Matt Penney

[Hack-Abusi]

Not consistent enough .. might make a good winger or wideman but defensively he's tragic ..

[torryowl]

On 16/04/2021 at 14:28, malek said:

Another talented player that graduated through our academy that club failed and who must leave in order to save his career. 

 

Good luck and all the best in your career Matt. 

how have the club failed him ?......they sent him out on loan 3 times to get experience  they have included him in numerous squads theyve tried him at full back and wing back and apart from 2 or 3 games he's failed to impress enough to keep his place ...........what more can they do .?

[Guest Therealrealist]

2 hours ago, Hack-Abusi said:

Not consistent enough .. might make a good winger or wideman but defensively he's tragic ..

Often looks quite lazy as well

[swfcGibbo]

I think the thing with Penney is he's hardly had competition at left wing back this season yet not managed to get into the team. 

Id be looking at someone like Luke Garbutt for next season who has had two good seasons in League One and I believe signed just a 12 month deal at Blackpool.

[malek]

15 hours ago, torryowl said:

how have the club failed him ?......they sent him out on loan 3 times to get experience  they have included him in numerous squads theyve tried him at full back and wing back and apart from 2 or 3 games he's failed to impress enough to keep his place ...........what more can they do .?

 

Really can't be bothered to explain this again as I did so at least 10 times by now. This club is awful to its young players and had been for years. 

[Ian]

15 hours ago, torryowl said:

how have the club failed him ?......they sent him out on loan 3 times to get experience  they have included him in numerous squads theyve tried him at full back and wing back and apart from 2 or 3 games he's failed to impress enough to keep his place ...........what more can they do .?

So he’s impressed on 2 or 3 games out of the 12 he’s played.....25% in his first season consistently in the first team squad in a position notoriously difficult to impress in for anyone. How would you say that compares to Harris or £5m Reach?

[Guest]

41 minutes ago, malek said:

 

Really can't be bothered to explain this again as I did so at least 10 times by now. This club is awful to its young players and had been for years. 

 

If he really was good enough someone would have snapped him up by now. 

Youngsters have had their chance at this club recently - Dawson, Wildsmith, Osaze, Clare, Penney, Shaw, Hunt has been in the squad long enough, if he was good enough he would play. Maybe they just aren't good enough to progress beyond where they are at because other local academies have been better structured for longer and attract the best players. 

[malek]

16 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

If he really was good enough someone would have snapped him up by now. 

Youngsters have had their chance at this club recently - Dawson, Wildsmith, Osaze, Clare, Penney, Shaw, Hunt has been in the squad long enough, if he was good enough he would play. Maybe they just aren't good enough to progress beyond where they are at because other local academies have been better structured for longer and attract the best players. 

 

We don't know how to develop talented players. It is a problem throughout England, but nowhere bigger than it is at Sheffield Wednesday. 

 

We are not developing players. If we give them chance or send them out on loan we do it with little thought and no planing behind it. We throw them at deep and hoping it will work out, if it doesn't all blame is put on young players. A joke... 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, malek said:

 

We don't know how to develop talented players. It is a problem throughout England, but nowhere bigger than it is at Sheffield Wednesday. 

 

We are not developing players. If we give them chance or send them out on loan we do it with little thought and no planing behind it. We throw them at deep and hoping it will work out, if it doesn't all blame is put on young players. A joke... 

 

But in respect of Penney he has just had a season-long loan, under a manager he previously worked with so that does suggest some planning. He did OK at the start of this season but when he has got into the side since then there are clear instances of switching off leading to goals against, this is why he isn't in the team regularly.

[1867Heaven]

On 15/04/2021 at 17:51, Gob_Bluth said:

 

I think playing 3 at the back will be done with after this season. Once/If DM can get his own squad and players in we'll see the end of it.

 

Plus it's amazing how he's not going to make it here when we're in League one but he's been linked with a move to a club who'll still be in this division next season

I agree, I’d be playing him if it was my choice but it seems the only manager who liked him was Jos and he quickly put him mainly on bench when on loan in Germany 

[Dutch McLovin]

22 hours ago, malek said:

 

Really can't be bothered to explain this again as I did so at least 10 times by now. This club is awful to its young players and had been for years. 

Spot on. People dont see what a chance is for a youngster. They think if they dont perform in the 20 mins there given in the first team there not good enough.

 

How many years have Everton at the top level been playing Calvert-Lewin and he hasnt scored and in the early years didnt look much kop, but he got 30 games plus a season. Now look at him.

[Dutch McLovin]

18 hours ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

But in respect of Penney he has just had a season-long loan, under a manager he previously worked with so that does suggest some planning. He did OK at the start of this season but when he has got into the side since then there are clear instances of switching off leading to goals against, this is why he isn't in the team regularly.

He did ok, but then was dropped for no reason and (not because he was dropped) team performances and results drop off. He then doesnt get another chance and is even dropped from the squad. He then under new management returns but is in and out in and out, gets 20 mins in on position 10 in another in another formation.

