TheEnchanter Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 If people are putting time scales on his reign then I reckon that the mistake Milan made with letting Irvine spunk £1mill down the drain in January 2011 will make DJ have less time, perhaps he only has these next two home games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codrowe Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Just to all of you screaming like spoilt kids for DJs head and instant success. And those of you saying that 'results can't get any worse'. Cast your minds back to a few seasons ago. This time 3 years ago we were in the process of not scoring in 9 hours of football, culminating in Laws' sacking after an embarassing 5-0 defeat at Leicester. And under Irvine in 2010- spineless defeat after spineless defeat in the third tier. Losing without a whimper at Tranmere, at Stevenage, at Oldham. Only being able to draw despite playing against 9 men (MK Dons?) for 45 minutes... Make no mistake, it can get much, much worse than it is at the minute. If we force DJ out, we risk going into freefall. The players are still playing for their manager, and we are competing in almost all of our games. That to me suggests that a sacking will worsen the situation, especially with no stand-out candidate to come in. You forgot the 5-0 drubbing at Exeter , the lowest point i can ever remember , and yes i was around when w had to beat Southend to stay up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Almat Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 I said 'I reckon' because it is an opinion, not a statement of fact. A prediction isn't a statement of fact either (and that's what I called it). You have demonstrated some pretty muddled thinking in this thread imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robswfc Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 How much time do you give him then? Got to give him until the new year. If we get >10 points from the rest of November and December then he should be given the the transfer window and rest of season. If we get less than 8 points, and performances have got worse, then you can look at sacking him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nejc_Pe�nik Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 He will have until the end of November. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trevdi9 Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 top post enchanter,and many are thinking the same ,Why should we settle for fourth bottom and say we would accept that ,at least middle just under would be acceptable, whatever the problem is it's manifesting itself more every loss and tbh i can't for the life of me see any change happening to say the least other than divine intervention , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nejc_Pe�nik Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Got to give him until the new year. If we get >10 points from the rest of November and December then he should be given the the transfer window and rest of season. If we get less than 8 points, and performances have got worse, then you can look at sacking him. Don't forget the new manager would have to asses the squad, he'd need time to do that. From december until january would make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robswfc Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 A prediction isn't a statement of fact either (and that's what I called it). You have demonstrated some pretty muddled thinking in this thread imo. Sorry, I don't take the time to read your thrilling posts to the letter...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Whether it is bad signings, bad man management, bad tactics or just bad luck can be debated all day. But a blind man on a charging horse can see that the gane is up for Jones..Each lost game that passes just makes the job of his successor that bit harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiJ Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Whether it is bad signings, bad man management, bad tactics or just bad luck can be debated all day. But a blind man on a charging horse can see that the gane is up for Jones..Each lost game that passes just makes the job of his successor that bit harder. Sadly - you are probably right. I just can't see Jones turning this around, though I desperately hope he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironman Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Jones is a marked man and he knows it. It's gone too far for him to turn this mess around now. People are deluded saying we've got to give him more time. This runs continues up to Xmas and we'll be in a dogfight for the rest of the season with any 3 from 4,5 maybe 6 teams going down. There's nothing to back up some peoples 'we'll be alright in the end' or 'our bad luck will change' arguments. Look at 2 seasons ago. Needs a new manager in there now before it's too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MrsGoggins Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Is MM around to sack him because he's not attended a game for some time. When he does call time a replacement will be lined up first and come straight in. The next few weeks will show us how commited he is or are rumours of him selling up true, time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Old Salt Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I saw him at the Blackpool game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robswfc Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 (edited) Whether it is bad signings, bad man management, bad tactics or just bad luck can be debated all day. But a blind man on a charging horse can see that the gane is up for Jones..Each lost game that passes just makes the job of his successor that bit harder. Jones is a marked man and he knows it. It's gone too far for him to turn this mess around now. People are deluded saying we've got to give him more time. This runs continues up to Xmas and we'll be in a dogfight for the rest of the season with any 3 from 4,5 maybe 6 teams going down. There's nothing to back up some peoples 'we'll be alright in the end' or 'our bad luck will change' arguments. Look at 2 seasons ago. Needs a new manager in there now before it's too late. Well you can use that kind of sensationalist language if you like. It'll probably persuade some of those that are on the fence on this one. But, like I said in the OP, it can get a lot rumbleing worse than it is now. We're not at the stage of complete meltdown that we've all seen before. I believe we will struggle to survival under Jones. Some of you want change in the completely blind hope that change itself will make things better. But change may very well make things worse, and may condemn us to relegation. There is such a thing called the 'precautionary approach'. This states that in the absence of consensus that an action is harmful or not harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action. If we are sacking him, we need to be sure we are not going to make the situation worse. We can't be sure of that because the situation can still get worse. So we don't sack him (yet). That may sound like a load of bullshit, but if you keep trying to force DJ out, and we sack him, and the team spirit goes, and we start losing games by multiple goals (like under Laws at the end, and under Irvine), and we don't ever look like scoring, and we fall to the very foot of the table. If that happens again, and we get relegated, I will be rumbleing furious with the lot of you. Edited November 19, 2012 by