Is this the future of football ?

[mcmigo]

Occasionally I have the misfortune of watching one of the brain rotting videos my son ( 11) and his mates watch on YouTube when they are together .  They tend to be the usual shouting nonsense promoting prime energy drink and doing stupid challenges but the other day he was watching this video by ‘ the wingroves’ 

 

It really struck a nerve with me in lots of ways:  

 

1.  There is no love for the team they are watching, or the game.  They only care about one player as evidenced by the inane yelling for Messi only.  I don’t think the wingrove guy knows the name of any other players . 

2.  Football is becoming just another insta experience.  There is little interest in being there other than to show you have been there.

3.  Football is being reduced to a celebrity experience.  Seeing Messi live being the equivalent of seeing Taylor swift live.

4.  Getting a Messi kit / any interactions with Messi and the documentation thereof is more important than the game or result.

5.  The Saudis and Americans have probably got this whole thing right .  Pay massive money and get the people with massive money to pay massive money for these ‘ experiences’ to see Ronaldo/ Messi .  The team they are playing for or against is irrelevant.  It’s all about being there, or more importantly saying and showing you have been there:

 

I found it really sad, maybe a sign of age.  I will also say that , for my son and his mates, if I offered him a choice of meeting barry bannan and getting a selfie and signed shirt, or watching us play 90 minutes in an exciting win , he would pick the former as would all of his mates.  He would also pick seeing Ronaldo and getting a signed Ronaldo shirt for whoever he play for now for one game in Saudi over a season watching Wednesday.  
 

I am not sure how personally or as a society we can turn back the clock on this, or indeed whether we should or not.  Maybe it’s just evolution.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ever the pessimist]

See / hear this a lot with kids at school. Had a fair few conversations where kids can’t understand supporting Wednesday (or United) given that they’re not very good. Had plenty ask ‘why support them then?’ when I agree Wednesday are rubbish!

Their argument is that they want to be entertained and they want to see their team win things, so consider it totally logical to follow whoever is most likely to do so, even if it means changing teams as required. 
 

I suppose that’s always been present, but the following of one player over a team is new. When Ronaldo came back to Man U there was a spell when kids where shouting that ‘suuuuiii’ (did my head in). I remember a lad who had previously enjoyed Liverpool winning the league doing it, so I pointed out the apparent contradiction. His response ‘I support Ronaldo and Salah’

[Ellis Rimmer]

Kids were like this when I was a kid, granted I live in Doncaster but everyone supported Man Utd with a few Newcastle/Liverpool. As people grow up they start actually going to watch football and obviously drawn to more local clubs. Obviously you have the man child that still supports Man Utd/Liverpool but they tend to be just armchair fans and apart from buying shirts occasionally the club won't get much money from them. 

 

 

[mcmigo]

4 minutes ago, Ellis Rimmer said:

Kids were like this when I was a kid, granted I live in Doncaster but everyone supported Man Utd with a few Newcastle/Liverpool. As people grow up they start actually going to watch football and obviously drawn to more local clubs. Obviously you have the man child that still supports Man Utd/Liverpool but they tend to be just armchair fans and apart from buying shirts occasionally the club won't get much money from them. 

 

 

I agree, but I see it now as evolving further.

 

the dynamic of supporting superstar players over teams is a new one.  Also it feels that being there is more important than what happens when you are there , if that makes sense.  A selfie with a star player being more valuable than seeing your team win.

 

Another example- one of my sons mates desperately wants us to get Wrexham in the cup to have a chance to ‘ meet Ben foster.’ Now Ben foster to you or I is a clapped out league 2 keeper and no different  to say Kieren Westwood or whoever the Stockport goalie is in the scheme of things.  But to my kid and his mates he is a huge football celeb.  If we drew Wrexham in the cup I would only care that we hammer them and send them back to wales with their tails between their legs.

 

 

[HighworthOwl]

It is a strange new world. Almost every football conversation online comes down to Messi v Ronaldo fanboys. Its all very odd. 

 

There is the weird obsession with modern sports men and women being the GOAT. I'm getting old as I understand none of it. 

