Garry Monks Contract

[sMacLean]

Would rather have Carlos back or failing that try another continental random.

Felice Mazzu went from Champions League Genk to a 2nd division side in Belgium owned by the Brighton chairman.

Think we could be doing similar business especially post-Covid.

How great would it be to get a Jesse Marsch type from the US maybe.

Far better than Monk's plodding fodder.

[pazowl55]

11 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Posts like this are absolute nonsense, I’m sorry. The regular starting 11 now isn’t even the same as it was under prior managers. Only Bannan, Fletcher and Lees from the 2016-17 side are still regular starters yet people make out that it’s our longest serving players who are the problem. Bannan and Fletcher are probably our two best players still.

 

Luhahky was garbage the whole time, think he won only 1 of his first 10 games. Bruce kept it simple and played his best team and we were on top in most games. Monk comes in and picks his best team but with negative tactics and we somehow scraped our way to third by Xmas. Then he decides to give two key players the boot and ostracise even more by telling them they have no future when there’s still 20 odd games to go and guess what we win only 2 from 14.

 

People seem to want to blame our better players for not performing while accepting the garbage produced by Dawson, Palmer, Lees, Harris, Pelupessy, Nuhui, Murphy (for a large chunk of games), Lee, Rhodes or Winnall etc.

 

So we release Westwood, Hutchinson, Forestieri etc and the whole thing will be sorted will it? Unbelievable. If the team is still made up of the league 1 (and below in some cases) players we currently have starting most games then we’ll continue to get league 1 performances and we’ll eventually end up in League 1. Monk is complicit in this because he keeps picking them and has just renewed the contract of one of them. Needs to leave ASAP

Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sheffield United all had teams largely made up of league 1 players. But all went up because not one person thought they were bigger than the team. 

Why did it go so well for Carlos for two season. Because he had a team full of players all willing to fight for each other and he had leaders in the dressing room like Semedo and Loovens to keep them in check. 

You can not succeed with negative players in a dressing room. 

Edited June 7, 2020 by pazowl55

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sheffield United all had teams larger made up of league 1 players. But all went up because not one person thought they were bigger than the team. 

Why did it go so well for Carlos for two season. Because he had a team full of players all willing to fight for each other and he had leaders in the dressing room like Semedo and Loovens to keep them in check. 

You can not succeed with negative players in a dressing room. 

 

You cannot succeed with a negative manager leading the team.

[beswetherick]

2 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sheffield United all had teams largely made up of league 1 players. But all went up because not one person thought they were bigger than the team. 

Why did it go so well for Carlos for two season. Because he had a team full of players all willing to fight for each other and he had leaders in the dressing room like Semedo and Loovens to keep them in check. 

You can not succeed with negative players in a dressing room. 

 

But the manager plays a huge part in creating that mentality. You put Monk in charge of pigs, Cardiff or Huddersfield with those players and he’d struggle — because he simply isn’t a very good football manager

[pazowl55]

5 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

You cannot succeed with a negative manager leading the team.

Rafa, Conte, Simeone and Mourinho may disagree.

[pazowl55]

5 minutes ago, beswetherick said:

 

But the manager plays a huge part in creating that mentality. You put Monk in charge of pigs, Cardiff or Huddersfield with those players and he’d struggle — because he simply isn’t a very good football manager

They do. but it doesn't have to be a positive tactic just a positive atmosphere. Let's see what Monk does when he get his players in and what he thinks are the trouble makers out.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

Rafa, Conte, Simeone and Mourinho may disagree.

 

Bit different when you have the strongest teams in the division and multi millions to spend. All of those managers also had difficult characters to deal with in the dressing room during their success.

 

Are you comparing these managers with Monk? 

[Tommy Crawshaw]

15 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sheffield United all had teams largely made up of league 1 players. But all went up because not one person thought they were bigger than the team. 

Why did it go so well for Carlos for two season. Because he had a team full of players all willing to fight for each other and he had leaders in the dressing room like Semedo and Loovens to keep them in check. 

You can not succeed with negative players in a dressing room. 

