9 games to go

[Guest Deleted member]

2 hours ago, mkowl said:

I will agree that the Twitter reactions are nonsensical. In the ground you always support the team and the players.

 

I would disagree about on here, there is the odd hysterical meltdown reaction but in the main it is reasoned points that are being made 

 

 

 

Who mentioned anything about the toxic atmosphere on here 

 

People denying it in the ground must be sitting in some kind of bubble. It is toxic, certainly on the kop where I sit. If I confronted everybody and asked them why, I'd spend the whole match doing it 

 

Away games are even worse at times. The above the players got away at Birmingham at the end of the game was shocking. Players were coming to the away end to clap supporters and being 'offered out' by numpties at the front. Same at Leeds. 

 

The abuse reserved for some is appaling. Nuhiu. Liam Palmer. Reach. Sasso. It's a growing list. 

 

Twitter has been an embarrassment. The abuse for last seasons best player Forestieri is second only to that his wife received when she defended him. How 'amazing'. Are we as fans when we resort to abusing players wives?? 

 

All of this from a position where we have been sat comfortably in the play off positions for most of the season. 

 

The abuse has become steadily worse since Xmas, and our performances have too.

 

Players are nervous, you can see that. Nobody wants abusing if they make a poor decision, or a pass goes astray because they've tried something different. 

 

Last season was amazing. It felt great to be a Wednesday fan again, hardly missed a game home and away all season because the togetherness gave us belief... the support war the best collective support for a full season I remember. 

 

Where's all that gone? 

Edited March 12, 2017 by Deleted member

[Guest mkowl]

Like I said Nigel I think part of it as been of self making. The style of play has become more defensive, some games have been insipid to say the least.

 

Add on to the point you have been quite strong about - namely ticket prices then I guess some people want due value from that.

 

I can't comment on away games as I have been an armchair fan for those. At home yes there are one or two near me where I think WTF

 

I wouldn't say it is toxic though. Heard a lot worse over the years. I think part of it is impatience and for me that slight pit of the stomach feeling that Wednesday have to make hay whilst the sun shines out of Chansiri's wallet. 

 

My prediction before the start of the season was where we are now but in light of the additional investment made, the standard of other teams above us then I consider it underperforming

[Guest Deleted member]

But to justify abuse based on us not playing the same style of football as last year is crazy 

 

It makes me laugh that people get offended when I use the same kind of abuse to target abusers.

[Beholder]

3 minutes ago, Grandad said:

But to justify abuse based on us not playing the same style of football as last year is crazy 

 

It makes me laugh that people get offended when I use the same kind of abuse to target abusers.

What makes you think your abuse and negativity is better or more justified than theirs? 

 

It's all the same thing. 

 

 

[Guest mkowl]

I have never thought the need to go on Twitter and verbally abuse a player, but that is modern media options. I blame them businesses that flog good value communication devices and systems as part of the issue. 

 

 

 

 

[Ronnie Starling]

13 hours ago, Grandad said:

The self destruct button has been well and truly pressed, and it's the boring whinging, nothing is ever good enough attention seeking w4nkers of fans we have that have pressed it 

 

Said it weeks ago, before the club and players acknowledged them. The toxic atmosphere and negativity has spread to the players, and the lack of belief has gone along with it. 

 

It will take some turning around, and sadly I think they'll get their way, the manager will go and performances won't improve for some time. 

 

Well done you ar5e4oles. You've set us back. Again. 

 

Grandad you were always moaning about the football played under Gray and even posted a photo of yourself asleep on the Kop. The football isn't much better currently under Carlos. Maybe if you had got behind the team then we might have seen an improvement in the Football. 

[BIG D]

12 hours ago, Athelwulf said:

As was said on Sky Sports after the Leeds defeat, with our players we should finish in the top 6. If we don't it will be down to Carlos' tactics...or lack of them. Blaming the fans is ridiculous. Fans are frustrated because they realize that we're blowing a wonderful chance to go up, with no parachute team in the play-off places. Those who back Carlos will regret it. They'll regret it even more when they see Leeds back in the PL next season.

 

Fancy backing the manager!

F**k me, whatever next?

[Athelwulf]

31 minutes ago, BIG D said:

 

Fancy backing the manager!

F**k me, whatever next?

We're blowing a glorious opportunity here, and the fans who don't back Carlos can see that. Three teams above us who have inferior squads to us, and most importantly of all there's no parachute team in there. I've no doubt Carlos will be gone in the summer, but it's unlikely there'll be no parachute team in there next time, and nobody's going to give us £50 million parachute money to spend.

[WatfordOwl]

20 minutes ago, Athelwulf said:

We're blowing a glorious opportunity here, and the fans who don't back Carlos can see that. Three teams above us who have inferior squads to us, and most importantly of all there's no parachute team in there. I've no doubt Carlos will be gone in the summer, but it's unlikely there'll be no parachute team in there next time, and nobody's going to give us £50 million parachute money to spend.

