Young team needs support right now

[hirstys_achilles]

4 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

No living in the past from me, I’ve seen what Wilder has done at United. Prior to them coming up, having not really seen that much of them, maybe I was a little dismissive of their chances of causing a stir in this league. Actually saw them give Malaga the run around out in Spain, with a brand of quick forward passing. They were mightily impressive, and I said on here at the time, don’t underestimate them. Wilder has done a fantastic job, with a mixed bag of players.

Thats my point though, the turnaround in their fortunes has been down to Wilder’s tactics, and getting his players to buy into what he wants them to do. Has Jos done that for us? Has he established a pattern of play, which all the players have bought into? Contrary to what some believe, I don’t believe we are a better side than United, as you say, the league table doesn’t back that up. What I do think though, is that we have better individuals than United, but they are hamstrung by the negative tactics the coach employs. Statistics show that we are the worst side when it comes to creating penalty box chances. How can that be the case, when we can call on the likes of Onomah, Bannan, Matias, Reach and Forestieri in the creative department? Don’t get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with the possession game, but it has to have an end product. United also play a passing game, but they are encouraged to always maintain forward momentum. Last night, QPR had considerably less possession, but they were always looking to play it forward into areas that could hurt us. We just go sideways and backwards

Fair point and actually nice to read some sense. Perhaps we do have some players who are better than united players. But its irrelevant as results are what matters so i agree with you on those issues. I not sure that we are hamstrung by negative tactics. I sure that when we have the ability to play a team Jos is trying to build the tactics will change accordingly. QPR is prime example of any formation or tactic would not have changed the end result as individual performances were so poor. As a manager seeing those performances would not fill you with confidence to start next game with any disregard to defending when none of our defensive players are playing well. Once again he has very limited options. Its easy for us to say we need to press more higher up the pitch and try to be more clinical at set pieces. I sure Jos would love to do this. But currently doing this run the risk of getting a real thrashing. If players form was better then set pieces would work better, we have had some bad luck to from corners etc which is par for the course when form has dipped.

[hirstys_achilles]

16 minutes ago, room0035 said:

 

A well run club is not us, we have someone in charge who in 4 years is still making the same mistake and if you truly believe everything that has gone wrong with the club is down to Carlos then I am happy only you live in that world.

 

Did Carlos hold a gun to DC head and tell him which players to hire - when DC himself said in previous interviews he used advisers on everything (Doyes) and only when he was covering his arse recently did he blame it all on the manager. I don't know of many manager in football currently that sit down with players agree fees, contracts and the length of contracts i thought that was the job of the director of football or if you don't have one the PERSON IN CHARGE OF THE CLUB, I stand corrected I didn't know Carlos did all this and DC is an innocent party in everything that has happen.

 

As for the Exec boxes at £48,000 compare to the boxes at the lane for £19,000 you don't have to be completely stupid to guess, which ground a company not a fan a company is going to use for corporate entertaining. You cannot sell something for twice the price and expect people to pay it because your a football team.

Same Mistakes ?????? really ???????? The recent activity at swfc is a mile away from 4 years ago. I never said everything wrong is CC fault. CC asked DC to sign certain players. A deal is negotiated with regards to how important the manager states the player will be to the team. With hindsight it obvious DC made some mistakes. Hindsight is the key. What DC did was what he thought best using advisors to achieve CC promise of promotion. If a manager spends the money CC did and to have only the crop of players we have is down to CC. Lane exec boxes are the cheapest in league. Yes swfc are expensive but the football promised by CC would have sold them at that price if he delivered, and he did not.

[Ante's Bubbly]

26 minutes ago, hirstys_achilles said:

The prices are relative to the money dc spends. We still in ffp doodoo with current prices. Every bloody signing is for the fans. DC did what CC recommended. The agents tempt CC with players. Who are you to say what CC saw or didn't. If CC didnt spend all the money on poor over age injury prone players DC would not have increased prices. As for the exec boxes etc they should pay more for the experience. DC included other things in the package to balance the increase. If CC had delivered on his promise to us and DC all the exec boxes would be fully booked in advance. Slating DC for putting the money where his mouth is and doing what you are moaning about (putting hand in pocket) is no reason to slate him. He should be thanked by fans for spending all that money (his money) on getting us out of debt and trying to get us promoted. DC has spent as much as ffp will allow. He not skint, he would if allowed be willing to spend the same amount again to get us up. DC has admitted to mistakes. He acknowledges not everyone will agree with his decisions. Its is totally correct to say CC could not with all the money he given achieve what he promised. How can anyone argue that CC is not to blame ????? 