 

5 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

They do. but it doesn't have to be a positive tactic just a positive atmosphere. Let's see what Monk does when he get his players in and what he thinks are the trouble makers out.

 

Go on then, who are these negative players and troublemakers?

[Guest LondonOwl313]

11 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

Huddersfield, Cardiff, Sheffield United all had teams largely made up of league 1 players. But all went up because not one person thought they were bigger than the team. 

Why did it go so well for Carlos for two season. Because he had a team full of players all willing to fight for each other and he had leaders in the dressing room like Semedo and Loovens to keep them in check. 

You can not succeed with negative players in a dressing room. 

I think that’s a bit harsh on some of those teams because they did have some good players in them too. Huddersfield had some quality loan players, Cardiff were more a steady championship team with a manager who knew how to get a team over the line and Utd’s players aren’t really League 1 are they when a fair few of them have them in the top 6 of the Prem. 

 

I really can’t see any situation which would see a team containing the likes of Dawson and Palmer in it winning promotion.

 

Who are the negative players, Westwood and Hutchinson? Because over the years they’ve been great for us, showing leadership and vocal. I dispute that they have a bad attitude because nobody said that between 2014 and 2017. All of this nonsense started when Jos came in and dropped them because they were too injury prone to train day in day out. Bruce made exceptions for the greater good and results unsurprisingly followed that. Monk has reverted back to the Jos model of failure 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, pazowl55 said:

They do. but it doesn't have to be a positive tactic just a positive atmosphere. Let's see what Monk does when he get his players in and what he thinks are the trouble makers out.

 

Who do you think are the trouble makers in the squad he keeps picking? The players he has signed on loan can't get a regular game - you would have thought he would have used them to replace the trouble makers.

 

Half of the squad he uses regularly weren't even here when we had trouble makers under Jos - have they become trouble makers under his management?

He regularly picks Dawson, Palmer, Fox, Borner, Iorfa, Murphy, Fletcher, Fox, Harris, Reach, Nuhiu. Why doesn't he bin them off like he has Westwood and Hutchinson if any of them are trouble makers?

 

The guy is not managing the squad well, the results, the performances, the tactics, the morale - he has responsibility for these and they are getting worse. 

[Guest wilyfox]

20 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Posts like this are absolute nonsense, I’m sorry. The regular starting 11 now isn’t even the same as it was under prior managers. Only Bannan, Fletcher and Lees from the 2016-17 side are still regular starters yet people make out that it’s our longest serving players who are the problem. Bannan and Fletcher are probably our two best players still.

 

Luhahky was garbage the whole time, think he won only 1 of his first 10 games. Bruce kept it simple and played his best team and we were on top in most games. Monk comes in and picks his best team but with negative tactics and we somehow scraped our way to third by Xmas. Then he decides to give two key players the boot and ostracise even more by telling them they have no future when there’s still 20 odd games to go and guess what we win only 2 from 14.

 

People seem to want to blame our better players for not performing while accepting the garbage produced by Dawson, Palmer, Lees, Harris, Pelupessy, Nuhui, Murphy (for a large chunk of games), Lee, Rhodes or Winnall etc.

 

So we release Westwood, Hutchinson, Forestieri etc and the whole thing will be sorted will it? Unbelievable. If the team is still made up of the league 1 (and below in some cases) players we currently have starting most games then we’ll continue to get league 1 performances and we’ll eventually end up in League 1. Monk is complicit in this because he keeps picking them and has just renewed the contract of one of them. Needs to leave ASAP

 

...if recruitment is good. Players have over-stayed, and recruitment has been iffy. We have many players in the squad here 4/5yrs+. This group fell a bit short in their prime. Keep this player fit, get that player back to their best, and it'll be 2016 again? If not, blame the manager. Great strategy.

 

Bruce was a good manager, but someone rightly pointed out he said he wanted 3 windows to overhaul this squad and shape into something useful again. You praise him, then say he's wrong..? 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, wilyfox said:

 

...if recruitment is good. Players have over-stayed, and recruitment has been iffy. We have many players in the squad here 4/5yrs+. This group fell a bit short in their prime. Keep this player fit, get that player back to their best, and it'll be 2016 again? If not, blame the manager. Great strategy.

