@owlstalk Posted March 25, 2021 Author Share Posted March 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, Bluewings said: Monk is the modern day Trevor Francis (worse football to watch tho omg) Replaced quality players over time with inferior ones. Hence it catapulted our demise. Why do our fans totally ignore the facts?? The bits about players not wanting to stay, about us having a 12 point deduction, about us needing to offload the expensive players as quickly as possible, and the bit about no decent player with any self respect wanting to come to a club that's known as having major problems that is in a relegation fight You know... The FACTS 1 Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobness Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 1 minute ago, @owlstalk said: Why do our fans totally ignore the facts?? The bits about players not wanting to stay, about us having a 12 point deduction, about us needing to offload the expensive players as quickly as possible, and the bit about no decent player with any self respect wanting to come to a club that's known as having major problems that is in a relegation fight You know... The FACTS Or that Monk wasn't given an option to sign quality players... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huncho Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 15 minutes ago, bobness said: While I do believe Monk contributed in some capacity, what you've written here is guff. There was no "pity" given based on our league position, and neither of us actually knows what went on. As a matter of fairness, the penalty could not be administered last season as there was insufficient time for a review, and such a review ultimately resulted with a 6 point deduction and not 12! Yes, it's possible the club would not have even saught an appeal had we been safe, but considering we're talking about a club which didn't even manage to sell a stadium in the correct year, and whose owner is stubborn, I wouldn't be surprised if Chansiri appealed it even if we were safe, on principle alone. You could make a MUCH better argument that the EFL are responsible, because had there been just a 6 point deduction to begin with, it could also have been applied last season without ill-effect. Meanwhile, Chansiri brought in a new manager and didn't ensure he had sufficient coaching support. That was criminal decision making from Chansiri. While Monk may have agreed to go along with the plan, Chansiri allowed for it. I think he was being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewings Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: Why do our fans totally ignore the facts?? The bits about players not wanting to stay, about us having a 12 point deduction, about us needing to offload the expensive players as quickly as possible, and the bit about no decent player with any self respect wanting to come to a club that's known as having major problems that is in a relegation fight You know... The FACTS Hey! I'm only going on the "fact" that stated Monk came out and said he signed the players he wanted. He has to take some blame in the personal he picked on the pitch. "needing to offload the expensive players as quickly" = budget changed, still plenty of quality cheaper players than a Scottish RB to play up top. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 15 minutes ago, bobness said: While I do believe Monk contributed in some capacity, what you've written here is guff. There was no "pity" given based on our league position, and neither of us actually knows what went on. As a matter of fairness, the penalty could not be administered last season as there was insufficient time for a review, and such a review ultimately resulted with a 6 point deduction and not 12! Yes, it's possible the club would not have even saught an appeal had we been safe, but considering we're talking about a club which didn't even manage to sell a stadium in the correct year, and whose owner is stubborn, I wouldn't be surprised if Chansiri appealed it even if we were safe, on principle alone. You could make a MUCH better argument that the EFL are responsible, because had there been just a 6 point deduction to begin with, it could also have been applied last season without ill-effect. Meanwhile, Chansiri brought in a new manager and didn't ensure he had sufficient coaching support. That was criminal decision making from Chansiri. While Monk may have agreed to go along with the plan, Chansiri allowed for it. the reason they gave was a deduction last season would have relegated the club without time to respond on the pitch - and with COVID complications. Had we enough points on the board, a line would have been drawn under it. Our pathetic form made a bad situation worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy W Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 3 hours ago, @owlstalk said: Man = "hey mate your house is on fire. Its burning down. You're gonna be left with no house if you don't do anything about it" Wednesday fan = "You're just trying to stir it and make a name for yourself" *wednesday fan stands and watches his house burn down to the ground* Great response...twaddle but great ish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobness Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, wilyfox said: the reason they gave was a deduction last season would have relegated the club without time to respond on the pitch - and with COVID complications. Had we enough points on the board, a line would have been drawn under it. Our pathetic form made a bad situation worse. There are many contributing factors, but to point the finger squarely at Monk isn't justified. That's all. Ultimately, the points deduction (both the reason for it and the number of points) has nothing to do with Monk. Considering we received just 6 points and not 12, and a 6 point deduction would've seen us safe last year, shouldn't you be blaming the EFL more than Monk? Edited March 25, 2021 by bobness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted March 25, 2021 Author Share Posted March 25, 2021 Wednesday fans - see a car that's got an engine that doesnt work properly, is faulty, and won't function correctly They know it full well But pop a new tyre on it and all of a sudden it's the tyres fault Take that tyre off, put a new tyre on and yep - it's the new tyres fault that the car isn't going anywhere Put some new windscreen wipers on it and it's the windscreen wipers fault that the car's not working Take those wipers off and put some new ones on - yep - it's the wipers fault the car's not going anywhere And all the while the same engine remains 1 Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcmigo Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, Bluewings said: Hey! I'm only going on the "fact" that stated Monk came out and said he signed the players he wanted. He has to take some blame in the personal he picked on the pitch. "needing to offload the expensive players as quickly" = budget changed, still plenty of quality cheaper players than a Scottish RB to play up top. I am sure Garry Monk spent his copious spare time scouting reserve football in Italy to identify the gem Da Cruz.. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted March 25, 2021 Author Share Posted March 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, wilyfox said: the reason they gave was a deduction last season would have relegated the club without time to respond on the pitch - and with COVID complications. Had we enough points on the board, a line would have been drawn under it. Our pathetic form made a bad situation worse. Imagine blaming Garry Monk for a points deduction tho FFS 1 Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 Just now, bobness said: There are many contributing factors, but point the finger squarely at Monk isn't justified. That's all. Ultimately, the points deduction, both the reason for it, and the number of points, has nothing to do with Monk. Considering we received just 6 points and not 12, and a 6 point deduction would've seen us safe last year, shouldn't you be blaming the EFL more than Monk? FFS! I have NOT blamed Monk for getting us the deduction. How many more times?! He is, however, at fault for it carrying over to this season. If you can’t see our form last year led to that, so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted March 25, 2021 Author Share Posted March 25, 2021 Just now, wilyfox said: FFS! I have NOT blamed Monk for getting us the deduction. How many more times?! He is, however, at fault for it carrying over to this season. No he isn't 1 Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobness Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 1 minute ago, wilyfox said: FFS! I have NOT blamed Monk for getting us the deduction. How many more times?! He is, however, at fault for it carrying over to this season. If you can’t see our form last year led to that, so be it. For the sake of argument, what makes you so certain that the only reason the penalty was carried over was because of our league position? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 Just now, bobness said: For the sake of argument, what makes you so certain that the only reason the penalty was carried over was because of our league position? It wasn’t the only reason. EFL were blamed by the panel for protracting the case. But having gone on for as long as it did, the panel said they could not fairly apply the deduction last season simply because it would effectively relegate us. We’re not to blame for EFL coćking up, but results on the pitch were our doing. Monk was a part of that no matter how hard you try to absolve him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Owl Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 5 hours ago, Anus said: Dong.... Also cheers Garry, thanks for making us feel loved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewings Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 15 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: Wednesday fans - see a car that's got an engine that doesnt work properly, is faulty, and won't function correctly They know it full well But pop a new tyre on it and all of a sudden it's the tyres fault Take that tyre off, put a new tyre on and yep - it's the new tyres fault that the car isn't going anywhere Put some new windscreen wipers on it and it's the windscreen wipers fault that the car's not working Take those wipers off and put some new ones on - yep - it's the wipers fault the car's not going anywhere And all the while the same engine remains Even if the car is broken tho Gary Monk was like the equivalent of getting a man with no arms to give it a push Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ante's Bubbly Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 5 hours ago, 83owl said: Monk was a terrible appointment who has dragged this club down. Thankfully since he left we have continued our previous upwards trajectory and have once again returned to being a well run stable and sustainable club. Yeah that's right! Good grief do people know facts from fiction anymore? Just because it was and maybe still is fashionable to have a go at Monk and blame him for everything that went off before and after he was here, there are more things, like facts, that suggest we would really have been better off keeping him this season and letting him have the players HE wanted, rather than messing around bringing more crocked players in and more managers/coaches that had less chance than him to put things right. I do not believe there is a manager or coach on the planet that could have done much better under the circumstances and judging by the way just about every available manager on the planet with any talent, has avoided us when the job has been available I feel sorry for the ones daft enough to accept the job. I felt sorry for Jos, I felt sorry for Monk and I feel sorry for Darren Moore, none of them deserve a club as rubbish a boss and a job remit as bad as our right now, although I am very happy that Darren Moore has come, I only hope that some of his common sense rubs off on DC. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted March 25, 2021 Author Share Posted March 25, 2021 Just now, Bluewings said: Even if the car is broken tho Gary Monk was like the equivalent of getting a man with no arms to give it a push The car's still bust Ps - ask yourself WHY we only got a man with no arms to push it That's where the real issues lie Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluewings Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: The car's still bust Ps - ask yourself WHY we only got a man with no arms to push it That's where the real issues lie I get your point it's still broke, and will be for the foreseeable....but at least with Darren Moore's HUGE arms.... you going to get some movement. None at all with Gary Monk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobness Posted March 25, 2021 Share Posted March 25, 2021 22 minutes ago, wilyfox said: Monk was a part of that no matter how hard you try to absolve him I think Monk made a lot of mistakes, but so did other managers, before and after. In the grand scheme of things though, Monk wasn't the problem. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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