 

Sorry ha, but I am getting a bit sick and fed up of reading people expressing a strong opinion on this subject as though it is a fact, when we were actually told, by CC and by DC that Chansiri and his buddies, or Chansiri and his advisors, were the ones who bought the players and that CC only got the final say. CC actually told us how that "final say" worked regarding the phone call he got from DC on the last day of his last transfer window when we were short of fit players and Chansiri offered him two players. CC said get them both, because he was desperate for players, not because he had gone out and found the two players who in his eyes were the best two players for the club!

 

Wake up and smell the coffee mate, our football club is being run by a very wealthy tinkering clown, who likes the idea of owning a piece of English footballing heritage and in one very lucky season, in succeeding to bring the club along with it's free spending pool of dopey supporters into an arena where he can show off his prize, before he leaves it and us in his will to his son or sells us to the next super wealthy foreign investor that wants a very expensive toy to play with. The sooner he discovers a Thai language version of football  manager 2018, the better!

 

Unless the supporters can get at least a small say in what happens with their clubs, we will see more and more of these people taking over our footballing heritage until the English game eventually disappears up it's own Platinum lined bottom. 

 

Oh and before anybody starts spouting on about the wonderful forums where our honourable owner allows us to air our frustrations after listening to his violin accompanied monologue about how he has turned our club into a family club for the fans blah, blah, blah

 

He only does that because he has to...from the "Supporters Direct Engage", document...

 

Do clubs have to do it? In October 2014, the Government launched an Expert Working Group (EWG) on issues relating to supporter ownership and engagement that included representatives of the National League (NL), English Football League (EFL), the Premier League (EPL), Football Association (FA) and supporter organisations. The Government were represented by the Department of Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) with other Government departments attending wherever relevant.

 

In terms of supporter engagement, the Government sought to put into practice a commitment made in 2012 by the Football Authorities in response to the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee Inquiry into Football Governance that read: “Clubs will be required under league regulation to set out in a structured format the ways in which they will consult and engage with different supporter interests and groups.”

 

Following a year of deliberations, the EWG put forward a series of recommendations. that were endorsed by the EFL Board and those of the FA, EPL and NL.

 

As part of the ensuing EFL regulations, clubs shall hold at least two meetings/fans forums per season to which its supporters (preferably a supporters trust where there is one) are to be invited in order to discuss significant issues relating to the club. The framework for these meetings shall be documented in the club’s customer charter, but are subject to the following minimum criteria:

 

    Under the regulations, clubs must be represented by owners, directors or senior executive management as the matters being discussed will often be of a strategic      nature and may relate to the management and dayto-day running of the club. Where meetings are not open to all supporters wishing to attend, the supporter                representatives must be elected, selected or invited in line with basic democratic principles; and individuals cannot be excluded by the club without good reason

    (the club acting reasonably).

 

The provision for elected representatives is intended to ensure that those in attendance have a mandate to represent the club’s supporters and will ensure that no-one accuses the process of being a ‘sham’. For example, the club might organise a ballot or ask its supporter organisations to do so. Alternatively, it could invite the elected leaders of those groups given they have already been given a mandate to represent supporters. Generally speaking, the best approach will be for clubs to consider the matter in consultation with their supporter groups and identify an agreed approach.

 

 

[hirstys_achilles]

5 minutes ago, Ante's Bubbly said:

 

Sorry ha, but I am getting a bit sick and fed up of reading people expressing a strong opinion on this subject as though it is a fact, when we were actually told, by CC and by DC that Chansiri and his buddies, or Chansiri and his advisors, were the ones who bought the players and that CC only got the final say. CC actually told us how that "final say" worked regarding the phone call he got from DC on the last day of his last transfer window when we were short of fit players and Chansiri offered him two players. CC said get them both, because he was desperate for players, not because he had gone out and found the two players who in his eyes were the best two players for the club!

 

Wake up and smell the coffee mate, our football club is being run by a very wealthy tinkering clown, who likes the idea of owning a piece of English footballing heritage and in one very lucky season, in succeeding to bring the club along with it's free spending pool of dopey supporters into an arena where he can show off his prize, before he leaves it and us in his will to his son or sells us to the next super wealthy foreign investor that wants a very expensive toy to play with. The sooner he discovers a Thai language version of football  manager 2018, the better!

 

Unless the supporters can get at least a small say in what happens with their clubs, we will see more and more of these people taking over our footballing heritage until the English game eventually disappears up it's own Platinum lined bottom. 