 

How the hell is the lad suppose to progress ???

 

The two keepers were very good prospects a few years ago. Again different managers same problems and they are now ruined.

 

If we had a structured way of playing say it was 442 or 352 whichever and he was given a run on 10-12 games in one position then he could get going find some consistency and maybe we would find out if he is good enough. 

 

Personally i dont know if he is. I think he has some good attributes but he does need to work on things. But again that is down to management. We are terrible at throwing young players under the bus.

[Guest Kagoshimaowl]

On 16/04/2021 at 01:22, YesWeCrann said:

 

Good, cos he’s absolutely crap!

[OwlinOldham]

As bad as Wednesday are at developing youngsters, its not allways on the club  when one of them doesnt come good or kick on. Easy to say its the clubs fault, but players have to have a share of the blame too.

 

Aside from 1 or 2 decent games, ive not seen anything in Penney to suggest hes better than Reach (at least in previous seasons) on any part of the left hand side for us. Yeah the lad can cross and has a hammer for a foot, but hes pretty badly lacking in other parts of his game. His defensive side of the game is very poor and while both Penney and Reach are bottlers in a tackle, Reach (normally) does at least track back, covers and works hard for the team. 

 

Whilst sporadic appearances arent going to help any players development, Penney has also got to show the manager in training that hes worth picking and that hes adapting and bettering his game. Obviously none of us really know if hes doing that in training, but id guess not based on the fact that hes usually picked, dropped after a few games and then not picked again. A cycle that has seemingly not changed with the numerous managers hes had. 

 

I slightly disagree with @Dutch McLovinpoint on the keepers. Both Dawson and Wildsmith were touted as decent prospects, but both have had extended runs in the team at some stage and in that time have shown that they really arent good enough to be number one here at least. Basics such as kicking straight, coming off your line for the ball, communication and commanding your area....... These things should be standard for the pair of them by now and they arent. Truth is neither is good enough for number one spot, with this not something the club could have really changed or seen until such time thatb they got games and showed this fact. 

 

Just my opinions though and we all know what they say about opinions...... 

[Dutch McLovin]

4 minutes ago, OwlinOldham said:

As bad as Wednesday are at developing youngsters, its not allways on the club  when one of them doesnt come good or kick on. Easy to say its the clubs fault, but players have to have a share of the blame too.

 

Aside from 1 or 2 decent games, ive not seen anything in Penney to suggest hes better than Reach (at least in previous seasons) on any part of the left hand side for us. Yeah the lad can cross and has a hammer for a foot, but hes pretty badly lacking in other parts of his game. His defensive side of the game is very poor and while both Penney and Reach are bottlers in a tackle, Reach (normally) does at least track back, covers and works hard for the team. 

 

Whilst sporadic appearances arent going to help any players development, Penney has also got to show the manager in training that hes worth picking and that hes adapting and bettering his game. Obviously none of us really know if hes doing that in training, but id guess not based on the fact that hes usually picked, dropped after a few games and then not picked again. A cycle that has seemingly not changed with the numerous managers hes had. 

 

I slightly disagree with @Dutch McLovinpoint on the keepers. Both Dawson and Wildsmith were touted as decent prospects, but both have had extended runs in the team at some stage and in that time have shown that they really arent good enough to be number one here at least. Basics such as kicking straight, coming off your line for the ball, communication and commanding your area....... These things should be standard for the pair of them by now and they arent. Truth is neither is good enough for number one spot, with this not something the club could have really changed or seen until such time thatb they got games and showed this fact. 

 

Just my opinions though and we all know what they say about opinions...... 

I agree with your points on the keepers. However if you look at any of the situations where they have had there runs in the side they have all been in situations which are difficult should we say.

 

IMO we should have made a decision early on which of the two were regarded as the better keeper and the future number one. Then a long term plan should have been put in place to achieve this. At this time roughly 3 years ago we had a solid back line, and Westwood. Both should have been involved in this process. Westwood should have been a key part in the handover which could have come over these 3 years where this year would be the first season where they were the true number 1 (had they progressed to do so). So there would have been periods of games where they were in net, and Westwood was on the bench. If which it tends to do form dips in youngsters they are taken out of the firing line and Westwood is back in. Also it helps having a defensive structure what is continuous, ie the same players in front in the same formation with the same expectations from the GK.

 

We had none of the above.

[The Wall]

Player comes through from the youth team

 

Has a few chances in the first team

 

Doesn't look very good

 

Leaves.

 

I've nothing against Matt Penney, but not bothered if he wants to find another club. Good luck to him

[malek]

I can imagine that there must be huge shock for young players making step up from our U-18 or u-23 to first team football.

 

To make things clear I don't talk about obvious spike in quality of opposition or pace and physicality of football.

