Is this legitimate??

[Gnarwolf]

1 minute ago, WatfordOwl said:

I think that's a bit unfair.

 

Each of the attendee's went off the back of their 'own' concerns or questions they want to be answered. DC (from what I understand) tends to dominate the proceedings when he talks so there isn't always the opportunity or time to ask certain questions.

 

You could always email the club yourself and it would be forwarded onto the chairman, whatever you may think of him, he certainly adopts an open door policy when it comes to meeting fans - what follows might be completely bonkers, but he would meet you. 

 

I suppose that's a good point... I'm just getting tired of all this, this is why I don't tend to post in Matchday.

[billyblack]

34 minutes ago, David1867 said:

Iv never been happy with the "let's copy brighton" or the new "let's copy brentford" but we definitely needed a turnover of players. 

We just needed a plan, a proper one. Still do.

[billyblack]

12 minutes ago, bobness said:

 

If I have this right, the EFL permitted DC to sign Bruce and his two costly assistants. But when they left, and £2 compensation was added to the pot, the EFL advised DC that he can only hire a manager without coaching staff?

If this is the case why not just tell the fans. If its the case. Wheres the harm in that.

[Groundhopping Owl]

1 hour ago, sheriwozgod said:

 

After failing at wembley it was the right thing to carry on signing................provided we shifted some out, unfortunately we didnt, and we also recruited badly.

 

But after Huddersfield it was absolutely the right time to sell some of them as we then knew what was coming.

You're probably right there. The FFP figures sort of reflect that - a perfectly manageable £10m loss in the first year, £20m in the second but at least we got to the play-offs again, then suddenly the spending got bloated out of all proportion and we lost £30m to finish in mid-table.

[bobness]

Just now, billyblack said:

If this is the case why not just tell the fans. If its the case. Wheres the harm in that.

 

Why not tell the fans he's run out of money?

[WatfordOwl]

7 minutes ago, Gnarwolf said:

 

I suppose that's a good point... I'm just getting tired of all this, this is why I don't tend to post in Matchday.

and with good reason :)

 

I just asked about Paxao.

 

He was asked about his involvement, but the question didn't receive a straight answer other than DC saying he's a good friend, advisor. DC is apparently considering taking him to the interview with Dom Howson - be very surprised if that happened personally.

 

 

[billyblack]

Just now, bobness said:

 

Why not tell the fans he's run out of money?

Has he? Just asking. Telling the fans you have run out of money isnt going to go down well. Telling them you cant do something because the EFL says so is something else.

[WalthamOwl]

8 minutes ago, WatfordOwl said:

and with good reason :)

 

I just asked about Paxao.

 

He was asked about his involvement, but the question didn't receive a straight answer other than DC saying he's a good friend, advisor. DC is apparently considering taking him to the interview with Dom Howson - be very surprised if that happened personally.

 

 

reckon we could persuade Dom to erm sort Paxo out? 

Edited March 12, 2020 by WalthamOwl

[bobness]

3 minutes ago, billyblack said:

Has he? Just asking. Telling the fans you have run out of money isnt going to go down well. Telling them you cant do something because the EFL says so is something else.

 

My comment regarding the EFL was tongue in cheek.

 

If one minute we have Bruce and his two assistants, all on very nice salaries. And the next we not only don't need to pay those salaries, but ALSO receive an additional £2m. What does it tell you, when the club is only able to hire a manager, without also bringing in coaching staff?

What does it tell you when out of the blue, the club announces an insane season ticket scheme, which demands you pay for 10 years upfront?

 

The clues suggest the club is in a financial mess, and that DC is only using the EFL/FFP as an excuse. Because DC is always blameless.

[Lucas Joao's Tooth]

2 hours ago, Yellowbelly said:

In hindsight we should have sold. At the time if we’d sold all our best players would you have been happy with the “we’re copying the Brentford model “ line?