 

Oh and before anybody starts spouting on about the wonderful forums where our honourable owner allows us to air our frustrations after listening to his violin accompanied monologue about how he has turned our club into a family club for the fans blah, blah, blah

 

He only does that because he has to...from the "Supporters Direct Engage", document...

 

Do clubs have to do it? In October 2014, the Government launched an Expert Working Group (EWG) on issues relating to supporter ownership and engagement that included representatives of the National League (NL), English Football League (EFL), the Premier League (EPL), Football Association (FA) and supporter organisations. The Government were represented by the Department of Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) with other Government departments attending wherever relevant.

 

In terms of supporter engagement, the Government sought to put into practice a commitment made in 2012 by the Football Authorities in response to the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee Inquiry into Football Governance that read: “Clubs will be required under league regulation to set out in a structured format the ways in which they will consult and engage with different supporter interests and groups.”

 

Following a year of deliberations, the EWG put forward a series of recommendations. that were endorsed by the EFL Board and those of the FA, EPL and NL.

 

As part of the ensuing EFL regulations, clubs shall hold at least two meetings/fans forums per season to which its supporters (preferably a supporters trust where there is one) are to be invited in order to discuss significant issues relating to the club. The framework for these meetings shall be documented in the club’s customer charter, but are subject to the following minimum criteria:

 

    Under the regulations, clubs must be represented by owners, directors or senior executive management as the matters being discussed will often be of a strategic      nature and may relate to the management and dayto-day running of the club. Where meetings are not open to all supporters wishing to attend, the supporter                representatives must be elected, selected or invited in line with basic democratic principles; and individuals cannot be excluded by the club without good reason

    (the club acting reasonably).

 

The provision for elected representatives is intended to ensure that those in attendance have a mandate to represent the club’s supporters and will ensure that no-one accuses the process of being a ‘sham’. For example, the club might organise a ballot or ask its supporter organisations to do so. Alternatively, it could invite the elected leaders of those groups given they have already been given a mandate to represent supporters. Generally speaking, the best approach will be for clubs to consider the matter in consultation with their supporter groups and identify an agreed approach.

 

 

I only as certain as you are. Getting fed up as you state is only because you have a tainted view of DC perhaps for other than swfc reasons. DC can obviously do nothing right in your opinion. Its sad you feel this way and i genuinely feel sorry for you that even a balanced view wont help sooth your fed up persona. The coffee smells great as i know miracles dont happen and placing faith in anyone is a gamble. For DC it did not work with CC. What difference a Thai version of fifa will help do is beyond me (I am sure his english is better than your Thai and games are available in most languages anyway) Is that comment in more line with your dislike for DC ?? Lets face it you would have done a much better job as chairman and swfc fans all over the world hope and pray that one day you will chair the club to the success you can undoubtedly bring to the club. NOT !

[room0035]

7 minutes ago, hirstys_achilles said:

Same Mistakes ?????? really ???????? The recent activity at swfc is a mile away from 4 years ago. I never said everything wrong is CC fault. CC asked DC to sign certain players. A deal is negotiated with regards to how important the manager states the player will be to the team. With hindsight it obvious DC made some mistakes. Hindsight is the key. What DC did was what he thought best using advisors to achieve CC promise of promotion. If a manager spends the money CC did and to have only the crop of players we have is down to CC. Lane exec boxes are the cheapest in league. Yes swfc are expensive but the football promised by CC would have sold them at that price if he delivered, and he did not.

We will agree to disagree on this one, yes CC made mistakes but DC has made so many and as I said is still making them.

 

Last season we produce the best young player we have had for a decade and completely clusterfucked it up and he has left for peanuts what have we learnt from this - you guessed it absolutely jack we have another great young player who is out of contract is 8 months and what have we done to prevent another George Hirst fiasco current not a great deal.

 

We are in a financial mess and what is the club doing to get out of it, sell a few of the assets, get some of the high earners out of the club or loan them out to help reduce the over heads no what we are doing is waiting for the summer when we are placed in a transfer embargo once again for breaking the FFP rules and will have spunked another £10-15m on players who never play or are not for whatever reason allowed to play or. Or the master plan from DC at the start of the season our plan is promotion which will sort all the issues.

 

The saying is actions speak loader than word - DC talks a good game but when you look at his record, he is about as poor as any chairman we have ever had at this football club, yes he is covering the losses that he in his part course from his complete lack of having a clue what he was and is doing. But these losses are recorded as directors loan because when he comes to sell the club he will be repaid all the money he has put in. The only way this does not happen is if the club goes into administration, something I hope does not happen.

