Sheffield Wednesday finances, contracts and players. Grab a cuppa and listen to this.

[@owlstalk]

Just now, Rebowl Yell said:

 

If they’ve moved to the Americas then they have lost their right to be British Citizens in my eyes. That includes following football, moaning about weather and eating fish and chips.

 

Bloody traitors.

 

 

They''ve not moved to the Americas

Just saying

[Rebowl Yell]

Just now, @owlstalk said:

 

 

They''ve not moved to the Americas

Just saying

 

So why is it called Americast Neil? 

[blueowl1946]

1 hour ago, Ever the pessimist said:

I suspect it will be worrying - so i maturely deciding to take the ostrich approach and pay it no heed. 

 

Seeing as you have  already dug the hole ......................................

 

Can I put my head in it anall?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

[matthefish2002]

19 minutes ago, Belfast Owl 2 said:

In todays market we could still shift some of our players for a few million. Transfers fees are daft and plenty of bottom half premier league teams out there. I could see us flog the likes of Hooper, Fletcher, Bannan and FF to them. We didn't pay big transfer fees for them either.

 

The likes of Joao and Matias have plenty of years left and have value.

 

I will admit defeat on Abdi though and we got what we could out of Wallace.

 

David Jones could go to another championship team as well.

 

A clear out is possible although I wouldn't get rid of them all

 

The big stumbling block to moving players on is if Wednesday have offered these players better contracts then the going rate.

We gave Fletcher for example a 4 year contract at a reported £40k per week, which other club is going to match that?

Think its going to need some very clever wheeling and dealing to be challenging for promotion next season.

IMO we are just as far from promotion as we were 2.1/2 years ago.  

[Athelwulf]

But how many clubs have got out of  this league with young, inexperienced players?

 

I'd stick with what we've got.

 

Just get them fitter, faster and stronger.

 

And playing to their strengths wouldn't go amiss.

 

If you want out of this league you're probably going to have to gamble and break FFP, as Wolves have done.

 

It's about timing and having the right manager.

[@owlstalk]

22 minutes ago, Rebowl Yell said:

 

So why is it called Americast Neil? 

 

Why not listen to it and find out?

The subject of this thread isn't who lives in America etc 

If you want to debate FFP after listening to the podcast I'm all ears

Other than that I view your input in this thread as trolling

 

 

[DazUK]

40 minutes ago, Brommers said:

Basically, his purchase cost is spread over several years so say approx £2M per year hits our accounts. If we sold him, it would no doubt be at a loss given his form since arriving so the difference between what we paid for him less one years payment would then have to be charged to our accounts. I don't know the true figures but lets say for example, we bought for £8M, in the first year we accounted approx £2M of that. We then sell for £2.5M but in reality we still owed £5.5M which then becomes chargable to the clubs financial accounts as we can no longer spread these payments out once the player is sold.

 

A bit of a simplistic explanation but hopefully it helps. Unless I totally misunderstood the podcast (wasn't listening too closely) in which case I'll no doubt get negged to death!

Thanks for the explanation pal.

 

[Athelwulf]

2 minutes ago, matthefish2002 said:

 

The big stumbling block to moving players on is if Wednesday have offered these players better contracts then the going rate.

We gave Fletcher for example a 4 year contract at a reported £40k per week, which other club is going to match that?

Think its going to need some very clever wheeling and dealing to be challenging for promotion next season.

IMO we are just as far from promotion as we were 2.1/2 years ago.  

 

Fletcher, on paper, was a good signing.

 

It's just that we've not played in a manner to get the best from him.

 

Ditto Rhodes.

[Plonk]

Haven't listened to it due to time. But was the short term approach instigated by dc or cc? Good that we have some good young uns coming through. Couple if shrewd signings like joey and a few contracts running out. It will be fine. 

[LiamAP22D]

Anyone post a summary, wont be listening.

[Rebowl Yell]

7 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

Why not listen to it and find out?

The subject of this thread isn't who lives in America etc 

If you want to debate FFP after listening to the podcast I'm all ears

Other than that I view your input in this thread as trolling

 

 

 

That hurt.

 

I’m going to go crawl back under my bridge now and listen to this podcast you bully.  

[Athelwulf]

2 minutes ago, Plonk said:

Haven't listened to it due to time. But was the short term approach instigated by dc or cc? Good that we have some good young uns coming through. Couple if shrewd signings like joey and a few contracts running out. It will be fine. 

 

I agree.

 

Develop defenders like Venancio and Van Aken, but stick with he rest.