[HighworthOwl]

1 minute ago, mcmigo said:

I agree, but I see it now as evolving further.

 

the dynamic of supporting superstar players over teams is a new one.  Also it feels that being there is more important than what happens when you are there , if that makes sense.  A selfie with a star player being more valuable than seeing your team win.

 

Another example- one of my sons mates desperately wants us to get Wrexham in the cup to have a chance to ‘ meet Ben foster.’ Now Ben foster to you or I is a clapped out league 2 keeper and no different  to say Kieren Westwood or whoever the Stockport goalie is in the scheme of things.  But to my kid and his mates he is a huge football celeb.  If we drew Wrexham in the cup I would only care that we hammer them and send them back to wales with their tails between their legs.

 

 

 

I suppose in a way supporting a proper superstar is a way of cushioning yourself against defeat. Messi is likely to play for teams that win. Even the likes of Man United are having a slump relatively speaking. Its glory supporting effectively and the cult of celebrity is incredibly strong. 

 

At the weekend Crawford vs Spence Jr was a fight between two world class boxers but it would get nowhere near as much attention / view as a youtuber fighting someone. 

[Ellis Rimmer]

7 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

I agree, but I see it now as evolving further.

 

the dynamic of supporting superstar players over teams is a new one.  Also it feels that being there is more important than what happens when you are there , if that makes sense.  A selfie with a star player being more valuable than seeing your team win.

 

Another example- one of my sons mates desperately wants us to get Wrexham in the cup to have a chance to ‘ meet Ben foster.’ Now Ben foster to you or I is a clapped out league 2 keeper and no different  to say Kieren Westwood or whoever the Stockport goalie is in the scheme of things.  But to my kid and his mates he is a huge football celeb.  If we drew Wrexham in the cup I would only care that we hammer them and send them back to wales with their tails between their legs.

 

 

True, it's a very American way of supporting, exactly what they do there

[mcmigo]

It kind of reminds me of that classic take down interview of the presenter Tim lovejoy. He was asked who his all time favourite player was , and he said it was Johan cruyff.  When the interviewer probed further given that lovejoy was only a toddler when cruyff was playing, he admitted the only time he had ever seen cruyff play was a 3 second clip on the internet of the famous cruyff turn.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OneEightSixSeven]

My hope is that there’s still enough normal/intelligent people still out there. If not, most clubs will fold.

[Ellis Rimmer]

9 minutes ago, OneEightSixSeven said:

My hope is that there’s still enough normal/intelligent people still out there. If not, most clubs will fold.

There will eventually be a schism so you have an NFL type world league and then a more normal domestic game so I don't think they'll go bust but will be very different 

 

If it's right about fans being eroded and being more player interested than the support they go to not form a super league will be less and less until it happens and you might find fans of those teams more receptive to it 

[OneEightSixSeven]

2 minutes ago, Ellis Rimmer said:

There will eventually be a schism so you have an NFL type world league and then a more normal domestic game so I don't think they'll go bust but will be very different 

 

If it's right about fans being eroded and being more player interested than the support they go to not form a super league will be less and less until it happens and you might find fans of those teams more receptive to it 

Don’t really want to witness the working man’s game end that way, as a total global elite dominated sport. I know it’s already kind of half way there but still.

[Ellis Rimmer]

1 minute ago, OneEightSixSeven said:

Don’t really want to witness the working man’s game end that way, as a total global elite dominated sport. I know it’s already kind of half way there but still.

It might be good if we're actually in the running to win things 

[sheffield_dave]

My exposure to the content my 10 year old son watches is that everything is disposable and vacuous and that nothing matters anymore other than shouting about what you've got and who is the best, although I realise saying that makes me sound about 136 years old.

 

"The Wingroves" primary concern is creating content for their audience, and that content is essentially just showing off. To them watching Messi play for Inter Miami is just an experience they can stick their screaming heads on a thumbnail for to tell 1.6m subscribers (for gods sake) that they were there. And the upshot of that is that this is what kids apparently want to see.