 

The next few months will tell us all we need to know about his capability of running a football club if we get to 1st February 2019 with the same squad of players and no young or squad players signed up to longer deals simple what I have said will be proved to be correct. If though we look to move on the none playing squad players, sign up the young talent to longer deals or even cash in on an asset such as Fessi, Reach, Bannan or maybe one of the improving kids then I will eat my words. Though based on DC past actions I won't hold my breath.

[Ante's Bubbly]

1 minute ago, hirstys_achilles said:

I only as certain as you are. Getting fed up as you state is only because you have a tainted view of DC perhaps for other than swfc reasons. DC can obviously do nothing right in your opinion. Its sad you feel this way and i genuinely feel sorry for you that even a balanced view wont help sooth your fed up persona. The coffee smells great as i know miracles dont happen and placing faith in anyone is a gamble. For DC it did not work with CC. What difference a Thai version of fifa will help do is beyond me (I am sure his english is better than your Thai and games are available in most languages anyway) Is that comment in more line with your dislike for DC ?? Lets face it you would have done a much better job as chairman and swfc fans all over the world hope and pray that one day you will chair the club to the success you can undoubtedly bring to the club. NOT !

Did you write that from school? 

[hirstys_achilles]

5 minutes ago, Ante's Bubbly said:

Did you write that from school? 

is it the spelling or grammar or both. Hilarious. I cant stop laughing. Should it be "at" school ??

Edited October 24, 2018 by hirstys_achilles
addition

[room0035]

1 minute ago, Ante's Bubbly said:

Did you write that from school? 

Either Hirsty's achilles is at school or he works for the club as You cannot be classed as a competent owner then make the mistake after mistake DC has made.

 

If you want an example look at last season our 150th year is existence.

 

How did we honour this occasion we launch a special kit that looked like the Ipswich kit but as a special treat this kit was only available to buy 3 months into the season,  we sign no players except the £4m we spent on a centre back we had never heard off when there were English options at half the prices who actually would have played games, we could not arrange any friendly games with a big team to celebrate because no one thought to plan ahead but Sheffield FC managed to play Barcelona a few years ago for their anniversary, and Sheff Utd this season arrange a friendly with Inter Milan this year,  but due to Rangers getting knocked out of Europe we were able to arrange a friendly with them.

 

We then had a succession of over priced gimmicks that no one wanted to buy and a big cake at party in the park an event that is always held in July but last year was delay because we had not signed any players or any shirts to sell because it was our 150th year.

 

We had an anniversary dinner with tickets priced at you guess it £150 for an event that was hosted by some bald bloke from the Football focus show that got canned for being crap.

 

What other things were done to mark this occasion a charity match, a seniors match, some sort of get together of old players from times when we won stuff no nothing else was planned because marketing went on holiday in January for the rest of the season after coming up with their pier resistance an idea where you can loan £1.867 to the club which you will get back in a three year season ticket if we get promoted - surprisingly there were fewer than 50 people who took the club up on the fantastic idea. 

 

[Ante's Bubbly]

5 minutes ago, hirstys_achilles said:

is it the spelling or grammar or both. Hilarious. I cant stop laughing. Should it be "at" school ??

 

Sent from my home PC, but the first excerpt is from the Star originally and the second from the horses mouth (and no I have nothing against him personally, am not calling him a horse and only dislike the way he runs our club so badly).

Carlos Carvalhal is the new head coach of Sheffield Wednesday. He replaces Stuart Gray, who was controversially sacked early last month after guiding the Owls to a comfortable 13th-placed finish last season.

A statement on the club’s website added: “The Portuguese is joined by backroom team and compatriots João Mário, João Cunha and Bruno Lage.”

The appointment of Carvalhal had been expected for more than a week, though reports also linked the club with a move for Swindon’s manager, Mark Cooper.

Carvalhal, who has spent the bulk of his managerial career in his homeland, had a spell in charge of Sporting Lisbon and also spent a season with the Turkish club Besiktas. Wednesday’s chairman, Dejphon Chansiri, is backing Carvalhal’s pedigree to get the club back into the Premier League.

“I firmly believe that this appointment will take our team and our club to the next level and towards where we all want to be, the Premier League,” he said. “It is important for our supporters that they watch their team play attractive, aggressive and entertaining football.

“Carlos buys in completely to this philosophy and I am confident that his experience, knowledge and ability will herald the start of a successful new era for Sheffield Wednesday.”

The club have undergone a complete change in management structure this summer, with the introduction of a Sporting Director Committee to oversee affairs at Hillsborough.