So you aren't going to answer my earlier post of who you'd replace him with given we've got 9 games to go?

 

You just want to moan.

[Athelwulf]

13 minutes ago, WatfordOwl said:

So you aren't going to answer my earlier post of who you'd replace him with given we've got 9 games to go?

 

You just want to moan.

No I don't just want to moan. Obviously I don't know who'd replace him. How can I? I've no idea who's available, and who'd want to come here. But in any event, that's not my responsibility. I've no idea if Chansiri has put out feelers behind the scenes or not. I suspect Mandy would have, but whether Chansiri has/would is un-knowable. Ironically, I'm not a moaner. I've never moaned since the millennium simply because I understood that our managers were doing an almost impossible job. But I look at the squad we have now, and I look at the three above us, and I just feel that we're letting a glorious opportunity slip through our fingers. A new manager brings new ideas and tactics; at present we're stale and predictable...and we're staying down.

[WatfordOwl]

4 minutes ago, Athelwulf said:

No I don't just want to moan. Obviously I don't know who'd replace him. How can I? I've no idea who's available, and who'd want to come here. But in any event, that's not my responsibility. I've no idea if Chansiri has put out feelers behind the scenes or not. I suspect Mandy would have, but whether Chansiri has/would is un-knowable. Ironically, I'm not a moaner. I've never moaned since the millennium simply because I understood that our managers were doing an almost impossible job. But I look at the squad we have now, and I look at the three above us, and I just feel that we're letting a glorious opportunity slip through our fingers. A new manager brings new ideas and tactics; at present we're stale and predictable...and we're staying down.

I very much doubt that DC has thought about replacing Carlos.

 

He backed him to the hilt in the January transfer window after doing so in the summer, doesn't sound like it's a manager on borrowed time.

 

I disagree that the 3 of the teams above us in the league have inferior squads and would go as far to say there at least the same number not in the top 6 that probably have stronger squads than ours.

 

Nobody could have predicted the amount of injuries we would have to key players and for a man to lose his job over it would probably be about as harsh as it gets.

 

If you believe we've already failed then perhaps you are right but then also believing we can still do it isn't wrong either.

[Owls2k]

14 hours ago, Grandad said:

The self destruct button has been well and truly pressed, and it's the boring whinging, nothing is ever good enough attention seeking w4nkers of fans we have that have pressed it 

 

Said it weeks ago, before the club and players acknowledged them. The toxic atmosphere and negativity has spread to the players, and the lack of belief has gone along with it. 

 

It will take some turning around, and sadly I think they'll get their way, the manager will go and performances won't improve for some time. 

 

Well done you ar5e4oles. You've set us back. Again. 

 

 

It is interesting that you claim there is a toxic atmosphere around the club one paragraph after calling fellow supports 'w4nkers' for not sharing your point of view, what kind of effect do you think that has on said toxicity? 

 

I think it would help everyone if we all calm down a bit to be honest. 

 

In reality most Wednesday fans recognise that last season skewed expectations. However, it is also a fair point that many of this season's performances have not been great, and that we are probably underachieving; Carlos has hinted at this himself many times. Before the first Brighton game this season Carlos mentioned that both teams are of 'similar value', one of them is joint top of the league and the other is clinging on to sixth, separated by 15 points.

 

Playing under high expectations is one of the huge parts of being a professional footballer, especially at a big team with high aspirations such as ours. Our performances in the previous 3 games have actually been pretty decent, Bannan in particular has been excellent. It's also worth pointing out that we lost a play-off final against a club with the most toxic atmosphere in the Championship, whilst ours was the most positive. Which again shows that in the end it's down to the players. 

 

Our issue now is that we're without key players and our average performance so far leaves us at risk of losing the playoff place all together, and this is an issue being caused by our previous performances and now a bit of bad luck with injuries, not the supporters.  

 

 

[LoOkOut]

2 hours ago, Ronnie Starling said:

Grandad you were always moaning about the football played under Gray and even posted a photo of yourself asleep on the Kop. The football isn't much better currently under Carlos. Maybe if you had got behind the team then we might have seen an improvement in the Football. 

God knows how he's gunna dig himself out now

Edited March 12, 2017 by LoOkOut

[Owls2k]

1 hour ago, WatfordOwl said:

I very much doubt that DC has thought about replacing Carlos.

 

He backed him to the hilt in the January transfer window after doing so in the summer, doesn't sound like it's a manager on borrowed time.

 

I disagree that the 3 of the teams above us in the league have inferior squads and would go as far to say there at least the same number not in the top 6 that probably have stronger squads than ours.

 

Nobody could have predicted the amount of injuries we would have to key players and for a man to lose his job over it would probably be about as harsh as it gets.

