Wholesale changes

[BRUCE LEE]

I take it you haven't taken the time to go and watch the reserves or academy play ever then?

He only started two games for the first team last season from memory- Ipswich away and Fulham at home in the cup, and played very well in both games- if JJ wasn't so flipping hopeless in front of goal, Boden would have had 2 assists from the left wing against premiership Fulham, 2 brilliant crosses both of which were on a plate for JJ and both of which were missed.

He's consistantly good in training, and if you think that he's not physical enough, then you obviously haven't seen him play for about 3 years- that used to be the case but he can well and truly look after himself now.

I've never seen him train, never seen anyone train TBH.... doesn't appeal... they are bad enough on Saturday.

The point was about his physical approach to the game.... not using his size to his advantage, not that he isn't big or fit enough.....he clearly is, that's what I found frustrating.

My judgement is based on ressy games, his left foot clearly works as I originally said, but the rest of his game just doesn't cut it for competitive football at Championship level.

Edited February 22, 2010 by BRUCE LEE

[Guest PNEFAN]

This is a debate we had on our Message board plenty of times throughout Irvines time at Deepdale. If his track record there is anything to go by, I wouldnt expect an injection of youth ever really.

He always seemed very untrusting of youth, and I think thats ones of the reasons he took the bullet (a club like us live off developing and selling talent at a premium to survive). There were occasions were we had empty spaces on the bench because he refused to include youth players (on senior pro contracts) in the matchday squad.

Even Nolan, who did an excellent job for us mostly, was only played as a last resort.

Of course, its easily arguable its the right decision he doesnt chuck youth in at the deep end anyway.

Edited February 22, 2010 by PNEFAN

[BRUCE LEE]

Well he gives two fooks about the club and is passionate which puts him in front of about 90% of the first team at the minute.

Gray's fooked on the left hand side of midfield, and i honestly don't see a better option there than Boden- the only other player is Esajas, and why the hell does he deserve a start after how poo he was on saturday?

Both you and myself give 2 fooks but I don't think that merits a place on the pitch, does it.

Although I will back track and say Boden couldn't do any worse than Esajas did Saturday.

[Beholder]

This is a debate we had on our Message board plenty of times throughout Irvines time at Deepdale. If his track record there is anything to go by, I wouldnt expect an injection of youth ever really.

He always seemed very untrusting of youth, and I think thats ones of the reasons he took the bullet (a club like us live off developing and selling talent at a premium to survive). There were occasions were we had empty spaces on the bench because he refused to include youth players (on senior pro contracts) in the matchday squad.

Even Nolan, who did an excellent job for us mostly, was only played as a last resort.

Of course, its easily arguable its the right decision he doesnt chuck youth in at the deep end anyway.

Cheers for the contribution.

I hope he changes his track record, because youth should be the lifeblood for teams like us.

Our academy has kept us afloat over the last few years. Especially with defensive players.

For me it's always one of the things that gives me most satisfaction: seeing our own academy players break into the first team.

[BRUCE LEE]

Cheers for the contribution.

I hope he changes his track record, because youth should be the lifeblood for teams like us.

Our academy has kept us afloat over the last few years. Especially with defensive players.

For me it's always one of the things that gives me most satisfaction: seeing our own academy players break into the first team.

Especially with McAllister.

He should be in the middle of the park, we don't have any other player that can match his energy and work rate.

[Beholder]

Especially with McAllister.

He should be in the middle of the park, we don't have any other player that can match his energy and work rate.

Too right.

Macca is a cracking little player. I miss him in the middle of the park....and the team does too.

[malek]

Both you and myself give 2 fooks but I don't think that merits a place on the pitch, does it.

Although I will back track and say Boden couldn't do any worse than Esajas did Saturday.

Well, thing with Boden is that at first site of him you can tell that he has built, skill and awareness to play at this level.

Those are basis that can hardly be coached, and the rest will hopefully come if he ever get run of games to settle in the first team, and with confidence after good performances.

Btw. Who told you he did bad while on loan at lower leagues ?

I took liberty to chat for a bit with Chesterfield, Rushden, and Northampton fans, and most of them looked favorably on job he did for their clubs. If anything they noticed he was bit behind with a tempo of the game, and it is easily understandable in case of a reserve player dropping to the L2/conference level.

[TheBoyBeevers]

Both you and myself give 2 fooks but I don't think that merits a place on the pitch, does it.

Although I will back track and say Boden couldn't do any worse than Esajas did Saturday.

I don't think Boden is the answer to all of our problems.

I just think that as Irvine is so keen to play more conservative players on the flanks in midfield, this leaves a straight choice between Boden and Gray on the left, because Esajas is an out and out winger which doesn't really go along with our tactical approach since Irvine came in.