That committee includes the former West Ham and Newcastle manager Glenn Roeder, scout Paul Senior and former Fulham coach Jonathan Hill.

 

 

Dejphon Chansiri:

 

"We have an extensive scouting network that spans the world of football and advisors that make up our transfer committee (Sporting Director Committee), which has evolved over the last two years as I said it would.
During my first year, the committee was in-house, together with external advisors, but this system did not have the desired effect.

"Doyen Sports are amongst my advisors but we have others, who form part of a process of player recruitment that mirrors that of many clubs worldwide.
I must stress that Doyen have absolutely no influence on the day to day running of Sheffield Wednesday, nor do any of my advisors.

[jonnyowl]

The frustrating thing for me is,

 

We are average at best. We can't defend, sometimes we don't ever look like scoring.

 

We are 2 points off the playoffs.

 

If Jos could turn us into a side above average, which I think we easily have the players for, we'd have a decent chance at the playoffs.

 

An average team will make the playoffs this season, why can't it be us?

Edited October 24, 2018 by jonnyowl

[shezzas left peg]

3 hours ago, gurujuan said:

No living in the past from me, I’ve seen what Wilder has done at United. Prior to them coming up, having not really seen that much of them, maybe I was a little dismissive of their chances of causing a stir in this league. Actually saw them give Malaga the run around out in Spain, with a brand of quick forward passing. They were mightily impressive, and I said on here at the time, don’t underestimate them. Wilder has done a fantastic job, with a mixed bag of players.

Thats my point though, the turnaround in their fortunes has been down to Wilder’s tactics, and getting his players to buy into what he wants them to do. Has Jos done that for us? Has he established a pattern of play, which all the players have bought into? Contrary to what some believe, I don’t believe we are a better side than United, as you say, the league table doesn’t back that up. What I do think though, is that we have better individuals than United, but they are hamstrung by the negative tactics the coach employs. Statistics show that we are the worst side when it comes to creating penalty box chances. How can that be the case, when we can call on the likes of Onomah, Bannan, Matias, Reach and Forestieri in the creative department? Don’t get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with the possession game, but it has to have an end product. United also play a passing game, but they are encouraged to always maintain forward momentum. Last night, QPR had considerably less possession, but they were always looking to play it forward into areas that could hurt us. We just go sideways and backwards

I think as far as the footballing quality and technical ability, we're a better side overall. 

Its the mental side of their game, strong willed, aggressive, in your face and bite,

that surpasses us and makes them a better TEAM! On the whole 

Under Carlos sums us up and is one of the reasons we're in this mess.!!

 

Sheffield wednesday - a NICE northern club. 

With a NICE honourable chap as owner, ,goes on about one big family. 

With NICE on the whole fans, few idiots, but generally good natured. 

With a NICE likeable manager,who's charming and says the right things (Carlos). 

With NICE neat tidy footballers... 

This was the problem for 3 years, we've just been too damn NICE!! for our own good, DC, was too nice and nieve and allowed advisors and hangers on have our pants down with transfers and contracts. 

Carlos signed nice, neat, tidy, very sporting footballers who weren't combative, outspoken or Fiery. 

 

Even when we the fans could see it all falling apart like a house of cards, we were too nice and still loved Carlos, wouldn't protest or openly complain (apart from on here). 

 

Thus were still left with a nieve chairman, who thinks he can just bumble along without the fans getting all upset and out on the pitch a leaderless bunch of nice guys who are good footballers, but don't have the mentality, drive or aggression to really dig in and get the job done when needed. This also means a really hard job for jos and it does make you think he's looked at the squad and thought "oh dear lord what do I do with this lot" so has turned to the kids to look for some aggression power, pace and above all passion to get stuck in and play. 

[Mr. Tom]

[deleted, replied to wrong post]

 

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Mr. Tom

[Mr. Tom]

23 hours ago, Eastern said:

I can see what his plan is. Young players, young squad future.

 

but are fans willing to wait 3-4 seasons for frutiation?

 

They have to. It’s the sweet agony of being a supporter - there’s naff-all else you can do, bar flounce off for a bit.

 

Some on here need to remember that.

 

That’s what keeps us coming back like spanked dogs. If we could somehow control or influence it, it would technically count as a fetish, and we’d all have to turn up in gimp suits.

 

What will be will be, next few seasons. And indeed all of them.

 

So c’mon, throw another couple of weights on the clamp, Wednesday - I’m ready. I deserve it. You evil sod, you. I hate you! I love you. Ugh.

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Mr. Tom

[vulva]

Anyone thinking at present we are a better side than United is absolutely puddled.