 

If you believe we've already failed then perhaps you are right but then also believing we can still do it isn't wrong either.

 

DC is too shrewd to not prepare for all possibilities, he'll have a contingency.

 

He's backed Carlos but that doesn't mean he isn't under pressure, an incoming manager with our squad with the possibility of even more excellent additions in the summer would be rubbing their hands together. If we fail to finish in the top 6 I'd be surprised if DC didn't make a change in the summer, he may give him the first part of next season. 

 

Our squad is clearly superior to the other teams in the play offs which is one of the main reasons for constant criticism. Although when you look at the likes of where Derby, Villa, Norwich and even Hull are (who spent £13 million on a striker) then you realise it could be worse, although each of those teams have sacked their manager this season due to poor performances. 

 

In defence of Carlos he's been here almost 2 years and he has never had a solid squad to work with with constant additions being added, he's had to change how we play many times to accommodate big signings. 

 

We could go into the Reading match with 6 of the players who started at Wembley in the treatment room, this is bound to have a big impact but this excuse doesn't mask the average performance up until now. We really need a big effort to hang onto this spot.

Edited March 12, 2017 by Owls2k

[Ronnie Starling]

1 hour ago, WatfordOwl said:

I very much doubt that DC has thought about replacing Carlos.

 

He backed him to the hilt in the January transfer window after doing so in the summer, doesn't sound like it's a manager on borrowed time.

 

I disagree that the 3 of the teams above us in the league have inferior squads and would go as far to say there at least the same number not in the top 6 that probably have stronger squads than ours.

 

Nobody could have predicted the amount of injuries we would have to key players and for a man to lose his job over it would probably be about as harsh as it gets.

 

If you believe we've already failed then perhaps you are right but then also believing we can still do it isn't wrong either.

Chansiri will have thought about replacing Carlos as they will have thought about replacing every player and coach at the club. It will be in the clubs continuity plan. The timing of replacing is a different matter. Let's hope Carlos makes the right decisions so Chansiri doesn't have to make a decision of his own just yet.

[Beauchief Owl]

We lost yesterday, but so did Reading whilst Leeds only drew at home to QPR. Things could be much worse than they are. Next Friday's match at home to Reading is going to be massive on all counts. There is no reason why we can't win this one. Reading's away record is poor and they have recently lost 3-0 away to both Brighton and PNE. We need to get behind the team and cheer them on.

 

If Wednesday play at a slow tempo, choke or go into negative pass back mode they will deserve any criticism that is forthcoming. The pressure is now well and truly on and we're in a scrap but that is no excuse. A few weeks ago we were in a very comfortable position but still managed to play poorly against Brentford, Blackburn and hardly any better against Leeds. We have only ourselves to blame for losing that cushion (despite the fact we actually beat Blackburn rather fortunately) and not beating Burton or Villa has compounded the problem. Quite simply there is now no room for slipups. The same is true for Reading, Leeds and Fulham, however.

Edited March 12, 2017 by Beauchief Owl

[WatfordOwl]

1 hour ago, Owls2k said:

 

DC is too shrewd to not prepare for all possibilities, he'll have a contingency.

 

He's backed Carlos but that doesn't mean he isn't under pressure, an incoming manager with our squad with the possibility of even more excellent additions in the summer would be rubbing their hands together. If we fail to finish in the top 6 I'd be surprised if DC didn't make a change in the summer, he may give him the first part of next season. 

 

Our squad is clearly superior to the other teams in the play offs which is one of the main reasons for constant criticism. Although when you look at the likes of where Derby, Villa, Norwich and even Hull are (who spent £13 million on a striker) then you realise it could be worse, although each of those teams have sacked their manager this season due to poor performances. 

 

In defence of Carlos he's been here almost 2 years and he has never had a solid squad to work with with constant additions being added, he's had to change how we play many times to accommodate big signings. 

 

We could go into the Reading match with 6 of the players who started at Wembley in the treatment room, this is bound to have a big impact but this excuse doesn't mask the average performance up until now. We really need a big effort to hang onto this spot.

The difference being, I wouldn't consider our performance this season to be poor - each of the other teams mentioned have had a poor season by their standards.......probably harsher to judge Hull among that group.

 

Again I disagree with the 2nd paragraph highlighted as the suggestion is we are not in a position that indicates we're having a successful season, which in my view we are, regardless of how the results have come about we still have the 6th most points on the board as it stands.

 

My take on it for what it's worth, is that this season was always going to be a difficult one given how well we did last time round. Having to contend with the post playoff hangover, improving the squad, playing entertaining football and living up to unrealistic expectations. Personally, at the start of the season I would have taken another shot at the playoffs, with perhaps an outside chance of top 2 still existing come the business end of the season.