This is the problem with some of our fan base, Some have the attitude of "We're Sheffield Wednesday we shouldn't be doing that, we should keep all of our best players, We're too big of a club for us to follow that method, Tin pot clubs etc etc..." We've done nothing in the last 20 years lets be real about it and the "smaller teams" such as Brentford, Peterborough etc are showing us up. Then you've got clubs such as Norwich and our neighbours who both sold players for good money & reaped the rewards. You could go down through most of the Championship and see how other teams have run a sustainable club, buying & selling and we are no further forward than any of them for example Preston, Bristol City & Swansea.

 

EVERY team south of the Premier league will buy and sell players to balance their books, i mean we hardly even sold fringe players.

We bought players who were ageing on big contracts - very risky move, We ended up letting them leave for free at the end of their contracts and they had cost us millions! Abdi Hooper, Jones, Pudil and Matias then we spent a pretty penny on both Reach and Rhodes - Reach is now 27 what's the chances of recouping that money? Rhodes, not a prayer were touching even half the figure and he will end up leaving for free.

Lets look at some of our solid performers over the last few seasons,

Tom Lees, Glenn Loovens, Ross Wallace, Kieren Westwood, Barry Bannan, Kieran Lee, Sam Hutchinson, Steven Fletcher all free transfers or very minimal.

Then we've had Dom Iorfa who cost us hardly anything (250k reported) Mass Luongo who looks promising and we got him at a snip of his valuation (800k-1mill) both look wise investments. 

We spent just under 3 million on Joost Van Aken - We've had Julian Borner and as above Dom Iorfa who both look twice the player he is for 250K.

We need to look at players as a investment, its not even about the Brentford model (which is brilliant) we just need to be more sustainable as a club.

 

Go back over the years and find players that 1. We have bought and sold them for profit, 2. Players that we have developed and sold for decent profit, apart from Joao, who else over the past few years has there been? No one in Chansiri's rein, go even further back and granted we had zero money, Chris Brunt, Antonio, Bougherra, Whelan, Lee Grant and we got measly fees for most of them.

Summary:

Chansiri has wasted money on ageing players, poor investment, poor structure, no sustainability and our more solid performers at the club have been the free/Nominal fee transfers. Joost Van Aken was the best Centre back we found out of 200 players.

 

[bobness]

1 minute ago, Lucas Joao's Tooth said:

This is the problem with some of our fan base, Some have the attitude of "We're Sheffield Wednesday we shouldn't be doing that, we should keep all of our best players, We're too big of a club for us to follow that method, Tin pot clubs etc etc..." We've done nothing in the last 20 years lets be real about it and the "smaller teams" such as Brentford, Peterborough etc are showing us up. Then you've got clubs such as Norwich and our neighbours who both sold players for good money & reaped the rewards. You could go down through most of the Championship and see how other teams have run a sustainable club, buying & selling and we are no further forward than any of them for example Preston, Bristol City & Swansea.

 

EVERY team south of the Premier league will buy and sell players to balance their books, i mean we hardly even sold fringe players.

We bought players who were ageing on big contracts - very risky move, We ended up letting them leave for free at the end of their contracts and they had cost us millions! Abdi Hooper, Jones, Pudil and Matias then we spent a pretty penny on both Reach and Rhodes - Reach is now 27 what's the chances of recouping that money? Rhodes, not a prayer were touching even half the figure and he will end up leaving for free.

Lets look at some of our solid performers over the last few seasons,

Tom Lees, Glenn Loovens, Ross Wallace, Kieren Westwood, Barry Bannan, Kieran Lee, Sam Hutchinson, Steven Fletcher all free transfers or very minimal.

Then we've had Dom Iorfa who cost us hardly anything (250k reported) Mass Luongo who looks promising and we got him at a snip of his valuation (800k-1mill) both look wise investments. 

We spent just under 3 million on Joost Van Aken - We've had Julian Borner and as above Dom Iorfa who both look twice the player he is for 250K.