 

Bruce was a good manager, but someone rightly pointed out he said he wanted 3 windows to overhaul this squad and shape into something useful again. You praise him, then say he's wrong..? 

 

Bruce showed signs of doing that and progress. Results improved and performances were good, you could see what he wanted to do. He has a track record at this level and I would have had confidence in him improving us in each window.

 

Monk has no track record of managerial success. In January he panned the team for their displays - and brought in 3 loan players in his first transfer window that have not markedly improved the team he panned. I see nothing from his tactics of selections that make me think we will go in the right direction under him.

 

The amount of half-time substitutions and tactical changes he makes must be unrivaled, having got his selections so wrong we are often chasing or out of the game inside 45 minutes. Playing Forestieri at wing-back was a new one on me, as it must have been on him and the whole team, guess what, it didn't work and he changed it at half-time - to no avail.

[TheSlicer]

Get John Terry in. Served his apprenticeship. Will get us some good loans. Get super Sam back on board. 

 

win league on record points. With an FA cup win for good measure. 
 

easy peasy lemon squeezy

[TheSlicer]

Get John Terry in. Served his apprenticeship. Will get us some good loans. Get super Sam back on board. 

 

win league on record points. With an FA cup win for good measure. 
 

easy peasy lemon squeezy

[83owl]

31 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Posts like this are absolute nonsense, I’m sorry. The regular starting 11 now isn’t even the same as it was under prior managers. Only Bannan, Fletcher and Lees from the 2016-17 side are still regular starters yet people make out that it’s our longest serving players who are the problem. Bannan and Fletcher are probably our two best players still.

 

Luhahky was garbage the whole time, think he won only 1 of his first 10 games. Bruce kept it simple and played his best team and we were on top in most games. Monk comes in and picks his best team but with negative tactics and we somehow scraped our way to third by Xmas. Then he decides to give two key players the boot and ostracise even more by telling them they have no future when there’s still 20 odd games to go and guess what we win only 2 from 14.

 

People seem to want to blame our better players for not performing while accepting the garbage produced by Dawson, Palmer, Lees, Harris, Pelupessy, Nuhui, Murphy (for a large chunk of games), Lee, Rhodes or Winnall etc.

 

So we release Westwood, Hutchinson, Forestieri etc and the whole thing will be sorted will it? Unbelievable. If the team is still made up of the league 1 (and below in some cases) players we currently have starting most games then we’ll continue to get league 1 performances and we’ll eventually end up in League 1. Monk is complicit in this because he keeps picking them and has just renewed the contract of one of them. Needs to leave ASAP

Monk hasn’t ostracised anyone. Again this is a simple concept that has been over many times. You have to tell players if their contract isn’t going to be renewed, their agents are in constant contact with the club, if they aren’t in negotiations with only 6 months left then they obviously aren’t going to be offered a new deal. To tell them that they are in the future plans when the club isn’t offering them a new contract is a blatant lie. If anything the players are even more at fault as if they wanted to prove the manager wrong and earn a new contract the only way to do that is by good performances which they obviously haven’t put in.

 

As for this players mentioned

Dawson- I hoped given the run of games he would make the position his, he hasn’t.

Palmer-Average championship full back

Lees-Needs a senior player to hold his hand

Harris-deemed not good enough by cardiff

Pelupessy-Cheap foreign gamble, tries hard but clearly not at the level required

Nuhiu-Not good enough

Lee-Serious injury

Winnall-Serious injury

Rhodes-Clearly has some mental problem. Despite his record he has always needed a specific strike partner/style of play to be effective

 

I don’t know why with these players forming a large part of the available squad people think we should be near the top of the league.

[Owls-Fan]

2 minutes ago, OughtibridgeOwl said:

Get John Terry in. Served his apprenticeship. Will get us some good loans. Get super Sam back on board. 