Gray has been truly shocking recently, and if i'm honest looks like his age may have finally caught up with him- i don't see the harm in giving Boden a try, especially since as i say, he does very, very well in training regularly.... the old motto is sink or swim i believe.

[BRUCE LEE]

Who told you he did bad while on loan at lower leagues ?

I live in Chesterfield, surrounded by 'Spaaaariiiiiiite' fans... "cmon tarrrrrrrrn"...

my next door neighbour is a ST holder, he said Boden went missing in most games and was sent back early?

If he struggled to grasp the tempo in the conference with R+D, then he's worse than I thought.

[Guest PNEFAN]

Cheers for the contribution.

I hope he changes his track record, because youth should be the lifeblood for teams like us.

Our academy has kept us afloat over the last few years. Especially with defensive players.

For me it's always one of the things that gives me most satisfaction: seeing our own academy players break into the first team.

to be fair to Irvine, our youth system is pretty rubbish, and has only really produced 2 or 3 players of note in the past 15 years, and really, none of our current crop are currently good enough (but I still think as players on professional contracts, some should have been used on the bench when injuries hit a bit earlier in the season).

It was the way he handled Nolan that frustrated many of us, and has made me very surprised hes followed him. He did more then enough to justify his place in the side, but kept getting dropped and only used when others where injured, in fact he only ever played in his favoured CB position once. I think Irvine rates him, but never seemed to trust him. In fact when he was questioned over him at the AGM pre xmas, Irvine said Nolan would "cost us goals". it was a very odd situation.

Nolan is good though, not been at his best recently for us, but hes got a bright future ahead of him im sure. 2 good feet, comfortable on the ball, decent in the air and reads the game pretty well for a young lad. Bit of a lack of pace,but hes a good 'un I think. i hope he comes back.

[Wednesday-Wonderland]

If Nolan's as good as you say I hope we sign him. People have been saying his contract is up in the summer and I don't know why, wiki says "Nolan signed a permanent three-and-a-half-year contract on the 2 January 2009."

[malek]

I live in Chesterfield, surrounded by 'Spaaaariiiiiiite' fans... "cmon tarrrrrrrrn"...

my next door neighbour is a ST holder, he said Boden went missing in most games and was sent back early?

If he struggled to grasp the tempo in the conference with R+D, then he's worse than I thought.

Nor the first or the last who struggled at the pace of hoofball in those wild leagues...

[torryowl]

oliver and modest have scored less than a dozen goals this season for the academy side and dont think they have scored at all for the reserves so what makes people think they are our salvation .its fine saying give youth a chance but youth by its self is not enough they got to have some ability.its a massive step up from youth to senior level especially for strikers cant think of to many who have done it over the years possibly last one to come thru was john pearson and that was 20 years ago .

[Hack-Abusi]

Boden, Palmer, Soares (into centre mid), Macca, Miller, Nolan, Modest, wragg.

It's a big risk dropping the old pros, but when the old pro's are doing fookall, surely there must come a time when the younguns (miller aside) get a chance?

Who's ready for the 1st team and is it worth the risk?

I say yes. The current first team has hit a brick wall..We have kept a pretty similar team for ages now and it aint working.

i don't want to sound too harsh on you but that is utter lunacy

[NYCOWL]

Pitching kids into a relegation battle is the best way to destroy their futures.

[scram]

Pitching kids into a relegation battle is the best way to destroy their futures.

Whilst simultaneously getting relegated...

[killaowl]

So 15 points out of 9 games isn't working. I always thought that was playoff form.

3 points out of the last 12 or 6 points out of the last 18 is relegation form, we will go down if wholesale changes aren't made

we need pace up front so if modest is the fastest player at our club for flip sake play him, sorry but we should not have let sodje go

if he'd had as much time on the park as chips and gravy we would not be in this mess all he needed was match time.

[Guest totemowl]

3 points out of the last 12 or 6 points out of the last 18 is relegation form, we will go down if wholesale changes aren't made

we need pace up front so if modest is the fastest player at our club for flip sake play him, sorry but we should not have let sodje go

if he'd had as much time on the park as chips and gravy we would not be in this mess all he needed was match time.

You mean match time, skill and technique, surely.

[Beholder]

Pitching kids into a relegation battle is the best way to destroy their futures.

I don't think anyone is advocating replacing the first team with the youth team.

But in one or two areas, it could be argued that one of the younger back up players could do a better job than the player who is already there.

[Guest CampbellOwl-36]

I've had a flick through Saturdays programme on the academy section (page 51), looking down the scores it seems we have only won 2 or 3 games all season.

I don't watch the academy so my knowledge on it is pretty sparse but that doesn't quite fill me with a lot of confidence.