division,probably the highest wage bill,etc etc We are the only 3 teams playing currently in L1 that received recent Championship payments from the EFL & players recruitment & wages reflect that. We haven't been languishing in L1 for Years on reduced income,and under a wages cap,like the rest of the Division,or recently promoted from the tier beneath. Thats why i compare our League position & progress to WW & Rotherham...... Rotherham had 2 'back to back' promotions under Steve Evans, and have been relegated twice & gone straight back up with PW. If they are promoted again automatically this Year,it will be 3 times without having to go through the play offs under PW. WW the same,if they achieve promotion this Year automatically,and bounce straight back,2 promotions from L1 on the bounce,making it eminently achievable,whilst we cant even get into a play off spot currently,with the squad we have,than we are massively under performing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DoesJackHunt Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 2 hours ago, Owls2k said: Of course they (including Moore) deserve credit for coming away with a point and showing battling qualities after the sending off. However, Moore's Wednesday management career didn't start at Pompey away after 70 minutes, I'm judging on much more than that. That opening half an hour was horrendous, and that was after last week's complete embarrassment - there was no 'reaction' to that showing and result whatsoever. The players looked like they'd met on the bus, and this included Bannan and Luongo, arguably the most talented two players on the pitch. Had Pompey been at full strength and/or had a striker who knew where the net was we'd have been out of the game, and deservedly so. My feeling is that the players like Moore and the players themselves in the most part put in a shift, but we have zero attacking guile and verve, which is what we should have with the attacking options we have at our disposal. We're underperforming and the manager needs to do much better. We weren’t at full strength either and generally we are doing better these days. It isn’t going to be the case in every game that we play well, it takes along to time to build a successful and consistent side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DoesJackHunt Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 2 hours ago, parajack said: Why? because they are the two teams closest to us in circumstances,relegated teams from the Championship,not good enough to stay there(sometimes called YO YO Teams) but too good for Div1... We however despite our multiple woes were still only relegated by an EFL deduction,still retain 7 Players who were first team last Year,have a NI International Gk on loan from a PL Club,and the rest of our players either Championship or PL standard,on loan or otherwise. We have arguably the best midfielder in the Division,probably the highest wage bill,etc etc We are the only 3 teams playing currently in L1 that received recent Championship payments from the EFL & players recruitment & wages reflect that. We haven't been languishing in L1 for Years on reduced income,and under a wages cap,like the rest of the Division,or recently promoted from the tier beneath. Thats why i compare our League position & progress to WW & Rotherham...... Rotherham had 2 'back to back' promotions under Steve Evans, and have been relegated twice & gone straight back up with PW. If they are promoted again automatically this Year,it will be 3 times without having to go through the play offs under PW. WW the same,if they achieve promotion this Year automatically,and bounce straight back,2 promotions from L1 on the bounce,making it eminently achievable,whilst we cant even get into a play off spot currently,with the squad we have,than we are massively under performing. The squad we have had this season is this though. Brown, Berahino, Sow, Gibson, Byers, Wing and Shodipo. That’s seven of our new player who have all contributed nothing and most of them have had game time to change that fact. BPF - has done well but has also cost us points Johnson - has done well but has also cost us points Hunt, Corbeanu, Kamberi, Gregory and Adeniran ( now injured) have done well or Ok. the lads from the championship. Iorfa- out for a long period injured Dunkley- out for a long period injured Hutchinson- out for a long period injured Luongo - out for a long period injured patterson- out for a period injured Wildsmith- average keeper Palmer - good at this level FDB - Doing well in his first season in the team Bannan - too good for this league You can disagree with some of that assessment but that’s how I see it and I think is fair. That for me is our reality and it doesn’t scream we’re going to tear up league one this season. Its no good looking at other teams saying we should be doing better than them because they are not us and are not in our situation. A new manager might get a tune out of 1 or 2 the sh!te seven but he isn’t going to stop our injury prone players getting injured and we can only recruit on free or on loan. we should improve if the injury situation improves and some of the sh!te seven get their acts together and start contributing. We have no evidence to say the squad we have should be competing for automatics, we haven’t seen it so you can only be basing it on expectations, which you should probably temper having seen nearly half of of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Of The Roasters Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 2 hours ago, parajack said: ...,and the rest of our players either Championship or PL standard, on loan or otherwise. