Wednesday 'want Sam Winnall back from Derby County'

[theowlsman]

5 hours ago, HelloThere said:

The more I see of Sheffield Wednesday the more I come to the conclusion you are on the same path as us but a season behind;

 

We both got to Wembley and arsed it up

Followed it up with high expectations and another failed playoff attempt

Followed that up with a season of rubbish and trying to recall a striker from a loan deal to a rival that should never have happened in the first place

 

If it's any consolation if I am right you are due an up turn next season! If it had to be you guys or the Blades doing well I would take you lot all day.

 

We’re a proper club. Good luck btw. Mutual Appreciation Society

[quinnssweetshop]

Bully... " Does anyone know where Carlos left the keys for the managers bog ? "

 

 

The club really is in the crap

[Lawrie Madden]

1 hour ago, heppers said:

 

Why would he know? 

Because Obviously he should have spent the week and a bit he's been in charge looking through all the paperwork instead of trying to win football matches 

[heppers]

1 minute ago, Lawrie Madden said:

Because Obviously he should have spent the week and a bit he's been in charge looking through all the paperwork instead of trying to win football matches 

 

Exactly 

[WL_Owl_JC]

He should not have said anything until he knew the situation. Just makes him look amateurish. Needs better press training.

[Robdylan]

4 hours ago, Lawrie Madden said:

Because Obviously he should have spent the week and a bit he's been in charge looking through all the paperwork instead of trying to win football matches 

 

Forget the sarcasm, it's an absolute joke that he doesn't know.

 

It's not a criticism against Lee personally, it's against the club. 

 

How long as he worked as Carlos's assistant?

 

He's now in temporary charge. 

 

It's absolutely disgraceful and cringeworthy that he doesn't know. 

 

At present, this club is an absolute shambles from top to bottom. 

[Robdylan]

4 hours ago, heppers said:

 

Exactly 

 

You don't think a man in his position should be privy to such information?

 

Seriously? 

 

 

[Birley Owl 1867]

6 minutes ago, Robdylan said:

 

You don't think a man in his position should be privy to such information?

 

Seriously? 

 

 

No. He was the coach not the manager. I doubt it would have come up in their discussions either

[Robdylan]

5 minutes ago, Birley Owl 1867 said:

No. He was the coach not the manager. I doubt it would have come up in their discussions either

 

Yes, the coach. 

 

And??

 

Are you serious?

 

It should have been common knowledge between the first team staff.

 

How could it NOT have come up in discussions?

 

What??

 

 

Fernando's been out for 3 months. We still don't know when he'll be back.

 

Rhodes has been struggling.

 

We only had 5 shots on target in a whole month.

 

We've slipped down to 16th in the league. 

 

 

Now just take a moment to take the above into account, and then tell me that a man in Lee's position shouldn't know the answer to the question he was asked. 

 

If Lee genuinely doesn't know the answer, then me and you may as well turn up to Middlewood each morning instead.

 

It's absolutely mind boggling.

 

I can't believe that you don't think it's a complete shambles. 

[Jennz]

8 hours ago, Silkstone Owl said:

If the agreement has to be mutual involving both Winnall and Butterfield that makes it even more complicated 

 

Still doesn’t absolve the club of not knowing the crack with whether we could recall him.....just makes me feel more sorry for LB being put in that position when the question being asked was rather obvious, given his goals for Derby.

 

Im still not sure what Winnall would actually do for us given we don’t play particularly to his strengths.

 

Who's saying the club doesn't know?...of course they know, it'll be written in the contract, assuming they have a copy & know where it's filed.

 

I'm not surprised Bullen doesn't know, I'd be surprised if he did, why would he need to know all the details at the time the deal was done?...if he needs to know now then it's easily obtainable.

[Birley Owl 1867]

32 minutes ago, Robdylan said:

 

Yes, the coach. 

 

And??

 

Are you serious?

 

It should have been common knowledge between the first team staff.

 

How could it NOT have come up in discussions?

 

What??

 

 

Fernando's been out for 3 months. We still don't know when he'll be back.

 

Rhodes has been struggling.

 

We only had 5 shots on target in a whole month.