 

Throughout our underage groups we are looking to play passing football with our players working hard for each other, showing for the ball and trying to be creative on it. These players find it hard making the step up with experienced first team players that are playing alibi game, hiding from the ball and are mostly concerned about not making notable mistakes. Add to this double standards where young players get dropped for making couple of poor passes while first team players get away with "murder". To make it worst, when we play badly and lose, all the blame seems to get directed at those youngsters rather than at their experienced colleagues who get paid 10 or 20 times more than them, let everyone down just to get picked next Saturday like nothing happened. Seems like a vicious, never ending circle that got us to the brink of relegation.

 

Can only imagine how hard and stressful it must be for youngsters trying to make it here and that must change.

[OwlinOldham]

1 hour ago, Dutch McLovin said:

I agree with your points on the keepers. However if you look at any of the situations where they have had there runs in the side they have all been in situations which are difficult should we say.

 

IMO we should have made a decision early on which of the two were regarded as the better keeper and the future number one. Then a long term plan should have been put in place to achieve this. At this time roughly 3 years ago we had a solid back line, and Westwood. Both should have been involved in this process. Westwood should have been a key part in the handover which could have come over these 3 years where this year would be the first season where they were the true number 1 (had they progressed to do so). So there would have been periods of games where they were in net, and Westwood was on the bench. If which it tends to do form dips in youngsters they are taken out of the firing line and Westwood is back in. Also it helps having a defensive structure what is continuous, ie the same players in front in the same formation with the same expectations from the GK.

 

We had none of the above.

 

Agree with what your saying and in a pefect world this should really have been the case. I just think the combination of us getting worse year on year, Westwoods long term injuries and manager fallouts, plus numerous other factors...... Have all meant it was never going to be the case.

 

Sad truth is we have been on the slide since the end of the second season under Carlos. That meant that any youngster coming into the team is going to be under pressure to fit in and perform straight away. If we were a solid midtable side with little worries of going down, theres no issue in blooding youngsters gradually and progressively each year. Sadly though, we went from promotion possibles to being relegation fodder (or just above) in the space of just a season. That meant the clubs hand was forced in either playing the young uns in a poor team with low morale, or not playing them at all and likley never seeing if they were ever going to be good enough. Its fair to say though that genuine quality will still shine through, even in a strugging team. 

 

We all want the young players to do well, but we also give them more credit and slack than they are perhaps due at times. This is likley due to the whole one of our own mentality and the Wednesday tinted specs. Truth is though, players like Penney, Dawson and Wildsmith probably were never anything more than good prospects who might (with luck and application) become good players, but who sadly later just turned out to be average. All have large holes in thier individual games and rather then these holes being addressed by the player through training and hard work, the holes remain and the players havent improved. is that the clubs fault?or is that on the players? 

 

Again though, just my opinions.The reality is nobody except the players will ever really know what the reasons for them not kicking on are. 

 

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Dutch McLovin said:

He did ok, but then was dropped for no reason and (not because he was dropped) team performances and results drop off. He then doesnt get another chance and is even dropped from the squad. He then under new management returns but is in and out in and out, gets 20 mins in on position 10 in another in another formation.

 

How the hell is the lad suppose to progress ???

 

The two keepers were very good prospects a few years ago. Again different managers same problems and they are now ruined.

 

If we had a structured way of playing say it was 442 or 352 whichever and he was given a run on 10-12 games in one position then he could get going find some consistency and maybe we would find out if he is good enough. 

 

Personally i dont know if he is. I think he has some good attributes but he does need to work on things. But again that is down to management. We are terrible at throwing young players under the bus.

 

Fair points but the disjointed unbalanced team and constant change of managers affects all players, though maybe the younger ones more. That said we have played a version of wing-backs or 4 at the back all season. With the make up of the squad you would have thought he would have thought that he would be at least in contention to play regularly on the left, especially given Reach has hardly excelled consistently. Even when Thompson, who will know more about him than anyone, was manager, he couldn't get a game. 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, malek said:

I can imagine that there must be huge shock for young players making step up from our U-18 or u-23 to first team football.

 

To make things clear I don't talk about obvious spike in quality of opposition or pace and physicality of football.

 

Throughout our underage groups we are looking to play passing football with our players working hard for each other, showing for the ball and trying to be creative on it. These players find it hard making the step up with experienced first team players that are playing alibi game, hiding from the ball and are mostly concerned about not making notable mistakes. Add to this double standards where young players get dropped for making couple of poor passes while first team players get away with "murder". To make it worst, when we play badly and lose, all the blame seems to get directed at those youngsters rather than at their experienced colleagues who get paid 10 or 20 times more than them, let everyone down just to get picked next Saturday like nothing happened. Seems like a vicious, never ending circle that got us to the brink of relegation.

 

Can only imagine how hard and stressful it must be for youngsters trying to make it here and that must change.

 

I don't think our fans have picked out youngsters for blame this season anymore than more established players, in fact most of the experienced players have got it in the neck. 

You might be right in saying the first team have tried to play no-risk football too much but it certainly hasn't worked and you'd like to think that one of the many managers we have had this season might spot this and turn to the likes of Hunt and Penney if they felt they were good enough.