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 2 hours ago, parajack said: We however despite our multiple woes were still only relegated by an EFL deduction,still retain 7 Players who were first team last Year,have a NI International Gk on loan from a PL Club,and the rest of our players either Championship or PL standard,on loan or otherwise. I think I'm starting to understand why you're expected standards aren't happening mate 3 1 Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GermanBird Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 56 minutes ago, DoesJackHunt said: The squad we have had this season is this though. Brown, Berahino, Sow, Gibson, Byers, Wing and Shodipo. That’s seven of our new player who have all contributed nothing and most of them have had game time to change that fact. BPF - has done well but has also cost us points Johnson - has done well but has also cost us points Hunt, Corbeanu, Kamberi, Gregory and Adeniran ( now injured) have done well or Ok. the lads from the championship. Iorfa- out for a long period injured Dunkley- out for a long period injured Hutchinson- out for a long period injured Luongo - out for a long period injured patterson- out for a period injured Wildsmith- average keeper Palmer - good at this level FDB - Doing well in his first season in the team Bannan - too good for this league You can disagree with some of that assessment but that’s how I see it and I think is fair. That for me is our reality and it doesn’t scream we’re going to tear up league one this season. Its no good looking at other teams saying we should be doing better than them because they are not us and are not in our situation. A new manager might get a tune out of 1 or 2 the sh!te seven but he isn’t going to stop our injury prone players getting injured and we can only recruit on free or on loan. we should improve if the injury situation improves and some of the sh!te seven get their acts together and start contributing. We have no evidence to say the squad we have should be competing for automatics, we haven’t seen it so you can only be basing it on expectations, which you should probably temper having seen nearly half of of the season. Great summary. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HootHoot Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 20 hours ago, parajack said: I dont buy into this 'positivity' BS it changes nothing,yes some teams will drop points,inevitable but i feel your being too blase about our League position. Nearly Xmas and we are still trotting out 'when we get injured players back'? We ****ing well should be a force to be reckoned with,its Division 3.. ime a Wednesdayite,i want you to be right,and for me to be wrong.....than i watch performances like last night and think... We have no fit CB's and our main striker is just returning from injury. ANY team would struggle with that and they do! I don't buy this whole "It's League 1, we should be walking it" either. Bannan, Luongo, Iorfa and Dunkley are probably the only players capable of playing in the championship. Maybe Palmer too. NML if he's fit and firing. The rest? Free's (who couldn't sign for a championship club) who are playing at their level. We need to be realistic and accept that we're not Barcelona in this league. Look at Sunderland, their fans thought the same and they're still here now. Let's take it one game at a time. And if you want to see it, you will. The Portsmouth game and the past few league games, we have turned a corner. We've put in some fighting performances and it's clear that progress has been made. Previously, we would've collapsed in that match but unfortunately some on here will never see it that way. It doesn't matter whether we go up through the playoffs or automatics. At the end of the day, as long as we go up do we really care? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GermanBird Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, HootHoot said: It doesn't matter whether we go up through the playoffs or automatics. At the end of the day, as long as we go up do we really care? I fully agree with that. Automatics would be great! Playoffs with a game at Wembley sounds ok as well! There is no team in the league, which we could not beat (on a good day). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIPPS_S.W.F.C Posted December 9, 2021 Share Posted December 9, 2021 On 08/12/2021 at 09:36, HIGHERSTATE said: Most of the midfield and forward line were first team starters. Kamberi had about 6 touches in the whole game. Looks like were pinning a successful season on Windass then. Yep or we get someone in Jan who can put it in net not needing 5 or 6 chances to get 1 and can create his own chances too... UTO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owls2k Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 On 09/12/2021 at 12:25, DoesJackHunt said: We weren’t at full strength either and generally we are doing better these days. It isn’t going to be the case in every game that we play well, it takes along to time to build a successful and consistent side. Portsmouth were ravaged too though, that was my point. It was a battle of makeshift sides. It does indeed take time to build a successful and consistent side, but that's not helped when a manager chops and changes everything - he might have injuries to point to now but he was behaving the exact same before we had this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owls2k Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 On 08/12/2021 at 23:23, bigash_swfc said: Players didn't give up. If anything, they tried harder. We got outplayed. Huge wake up call. A brill point and clean