 

We've slipped down to 16th in the league. 

 

 

Now just take a moment to take the above into account, and then tell me that a man in Lee's position shouldn't know the answer to the question he was asked. 

 

If Lee genuinely doesn't know the answer, then me and you may as well turn up to Middlewood each morning instead.

 

It's absolutely mind boggling.

 

I can't believe that you don't think it's a complete shambles. 

I think it was fairly obvious what the situation was. Carlos did not like Winnall, and there was never a chance he'd be recalled. Why would Bullen ask that question when he already knew the answer was no?

 

No, Bullen was a coach. If he was the manager himself, or the DoF or CEO and he didn't know I'd be very worried yes, but as a coach he should have had no interest really in the contract situations at the club. Why would he?

[Robdylan]

7 minutes ago, qantas said:

 

Who's saying the club doesn't know?...of course they know, it'll be written in the contract, assuming they have a copy & know where it's filed.

 

I'm not surprised Bullen doesn't know, I'd be surprised if he did, why would he need to know all the details at the time the deal was done?...if he needs to know now then it's easily obtainable.

 

The mind boggles.

 

Why would he have needed to know?

 

How about the fact that he was Carlos's assistant, and along with Carlos, he trains them every day and has seen the loss of one of our best strikers through injury, as well as our slide down the league?

 

This is not a criticism of Carlos or Lee.

 

It's a criticism of how the club's been run.

 

Carlos should have been notified the minute the deal had gone through. Why? Because he was the bloody MANAGER! Both of them should have been informed, so they could weigh up our options.

 

Seriously, it beggars belief that you wouldn't have expected Lee to have known. 

 

If that's how the club has been run, it's no wonder we're in the poo. 

[Jennz]

9 minutes ago, Robdylan said:

 

The mind boggles.

 

Why would he have needed to know?

 

How about the fact that he was Carlos's assistant, and along with Carlos, he trains them every day and has seen the loss of one of our best strikers through injury, as well as our slide down the league?

 

This is not a criticism of Carlos or Lee.

 

It's a criticism of how the club's been run.

 

Carlos should have been notified the minute the deal had gone through. Why? Because he was the bloody MANAGER! Both of them should have been informed, so they could weigh up our options.

 

Seriously, it beggars belief that you wouldn't have expected Lee to have known. 

 

If that's how the club has been run, it's no wonder we're in the poo. 

 

So Carlos doesn't know now?...if that's true then yes I'd be surprised....Bullen not knowing all the details at the time is of no consequence, if he needs to know as caretaker then it's easily obtained.

 

Bullen was a coach, not a decision maker of that level, he didn't pick teams or choose tactics, what he's done since he has had those decisions to make makes it pretty clear CC did it only his way & Bullen towed the line.

 

To be honest mate I think you're making more of it than necessary.

[Robdylan]

2 minutes ago, Birley Owl 1867 said:

I think it was fairly obvious what the situation was. Carlos did not like Winnall, and there was never a chance he'd be recalled. Why would Bullen ask that question when he already knew the answer was no?

 

No, Bullen was a coach. If he was the manager himself, or the DoF or CEO and he didn't know I'd be very worried yes, but as a coach he should have had no interest really in the contract situations at the club. Why would he?

 

Bullen did not know the answer when he was asked.

 

Even if Carlos didn't like Winnall and he couldn't envisage him ever returning when the deal was initially made, he and the rest of his coaching staff should still have been made aware of any possible return. How can a manager not know his full list of available options?

 

What do you mean Bullen should have had no interest? Then what the hell are we paying him for?

 

Again, you ask: "Why would he?"

 

Again, why would he not?

 

We're not talking about the specifics, we're talking about whether or not he knew whether it was possible he could come back if needed. Yes, as a coach he shouldn't need to know the exact specifics. But he should definitely know whether or not he could return if we needed him. The specifics of the deal and the basic information are 2 very different things. Again, we've lost Fernando and have slid 6 points above the relegation zone. Yet you're telling me that a guy who's been paid to assist the manager of the club, and who now finds himself in temporary charge, shouldn't really know whether or not one of OUR OWN strikers could return from loan if required? 