 

win league on record points. With an FA cup win for good measure. 
 

easy peasy lemon squeezy

He has a dodgy past etc but if Terry is considered in the game as being a promising manager then I wouldn’t be against it. Look at Simone at Madrid, he was a c*ck of a player but now one of the worlds best managers. Terry with experienced back room staff might be good for someone. Probably won’t be us mind. 

[83owl]

8 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Bruce showed signs of doing that and progress. Results improved and performances were good, you could see what he wanted to do. He has a track record at this level and I would have had confidence in him improving us in each window.

 

Monk has no track record of managerial success. In January he panned the team for their displays - and brought in 3 loan players in his first transfer window that have not markedly improved the team he panned. I see nothing from his tactics of selections that make me think we will go in the right direction under him.

 

The amount of half-time substitutions and tactical changes he makes must be unrivaled, having got his selections so wrong we are often chasing or out of the game inside 45 minutes. Playing Forestieri at wing-back was a new one on me, as it must have been on him and the whole team, guess what, it didn't work and he changed it at half-time - to no avail.

1 of the loan players all the fans were creaming themselves over and crying for him to come back. Another one is yet another random signing from nowhere (Lachman, urby etc) and the other has done ok.

[Guest LondonOwl313]

3 minutes ago, 83owl said:

Monk hasn’t ostracised anyone. Again this is a simple concept that has been over many times. You have to tell players if their contract isn’t going to be renewed, their agents are in constant contact with the club, if they aren’t in negotiations with only 6 months left then they obviously aren’t going to be offered a new deal. To tell them that they are in the future plans when the club isn’t offering them a new contract is a blatant lie. If anything the players are even more at fault as if they wanted to prove the manager wrong and earn a new contract the only way to do that is by good performances which they obviously haven’t put in.

 

As for this players mentioned

Dawson- I hoped given the run of games he would make the position his, he hasn’t.

Palmer-Average championship full back

Lees-Needs a senior player to hold his hand

Harris-deemed not good enough by cardiff

Pelupessy-Cheap foreign gamble, tries hard but clearly not at the level required

Nuhiu-Not good enough

Lee-Serious injury

Winnall-Serious injury

Rhodes-Clearly has some mental problem. Despite his record he has always needed a specific strike partner/style of play to be effective

 

I don’t know why with these players forming a large part of the available squad people think we should be near the top of the league.

I agree completely with the second half of your post and your assessment of each player. My point is those are the players we need to ship out otherwise we’ll continue to struggle but people seem to want to blame the other ones who aren’t involved for the results on the pitch.

 

As for whether players need to be told in advance. Why can’t the club just say we’re making decisions at the end of the season.. id have thought that was the norm tbh. At Xmas you don’t know what league you’re going to be in sometimes nor what the budget or objective is for next season. It only makes sense to tie down contracts early if you know that you want to retain the players regardless of what happens with results. That’s clearly not the case for some of ours so they should have been kept on their toes until it was time for them to go 

[83owl]

1 hour ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Bruce had us competitive in every game and we won 7, drew 7 and lost 4 under him. We didn’t roll over in any of the games. We actually looked a pretty decent side which just lacked a bit of a killer instinct to convert some of the draws. Should have also beat Villa and Norwich really on the day. But you could see what we were trying to do and it felt like we were building towards something 

 

Monk has been the complete opposite with too many terrible performances to list.

Like I said I think in his first 18 games monk had won 8 drawn 4 and lost 6 and we were competitive in any game. We have no idea how Bruce would have done long term.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, 83owl said:

1 of the loan players all the fans were creaming themselves over and crying for him to come back. Another one is yet another random signing from nowhere (Lachman, urby etc) and the other has done ok.

 

Us fans don't have access to the current fitness record of players - it was clear from first sight of him back in a Wednesday short that he was nowhere near fit - I doubt many would have wanted him back had we known this - the club will have - but we certainly needed a fit striker when Fletcher got injured, it took nearly a month for us to settle on one who wasn't fit.

Windass has done, OK, one of his OK performances came as a half-time sub after Monk yet again got tactics and selections wrong and we had lost the game by half-time.