dorian gray Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Well he said again today he has to get rid before he can bring in.. Surely there has to come a point where he will have to move out some of the crap that has already been brought in? Surely he can't expect just to be able to move out players from last season? he daren't, firstly getting rid of last seasons side is easier... some in the third division will want players who won out in a promotion battle last season... and who the f**k would want to take the shyte he fetched in the closed season?... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 He did a good job on paper bringing those players in. It just hasn't worked for reasons that no one is entirely clear. They just haven't gelled / performed, with a couple of exceptions. So I agree that people criticising recruitment are off the mark somewhat. The question now is whether DJ can turn it around. If people think he can, then how is he going to go about that? i'm entirely clear... A HELL OF A LOT OF WHAT HE FETCHED IN ISN'T GOOD ENOUGH FOR THIS DIVISION... and it's got sod all to do with gelling... tommy doc said the the then pig manager ken furphy, "if you buy enough 3rd. division players, you'll end up in the 3rd. division"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s.kirkbyowl Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 The question is - is DJ player analysis, selection and recruitment poor or is this what you get when your budget is low compared to others in this league or is it both ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Both probably Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 The question is - is DJ player analysis, selection and recruitment poor or is this what you get when your budget is low compared to others in this league or is it both ? i don't think it's either. our budget can't be that poor because we've lured the likes of Kirkland, Gardner, and Bothroyd on loan. as for the recruitment, wholesale changes were made to our squad; to expect them to bed in within 3months or so was a big ask. i'd judge DJ's recruitment over the 2nd half of the season - not the 1st. in reality, that's how long it'll take for some of our newbies to start delivering due to age, inexperience & upheaval. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChapSmurf Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Decent post, though I think the expectation of a top ten finish was a tad optimistic Yeah, you are right. It was more wishful thinking to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wilf Marshall Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Yes they appear not good enough now but I hardly think that was easy to predict. On paper look at the signings, they were quality. On paper, before hindsight. That is the point here. A lot of us would have signed those players. Kirkland, Gardener and Taylor for a total of 50k... That looked like he had signed proper proven quality to keep us tight at the back. You could also argue quite easily that Lee and Mattock were quality that other clubs rated. Lee was Oldham player of the season for a few years. McCabe, Barkley, Antonio, Mayor... All highly rated young players. Bothroyd, Maguire... Proven ability at this level. Pecnic... 20 or so caps for a team from Europe that went to the world cup. Rodri... Barce B. Nuff said. So don't tell me that it was obvious before a ball was kicked that these were atrocious signings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob C Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 To put DJ's 'poo ' signings into perspective, we spent less this summer on all our signings bar Antonio (Gardner, Kirkland, Lee, Mattock, Pecnik, Mccabe, Corry, Maguire, Mayor) than Laws did on Leon Clarke and Etienne Esajas combined, or on Franny rumbleing Jeffers (on his own!) And compare the free transfers, would you take Gardner, Kirkland, Lee and Mattock, or 'cream of the crop' Tommy Miller and Darren Purse? DJ has been given a similar amount of money to our previous managers. And his signings are so much better than the crap we have been served in the past. Kenny Lunt, Adam Proudlock, Ronnie Wallwork, Chris Marsden, Graham Kavanagh. flipping Kim Olsen and Ola Tidman........ I could go on. Do Wednesday fans really have such short rumbleing memories? Do you not remember the poo we have been through? Are you all really this fickle? DJ is the hero who took us to promotion last season. Have some rumbleing gratitude. Have some rumbleing respect. The man deserves better than this. Ok we know you can swear , well lets be honest Jones signings are absolute F*CKIN BOLLOXXXX, AND HE SHOULD BE SACKED, F*CK RESPECT, HE'D BE OFF LIKE A SHOT IF A BETTER OFFER CAME IN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scram Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 (edited) I wish the DJ huggers would simply put themselves in MM's shoes for a minute. You've witnessed your manager sign 15 players in the close season and we are looking increasingly like relegation fodder and many of these signings are nowhere near the 1st team. Then he comes to you in January for another wedge of cash to buy some MORE players. Honestly, what would YOU say? Ok....i'll put myself in MM's shoes for a minute I have a manager who in his last stint in this division massively overachieved at a dying club. He bought low, sold high, raised over £20m in net transfer ins/outs and consistently kept his cllub in/around the play off positions, play off final and FA Cup Final. Since then he has taken my club on an amazing run of results to achieve promotion from a very uunlikely position. I think i'll stick with his proven quality