 

Seriously mate, I cannot even believe we're having this debate. It's an utter shambles. 

[owlandished]

Did we send Winnall out on loan?

[Robdylan]

1 minute ago, qantas said:

 

So Carlos doesn't know now?...if that's true then yes I'd be surprised....Bullen not knowing all the details at the time is of no consequence, if he needs to know as caretaker then it's easily obtained.

 

Bullen was a coach, not a decision maker of that level, he didn't pick teams or choose tactics, what he's done since he has had those decisions to make makes it pretty clear CC did it only his way & Bullen towed the line.

 

To be honest mate I think you're making more of it than necessary.

 

What do you mean "all of the details?"

 

He didn't have to know all of the details. But as the manager's assistant, along with Carlos, he should immediately have been made aware of the basic options that we had for the remainder of the season. 

 

Come on now.

 

Lee's been paid to assist Carlos. He turns up to Middlewood 4 days a week, he sees the club in crisis and one of our best players sidelined for 3-4 months, he sees Rhodes struggling, yet he didn't know if we had the option of bringing Sam back if necessary? Ha! You couldn't make it up. 

 

I'm not making a mountain of a mole hill. 

 

It's an absolute JOKE that a man in his position didn't know whether or not it was an option.

 

If you can't see that, I despair.

 

It perfectly sums up the current mess that we've found ourselves in. 

 

 

 

 

[Jennz]

Just now, owlandished said:

Did we send Winnall out on loan?

 

2 minutes ago, Robdylan said:

 

What do you mean "all of the details?"

 

He didn't have to know all of the details. But as the manager's assistant, along with Carlos, he should immediately have been made aware of the basic options that we had for the remainder of the season. 

 

Come on now.

 

Lee's been paid to assist Carlos. He turns up to Middlewood 4 days a week, he sees the club in crisis and one of our best players sidelined for 3-4 months, he sees Rhodes struggling, yet he didn't know if we had the option of bringing Sam back if necessary? Ha! You couldn't make it up. 

 

I'm not making a mountain of a mole hill. 

 

It's an absolute JOKE that a man in his position didn't know whether or not it was an option.

 

If you can't see that, I despair.

 

It perfectly sums up the current mess that we've found ourselves in. 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you're over estimating Bullen's position at the time....he was an assistant coach, not a decision maker, in fact I doubt if he even wanted to know, if he did he would have asked, been told & would have known the answer to the question he's just been asked.

 

There's no need to despair over what you think I can or cannot see, it doesn't sum up anything as you imply, it just means you & I have different opinions over it.

[Robdylan]

8 minutes ago, qantas said:

 

 

I think you're over estimating Bullen's position at the time....he was an assistant coach, not a decision maker, in fact I doubt if he even wanted to know, if he did he would have asked, been told & would have known the answer to the question he's just been asked.

 

There's no need to despair over what you think I can or cannot see, it doesn't sum up anything as you imply, it just means you & I have different opinions over it.

 

Just try and envisage yourself in his position. As the assistant manager, it's only logical that he'd have wanted and needed to have known all available options. If he genuinely didn't want to know/wasn't bothered, then he shouldn't be anywhere near the club. Again, you simply cannot lose one of your best players for 4 months, see us struggle in 16th position, but not know whether it's even a possibility of bringing Sam back if necessary.

 

I could never justify him not knowing whilst Carlos was here, but to not know now whilst he's actually in charge, seeing us embarrassed by Burton?? 

 

It's absolutely unbelievable. 

 

We'll we'll leave it there.

 

Hopefully somebody can sort this mess out.

 

 

 

 

[Robdylan]

14 hours ago, darra said:

A week ago Bullen was a coach why would he know chapter and verse what the details of the loan are? Rightly so he has been getting on with how to manage the team. 

 

You should be asking yourself why he wouldn't have known. 

[Robdylan]

14 hours ago, neo hippy said:

 

This

 

No reason at all why bully would know any of the details of the deal. 

 

Someone at the club had best be looking at it though. 

 

No reason for the manager's assistant (who's now in charge) to know whether or not it's an option to bring back Sam if necessary?

 

Oh my.