We need to look at players as a investment, its not even about the Brentford model (which is brilliant) we just need to be more sustainable as a club.

 

Go back over the years and find players that 1. We have bought and sold them for profit, 2. Players that we have developed and sold for decent profit, apart from Joao, who else over the past few years has there been? No one in Chansiri's rein, go even further back and granted we had zero money, Chris Brunt, Antonio, Bougherra, Whelan, Lee Grant and we got measly fees for most of them.

Summary:

Chansiri has wasted money on ageing players, poor investment, poor structure, no sustainability and our more solid performers at the club have been the free/Nominal fee transfers. Joost Van Aken was the best Centre back we found out of 200 players.

 

 

Agree with everything you've said, but am only commenting to let you know how much I admire your username!

 

[billyblack]

14 minutes ago, bobness said:

 

My comment regarding the EFL was tongue in cheek.

 

If one minute we have Bruce and his two assistants, all on very nice salaries. And the next we not only don't need to pay those salaries, but ALSO receive an additional £2m. What does it tell you, when the club is only able to hire a manager, without also bringing in coaching staff?

What does it tell you when out of the blue, the club announces an insane season ticket scheme, which demands you pay for 10 years upfront?

 

The clues suggest the club is in a financial mess, and that DC is only using the EFL/FFP as an excuse. Because DC is always blameless.

Yep fair point. I didnt read the whole thread. Didnt know if the EFL thing was true or not.

 

I agree, the 10 year season ticket smacks of desperation and theres a reason other clubs dont do it.

[WalthamOwl]

If it really is true that finances meant we couldn’t bring in Monks back room staff I don’t believe a word of it. We got a reported 2 million for Bruce, we saved on his and the others 2 Steve’s wages. We also got a reported 5-7 million for Joao. You’re telling me we couldn’t afford a couple of staff. Bullsh1t. 

[billyblack]

13 minutes ago, Lucas Joao's Tooth said:

This is the problem with some of our fan base, Some have the attitude of "We're Sheffield Wednesday we shouldn't be doing that, we should keep all of our best players, We're too big of a club for us to follow that method, Tin pot clubs etc etc..." We've done nothing in the last 20 years lets be real about it and the "smaller teams" such as Brentford, Peterborough etc are showing us up. Then you've got clubs such as Norwich and our neighbours who both sold players for good money & reaped the rewards. You could go down through most of the Championship and see how other teams have run a sustainable club, buying & selling and we are no further forward than any of them for example Preston, Bristol City & Swansea.

 

EVERY team south of the Premier league will buy and sell players to balance their books, i mean we hardly even sold fringe players.

We bought players who were ageing on big contracts - very risky move, We ended up letting them leave for free at the end of their contracts and they had cost us millions! Abdi Hooper, Jones, Pudil and Matias then we spent a pretty penny on both Reach and Rhodes - Reach is now 27 what's the chances of recouping that money? Rhodes, not a prayer were touching even half the figure and he will end up leaving for free.

Lets look at some of our solid performers over the last few seasons,

Tom Lees, Glenn Loovens, Ross Wallace, Kieren Westwood, Barry Bannan, Kieran Lee, Sam Hutchinson, Steven Fletcher all free transfers or very minimal.

Then we've had Dom Iorfa who cost us hardly anything (250k reported) Mass Luongo who looks promising and we got him at a snip of his valuation (800k-1mill) both look wise investments. 

We spent just under 3 million on Joost Van Aken - We've had Julian Borner and as above Dom Iorfa who both look twice the player he is for 250K.

We need to look at players as a investment, its not even about the Brentford model (which is brilliant) we just need to be more sustainable as a club.

 

Go back over the years and find players that 1. We have bought and sold them for profit, 2. Players that we have developed and sold for decent profit, apart from Joao, who else over the past few years has there been? No one in Chansiri's rein, go even further back and granted we had zero money, Chris Brunt, Antonio, Bougherra, Whelan, Lee Grant and we got measly fees for most of them.