 

There's a local lad called Morgz who runs a similar channel. Big Wednesday fan. Nice lad by all accounts, I'm sure he's sound, but his content is unfathomably awful. His content is just shouting, talking to people like a piece of sh*t and spending vast amounts of money. Not sure any Wednesday content has the appeal as seeing Messi.. don't think he bothers with that.

 

Ryan Reynolds has got it bang on and threaded the needle on how smaller clubs deal with this. DC needs to get himself to the next red carpet event in Leicester Square and see if he can bag himself a deal. 

[OneEightSixSeven]

Just now, Ellis Rimmer said:

It might be good if we're actually in the running to win things 

Now your imagination is running away with you..

[Braddas_owl]

2 hours ago, mcmigo said:

Occasionally I have the misfortune of watching one of the brain rotting videos my son ( 11) and his mates watch on YouTube when they are together .  They tend to be the usual shouting nonsense promoting prime energy drink and doing stupid challenges but the other day he was watching this video by ‘ the wingroves’ 

 

It really struck a nerve with me in lots of ways:  

 

1.  There is no love for the team they are watching, or the game.  They only care about one player as evidenced by the inane yelling for Messi only.  I don’t think the wingrove guy knows the name of any other players . 

2.  Football is becoming just another insta experience.  There is little interest in being there other than to show you have been there.

3.  Football is being reduced to a celebrity experience.  Seeing Messi live being the equivalent of seeing Taylor swift live.

4.  Getting a Messi kit / any interactions with Messi and the documentation thereof is more important than the game or result.

5.  The Saudis and Americans have probably got this whole thing right .  Pay massive money and get the people with massive money to pay massive money for these ‘ experiences’ to see Ronaldo/ Messi .  The team they are playing for or against is irrelevant.  It’s all about being there, or more importantly saying and showing you have been there:

 

I found it really sad, maybe a sign of age.  I will also say that , for my son and his mates, if I offered him a choice of meeting barry bannan and getting a selfie and signed shirt, or watching us play 90 minutes in an exciting win , he would pick the former as would all of his mates.  He would also pick seeing Ronaldo and getting a signed Ronaldo shirt for whoever he play for now for one game in Saudi over a season watching Wednesday.  
 

I am not sure how personally or as a society we can turn back the clock on this, or indeed whether we should or not.  Maybe it’s just evolution.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Most of them with a rotten brain will go to lane so shouldn’t be our problem 

[edmontonowl]

8 hours ago, sheffield_dave said:

 

 

Ryan Reynolds has got it bang on and threaded the needle on how smaller clubs deal with this. DC needs to get himself to the next red carpet event in Leicester Square and see if he can bag himself a deal. 

 

Closest he'll get to the red carpet is DC Cabs in the Leicester Sq. taxi rank

[modboy]

It’s why we should go back to kids for a quid etc / giving free tickets away to schools etc like we used to. Not like we don’t have room is it! 
 

 

[thewookieisdown]

Interesting post.

 

The other trend is that the superclubs will strengthen their position. The EPL is a terrific global brand, but no one much cares if the also rans are Burnley or Southampton. VR has become overshadowed in recent discourse by the excitement over the large language models, but it's a thing, and using it to "attend" Chelsea or Bayern's home games really is just around the corner.

 

I do wonder if we will see more of people identifying with two clubs: kids will support Wednesday and one of the big clubs.

[Bannofan]

Your not wrong, and far too many players just care about the money now.

 

Footballers don't have great principles and morals , they have talent but they aren't exactly great role models. You don't see that when you're a certain age though. 

 

Young kids just reflect the mercenary attitude of players. Support the 'moment ', teams aren't for life. 

 

 

[sheffield_dave]

14 minutes ago, thewookieisdown said:

I do wonder if we will see more of people identifying with two clubs: kids will support Wednesday and one of the big clubs.

 

This already happens, although it's more like "multiple" big clubs.

 

The elite level of football now might as well be a different sport to anything we play or are familiar with. I honestly don't see it as any worse or any more of a problem than "following" teams across different sports, particularly the big American sports. It just is what it is.