 

53 minutes ago, Ronnie Starling said:

Chansiri will have thought about replacing Carlos as they will have thought about replacing every player and coach at the club. It will be in the clubs continuity plan. The timing of replacing is a different matter. Let's hope Carlos makes the right decisions so Chansiri doesn't have to make a decision of his own just yet.

I agree with this, which is the reason we all need to show some unity and get behind everyone in the run in.

 

You'd hope that with the caliber of manager we could attract given our resources/squad, that we'll be looking to someone with a little more experience than Gary Rowett though.

[Guest Deleted member]

4 hours ago, Ronnie Starling said:

Grandad you were always moaning about the football played under Gray and even posted a photo of yourself asleep on the Kop. The football isn't much better currently under Carlos. Maybe if you had got behind the team then we might have seen an improvement in the Football. 

Anybody who claims our football is remotely similar to the absolute dirge Gray turned out is either a. Lying to justify a poor point or 

B. Didn't attend the games under Gray, or the current games,  or probably both 

 

In Grays full season he led us to 5 glorious victories at home scoring 16 goals in the process. He regularly played 4-5-1 at home, even against struggling teams line Rotherham 

 

One of those marvelous victories was a Boxing Day 1-0 against Blackpool, who were relegated with one of the lowest point hauls ever seen in Championship history. We won courtesy of a Chris Maguire first half penalty then defended resolutely for the rest of the game. 

 

We werent as exciting as Burton the other night 

 

I didn't post a picture of me asleep at a Stuart Gray game either. That picture was taken by Neil during Alan Irvines time here, who put me to sleep twice such was the dull football he played. Stuart Gray managed it 3 times. 

 

By contrast we have already won more than 2.5 times the games at home this season scoring twice the amount of goals. 

 

These are facts. If you're going to jump on the bandwagon you're going to need to argue your points against facts like these. 

 

Over to you 

[Ronnie Starling]

32 minutes ago, Grandad said:

Anybody who claims our football is remotely similar to the absolute dirge Gray turned out is either a. Lying to justify a poor point or 

B. Didn't attend the games under Gray, or the current games,  or probably both 

 

In Grays full season he led us to 5 glorious victories at home scoring 16 goals in the process. He regularly played 4-5-1 at home, even against struggling teams line Rotherham 

 

One of those marvelous victories was a Boxing Day 1-0 against Blackpool, who were relegated with one of the lowest point hauls ever seen in Championship history. We won courtesy of a Chris Maguire first half penalty then defended resolutely for the rest of the game. 

 

We werent as exciting as Burton the other night 

 

I didn't post a picture of me asleep at a Stuart Gray game either. That picture was taken by Neil during Alan Irvines time here, who put me to sleep twice such was the dull football he played. Stuart Gray managed it 3 times. 

 

By contrast we have already won more than 2.5 times the games at home this season scoring twice the amount of goals. 

 

These are facts. If you're going to jump on the bandwagon you're going to need to argue your points against facts like these. 

 

Over to you 

I seem to remember a direct 1-0 win against arguably the Championships worst team in Rotherham this season courtesy of a dubious last minute penalty win similar teams have hammered the same team.

 

There have been plenty of "exciting" performances at home this season with the sideways backwards shuffle amongst the back 5 and only one game where fans have left fully content with a great performance.q

 

As for our 2.5 times win ratio and goals scored I would expect nothing less and probably more considering the strike power we have. Gray had nothing of the like at his disposal.

 

But for the poor football served by Gray Carlos will have all on to beat Grays away record that season and to save you looking it up he will have to win every away game to do so. You would expect a far better return wouldn't you considering the resources at his disposal?

[Owls2k]

2 hours ago, WatfordOwl said:

The difference being, I wouldn't consider our performance this season to be poor - each of the other teams mentioned have had a poor season by their standards.......probably harsher to judge Hull among that group.

 

Again I disagree with the 2nd paragraph highlighted as the suggestion is we are not in a position that indicates we're having a successful season, which in my view we are, regardless of how the results have come about we still have the 6th most points on the board as it stands.

 

My take on it for what it's worth, is that this season was always going to be a difficult one given how well we did last time round. Having to contend with the post playoff hangover, improving the squad, playing entertaining football and living up to unrealistic expectations. Personally, at the start of the season I would have taken another shot at the playoffs, with perhaps an outside chance of top 2 still existing come the business end of the season.

 

I said average not poor which I think is pretty fair, finishing outside the top 6 would be a poor season. 

 

In the summer the general consensus was that this season would be much tougher due to the likes of Newcastle, Villa and Norwich coming down with huge expectations and spending power. In reality only Newcastle out of those have competed at the high end of the table, Derby have fallen off the face of the Earth and Leeds, Reading and Huddersfield have come out of the blue. This season could be a huge opportunity missed in the end, I actually fancy us in the playoffs if the current teams end up in them. 

 

It will certainly be interesting to see what DC does in the summer if we don't get promoted.