Summary:

Chansiri has wasted money on ageing players, poor investment, poor structure, no sustainability and our more solid performers at the club have been the free/Nominal fee transfers. Joost Van Aken was the best Centre back we found out of 200 players.

 

Our transfer dealings to keep the revenue pot moving has been dire for morw years than i care to remember, not just up until brunt and whelan etc, we used to get shafted before that. We have acquired some decent players in the past, but selling has been part of business we just ignore. 

 

Dont know about the 'Brentford', its just a good model. Spend cheaply, train and invest properly, sell for a profit. Just sounds like a proper business to me. We make fun of toytown, dingles etc. Our club hasnt had a proper clue for years I'm sad to say.

[Dick_Turpin]

4 minutes ago, billyblack said:

Yep fair point. I didnt read the whole thread. Didnt know if the EFL thing was true or not.

 

I agree, the 10 year season ticket smacks of desperation and theres a reason other clubs dont do it.

The 10 year ST smacks of cash flow problems. If existing ST holders buy it - ST holders who would all renew anyway which is highly likely given the investment required - it will probably hurt us when it comes to FFP. The accounting is a potential nightmare but given it's at least a 15 year ST the income would have to be spread beyond the nominal 10 year period thereby diluting revenue for FFP purposes. Or maybe he's just rewarding loyal fans. 

[oh_weds_we_love_you]

Got invited to one of these around the time we appointed the ex-Charlton lady as CEO. Invited me just before lunch for the same day, despite the fact it was clear from my communication with the club that I live and work in Scotland (must think all us Owls own a private jet or summat!). Anyhow, I declined based on that but offered time when I was next down for the game - no reply. Glad nothing came of it as I couldn't sit there and listen to "it's business as usual" after pishing away £150m to still be scrapping around the middle of the Championship table.

 

I've been a supporter of Mr Chansiri because he's put his money where is mouth is and invested large sums of money trying to get us to the Premier League - having just failed by the narrowest of margins twice.

 

However, based on the feedback from last night, it appears it still remains "business as usual" despite the fact the rules don't allow that. I struggle to see how anyone can look at what has happened this last 4 years and think ploughing ahead with the same plan is what's needed. That's very difficult to support. Could things from last night have been lost in translation? I just don't get it as we've not spent big for 2 years now and P&S rules block a Wolves-style promotion.

 

Regarding the schemes that the club have come up with recently, I assumed they were methods for him to get his own investment in more legally - I gather, from his comments, that wasn't the plan?

[trev]

5 minutes ago, WalthamOwl said:

If it really is true that finances meant we couldn’t bring in Monks back room staff I don’t believe a word of it. We got a reported 2 million for Bruce, we saved on his and the others 2 Steve’s wages. We also got a reported 5-7 million for Joao. You’re telling me we couldn’t afford a couple of staff. Bullsh1t. 

But even though we had say 9 million come in. Arnt we losing more than that anyway every season ? It's not like that 9 million is sat in the bank is it?

[prowl]

58 minutes ago, bobness said:

 

If I have this right, the EFL permitted DC to sign Bruce and his two costly assistants. But when they left, and £2 compensation was added to the pot, the EFL advised DC that he can only hire a manager without coaching staff?

I doubt the EFL were involved in that decision. I'm not sure it connects to how much money DC has although it might relate to how much he is able to invest.

[WalthamOwl]

9 minutes ago, trev said:

But even though we had say 9 million come in. Arnt we losing more than that anyway every season ? It's not like that 9 million is sat in the bank is it?

maybe DC has kept the 9 million under the floor boards 

[bobness]

12 minutes ago, trev said:

But even though we had say 9 million come in. Arnt we losing more than that anyway every season ? It's not like that 9 million is sat in the bank is it?

 

I have it on good authority, that the 9 million is no longer at hand. It was completely exhausted thanks to an appearance clause in Westwood's contract.