sheet. Fair assessment. The grit we showed after the red was the only positive, and it got us a pretty lucky point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DoesJackHunt Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 16 minutes ago, Owls2k said: Portsmouth were ravaged too though, that was my point. It was a battle of makeshift sides. It does indeed take time to build a successful and consistent side, but that's not helped when a manager chops and changes everything - he might have injuries to point to now but he was behaving the exact same before we had this issue. He hasn’t been chopping and changing has he, only due to injuries and normal amount of rotation. Granted he did a lot at the beginning but I think he was just. a. Trying to give everyone a chance b. Trying to work to out a system that worked with player available. We have had injuries all season not just now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DoesJackHunt Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 On 09/12/2021 at 13:09, DoesJackHunt said: The squad we have had this season is this though. Brown, Berahino, Sow, Gibson, Byers, Wing and Shodipo. That’s seven of our new player who have all contributed nothing and most of them have had game time to change that fact. BPF - has done well but has also cost us points Johnson - has done well but has also cost us points Hunt, Corbeanu, Kamberi, Gregory and Adeniran ( now injured) have done well or Ok. the lads from the championship. Iorfa- out for a long period injured Dunkley- out for a long period injured Hutchinson- out for a long period injured Luongo - out for a long period injured patterson- out for a period injured Wildsmith- average keeper Palmer - good at this level FDB - Doing well in his first season in the team Bannan - too good for this league You can disagree with some of that assessment but that’s how I see it and I think is fair. That for me is our reality and it doesn’t scream we’re going to tear up league one this season. Its no good looking at other teams saying we should be doing better than them because they are not us and are not in our situation. A new manager might get a tune out of 1 or 2 the sh!te seven but he isn’t going to stop our injury prone players getting injured and we can only recruit on free or on loan. we should improve if the injury situation improves and some of the sh!te seven get their acts together and start contributing. We have no evidence to say the squad we have should be competing for automatics, we haven’t seen it so you can only be basing it on expectations, which you should probably temper having seen nearly half of of the season. Missed off Windass - out for a long period injured Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
York_Owl Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 On 08/12/2021 at 14:54, Tommy Crawshaw said: DM said Windass, Brennan and Dunkley were all a bit 'sore' after training so were left behind. The players don't seem to pick injuries up during games but in training. Maybe they're overdoing it and need less 'volume' in training. In that case I think Moore can be criticised for how he has managed the workload of these players in training. Surely, everything should be geared around making sure that players are fit for the actual games. If that means going easy in training or more rest days for the likes of Windass, who is just coming back from a long term injury or, Dunkley who has played a lot of games recently then so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owls2k Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 minute ago, DoesJackHunt said: He hasn’t been chopping and changing has he, only due to injuries and normal amount of rotation. Granted he did a lot at the beginning but I think he was just. a. Trying to give everyone a chance b. Trying to work to out a system that worked with player available. We have had injuries all season not just now. He's been chopping and changing all throughout the season. Fans and local journos were asking him about it way before the defensive crisis. It's just how he is, we have amazing attacking options and Moore has been more worried about the opposition since game one. No wonder we attack like we have no idea what to do. We are far too concerned with nullifying the attaching threat of the likes of Gillingham. Also, he wasn't and isn't giving 'everyone a chance'. Sow hasn't had a proper go, Theo didn't get a kick until Wolves sent their loan guy out to talk to Moore, he was then miraculously ready for first team football, bit odd, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DoesJackHunt Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 22 minutes ago, Owls2k said: He's been chopping and changing all throughout the season. Fans and local journos were asking him about it way before the defensive crisis. It's just how he is, we have amazing attacking options and Moore has been more worried about the opposition since game one. No wonder we attack like we have no idea what to do. We are far too concerned with nullifying the attaching threat of the likes of Gillingham. Also, he wasn't and isn't giving 'everyone a chance'. Sow hasn't had a proper go, Theo didn't get a kick until Wolves sent their loan guy out to talk to Moore, he was then miraculously ready for first team football, bit odd, no? The team recently , barring the back line and the inclusion of shodipo have been exactly what I’ve expected more or less. your banging a drum from 2 months ago. Why? We’re unbeaten in 11 Do you want Darren Moore to be sacked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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