robswfc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingsidney Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Well you can use that kind of sensationalist language if you like. It'll probably persuade some of those that are on the fence on this one. But, like I said in the OP, it can get a lot rumbleing worse than it is now. We're not at the stage of complete meltdown that we've all seen before. I believe we will struggle to survival under Jones. Some of you want change in the completely blind hope that change itself will make things better. But change may very well make things worse, and may condemn us to relegation. There is such a thing called the 'precautionary approach'. This states that in the absence of consensus that an action is harmful or not harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action. If we are sacking him, we need to be sure we are not going to make the situation worse. We can't be sure of that because the situation can still get worse. So we don't sack him (yet). That may sound like a load of bullshit, but if you keep trying to force DJ out, and we sack him, and the team spirit goes, and we start losing games by multiple goals (like under Laws at the end, and under Irvine), and we don't ever look like scoring, and we fall to the very foot of the table. If that happens again, and we get relegated, I will be rumbleing furious with the lot of you. our current run is worse than the one that laws went on. so you should be furious already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrosbyKitchens Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Well you can use that kind of sensationalist language if you like. It'll probably persuade some of those that are on the fence on this one. But, like I said in the OP, it can get a lot rumbleing worse than it is now. We're not at the stage of complete meltdown that we've all seen before. I believe we will struggle to survival under Jones. Some of you want change in the completely blind hope that change itself will make things better. But change may very well make things worse, and may condemn us to relegation. There is such a thing called the 'precautionary approach'. This states that in the absence of consensus that an action is harmful or not harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action. If we are sacking him, we need to be sure we are not going to make the situation worse. We can't be sure of that because the situation can still get worse. So we don't sack him (yet). That may sound like a load of bullshit, but if you keep trying to force DJ out, and we sack him, and the team spirit goes, and we start losing games by multiple goals (like under Laws at the end, and under Irvine), and we don't ever look like scoring, and we fall to the very foot of the table. If that happens again, and we get relegated, I will be rumbleing furious with the lot of you. Good god, are you serious? Jones has had a MASSIVE amount of support. Look at Keen at Blackburn if you want to talk about fans on a witchhunt. Has there been a single "jones out" chant at any game??? You're opening post was also ridiculously off the mark as we're not in anything like the situation we were two or three years ago. We have an owner who, quite simply, can't afford to let us go down. If Jones is failing to comfortably keep us up (which I think he is right now) then the chairman will make a move to rectify the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailand owl Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Got to give him until the new year. If we get >10 points from the rest of November and December then he should be given the the transfer window and rest of season. If we get less than 8 points, and performances have got worse, then you can look at sacking him. Got to give him until the new year. If we get >10 points from the rest of November and December then he should be given the the transfer window and rest of season. If we get less than 8 points, and performances have got worse, then you can look at sacking him. What if we get 9 points ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sweet&TenderOwl Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 We'd be lucky to even get four or five. I just can't see where the goals and points are goibg to come from? MM will have no choice sooner or later. And it will be for the good of the club, just like when Irvine and Megson were replaced. Managers and players come and go but we're all Wednesday till we die. We all want whats best for our club and to stay up. If DJ can't gurantee that, sooner or later MM will realise that and DJ will have to go. If he turns it around somehow, which looks unlikely, then that's just as good as we all want to see us survive and compete. What will be, will be... WTID Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wilf Marshall Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 MM won't tolerate it much longer. He doesn't want to be weeing close to the wind like this. We haven't done anything with the momentum and spirit from last season. I just don't see who we replace him with. He could turn it around if we sign some players but will MM give him the chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 (edited) Well you can use that kind of sensationalist language if you like. It'll probably persuade some of those that are on the fence on this one. But, like I said in the OP, it can get a lot rumbleing worse than it is now. We're not at the stage of complete meltdown that we've all seen before. I believe we will struggle to survival under Jones. Some of you want change in the completely blind hope that change itself will make things better. But change may very well make things worse, and may condemn us to relegation. There is such a thing called the 'precautionary approach'. This states that in the absence of consensus that an action is harmful or not harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action. If we are sacking him, we need to be sure we are not going to make the situation worse. We can't be sure of that because the situation can still get worse. So we don't sack him (yet). That may sound like a load of bullshit, but if you keep trying to force DJ out, and we sack him, and the team spirit goes, and we start losing games by multiple goals (like under Laws at the end, and under Irvine), and we don't ever look like scoring, and we fall to the very foot of the table. If that happens again, and we get relegated, I will be rumbleing furious with the lot of you. The Precautionary Approach 10,000 BC...Two cavemen are sat waiting to go the match..lets call oneBigguns and the other robswfc. BG..."somethings go to change, I was thinking about what would happen if I rubbed these two sticks together and knocked the corners off these square bits of rock". robswfc..."You want change in the completely blind hope that change itself will make things better. But change may very well make things worse, and may condemn us to relegation (whatever that is). There is such a thing called the 'precautionary approach'. This states that in the absence of consensus that an action is harmful or not harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action. If we are going around rubbing sticks together and knocking corners off rock, we need to be sure we are not going to make the situation worse. We can't be sure of that because the situation can still get worse. So leave those sticks and stones alone and come back here to eat this raw meat,its a long walk to the match." Edited November 19, 2012 by kobayashi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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