through this adjustment period thanks Edited November 18, 2012 by scram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Since then he has taken my club on an amazing run of results to achieve promotion from a very uunlikely position. Fancy taking a team from 3rd at the end of February and getting them promoted...has this ever been achieved before? It was a fantasic run but come we weren't in 12th place or the like when he took over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJMortimer Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Fancy taking a team from 3rd at the end of February and getting them promoted...has this ever been achieved before? It was a fantasic run but come we weren't in 12th place or the like when he took over. That's a wilfull misrepresentation of the truth. What was it? 32 points from a maximum available of 36? And for all but the last one we were chasing the pigs with all the pressure that brought. If that doesn't meet your definition of 'amazing' then it's no wonder you think the manager is failing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest totemowl Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Fancy taking a team from 3rd at the end of February and getting them promoted...has this ever been achieved before? It was a fantasic run but come we weren't in 12th place or the like when he took over. Sounds easy dunt it. But you omitted the more pertinent facts. Wasn't it the case that on feb 20th we'd played 2 games more and were 8 points behind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 That's a wilfull misrepresentation of the truth. What was it? 32 points from a maximum available of 36? And for all but the last one we were chasing the pigs with all the pressure that brought. If that doesn't meet your definition of 'amazing' then it's no wonder you think the manager is failing. No it isn''t..its a statement of fact. Read it again...I said it was a fantastic run...but to describe promotion from 3rd as "unlikely" is nonsense. I think the managers failing because we are not winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scram Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Fancy taking a team from 3rd at the end of February and getting them promoted...has this ever been achieved before? It was a fantasic run but come we weren't in 12th place or the like when he took over. A graphic illustration of how some people seek to denigrate and misrepresent DJ and his achievements Yes, we were 3rd That's the entire story right there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 (edited) A graphic illustration of how some people seek to denigrate and misrepresent DJ and his achievements Yes, we were 3rd That's the entire story right there Is reading so difficult? I will repeat again it was a fantastic run...but promotion in may fron 3rd place in february is not unlikely or unheard of. Edited November 18, 2012 by kobayashi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest totemowl Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Is reading so difficult? I will repeat agian It was a fantastic run...but promotion in may fron 3rd place in february is not unlikely or unheard of. Stop acting thick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scram Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Is reading so difficult? I will repeat again it was a fantastic run...but promotion in may fron 3rd place in february is not unlikely or unheard of. The stat/fact you choose to concentrate on tells little of the reality of the situation - it reinforces my point. 3rd place means nothing without context - which is why i suspect you keep mentioning it - a team can be 5th but a point away from 2nd - they can be second and 15 points behind 1st - just meaningless rank order data without context It was an unlikely run - simply because that type of run of results has rarely been achieved at the club in my years of supporting - so far from a regular occurence therefore uncommon and unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lawrie Maddens Hump Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Jones will be given time. Threads like this are a waste a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobayashi Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 The stat/fact you choose to concentrate on tells little of the reality of the situation - it reinforces my point. 3rd place means nothing without context - which is why i suspect you keep mentioning it - a team can be 5th but a point away from 2nd - they can be second and 15 points behind 1st - just meaningless rank order data without context It was an unlikely run - simply because that type of run of results has rarely been achieved at the club in my years of supporting - so far from a regular occurence therefore uncommon and unlikely. The context is that we were 3rd and went on a fantastic run and won promotion.This pattern is repeated by teams in pretty much every season in every league so it is not that unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scram Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 The context is that we were 3rd and went on a fantastic run and won promotion.This pattern is repeated by teams in pretty much every season in every league so it is not that unlikely. Although you have proven this is a complete waste of time (and that you don't understand what context means).....would you like to point put how many teams a season will take 32 points from 36 - then work out the ratio of how many don't - then come back and say it's not an unlikely occurence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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