 

Take Abdi.

 

I refuse to believe that a player as talented as that, who absolutely mullered us and played 30 PL games and looked at ease, can suddenly lose all that ability.

 

How these injured players looked under Siarlemagne, and how they'll look under Jos, might be two different things.

 

Get them playing, coupled with a few developed to boot, and we'd have a promotion side on our sweaty hands.

[BRADDO]

1 hour ago, darklord said:

 

Yet we've just dropped 2m on Joey.  Not the most extensive player  but didn't seem like a small fee either

Have we really spent that much on him as I thought he was out of contract in the summer. 

[matthefish2002]

9 minutes ago, Athelwulf said:

 

Fletcher, on paper, was a good signing.

 

It's just that we've not played in a manner to get the best from him.

 

Ditto Rhodes.

 

They were all good signings on paper, they always are!

Think we are going to fall into a trap of thinking now we have moved on CC the misfiring players will all come good.

Getting a different coach in is a step in the right direction but think it only goes part of the way.

 

 

[BRADDO]

1 hour ago, A12owl said:

Thanks braddo.

Perhaps if it's as bad as is being made out then it's probably best I don't know.Was just getting the feel good factor back with the new manager and a new signing. 

Don't want to have to ring the Samaritans again 

It appears to be recoverable if DC adopts the approach outlined above, but even so they suggest two years of pruning and being sensible with spending. If not, they suggest we could end up in a Birmingham or Blackburn situation 

[BRADDO]

1 hour ago, DazUK said:

I haven't listened to it so apologies if wrong but why doesn't selling Rhodes and  getting his wages off the bill improve our finances  

 

It's complicated and I struggled to understand it myself. Something to do with how the accountancy of FFP works. His 8 million fee is spread over 3 years and I believe they were saying even if we sell we are still committed to a further 6 million over next 2 seasons even if he wasn't at the club. This will limit our spending significantly 

[toppOwl]

35 minutes ago, matthefish2002 said:

 

The big stumbling block to moving players on is if Wednesday have offered these players better contracts then the going rate.

We gave Fletcher for example a 4 year contract at a reported £40k per week, which other club is going to match that?

Think its going to need some very clever wheeling and dealing to be challenging for promotion next season.

IMO we are just as far from promotion as we were 2.1/2 years ago.  

 

Except it wasn't reported that we offered £40k a week, Norwich were offering £35k but we offered a longer contract, people then jumped to conclusions.

[jamthesun]

8 minutes ago, BRADDO said:

It's complicated and I struggled to understand it myself. Something to do with how the accountancy of FFP works. His 8 million fee is spread over 3 years and I believe they were saying even if we sell we are still committed to a further 6 million over next 2 seasons even if he wasn't at the club. This will limit our spending significantly 

 

Not quite.

 

As I understand it players are treated like assets in a business. An asset is something that has ongoing utility. So if I buy a computer for three grand that will last three years before I have to replace it, I charge one grand per year to the P&L for three years. It's called depreciation. If I sell it I after a year I no longer have the asset so I can't charge depreciation. I have to charge the outstanding value (in this case 2 grand) less what I sold it for (let's say 500 quid) so 1500 quid to the PL in year two. There is no charge in year three.

 

So in the case of Rhodes if we assume we bought him for £8M on a three year contract then this year we will have charged one third of £8M to the P&L - ie £2.66M. We'll pay the same in 2018/19 and again in 2019/20. If we sell him at the end of the season for £3m (say) then we'll have to charge the signing fee (£8M) less the depreciation to date (£2.66M) less the fee we get from him (£3m) = £2.34M to the P&L. 

 

Whether we are better off or not depends on the actual fee we paid for him, the actual fee we get for him, the salary we pay him and when in our accounting period we bought him and sell him.

 

We might be better off and we might be worse off depending how all the number balance out. 

[matthefish2002]

17 minutes ago, toppOwl said:

 

Except it wasn't reported that we offered £40k a week, Norwich were offering £35k but we offered a longer contract, people then jumped to conclusions.

 

The exact details of his contract are not really known by any of us but my basic point stands that to move players on we have to find other clubs to match their wages. Fletcher, Abdi and Rhodes have all I not lived up to expectations so we find it near enough impossible to move them on without giving them some sort of generous golden handshake.

[HarrowbyOwl]

Thought that was a really interesting and intelligent discussion about the crossroads that the club finds itself at.

I'm a bit strange though that they talk for over an hour about FFP without mentioning Profitability and Sustainability, D Taxis or Elev 8 - or did I miss that bit?