Isaac Holland

[TheGreatNebber]

On 11/08/2022 at 06:36, Owl999 said:

No he’s from Loxley, Wednesday through and through like  the rest of his family,  he’s a great lad from a lovely family I happen to know,  fantastic opportunity and I wish him all the best in his career 

I don't necessarily blame him and his family for making a decision which may work out for the best in terms of career and finance but I don't think he can describe himself as Wednesday through and through any more. 

 

 

[royalowlisback]

2 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't necessarily blame him and his family for making a decision which may work out for the best in terms of career and finance but I don't think he can describe himself as Wednesday through and through any more. 

 

 

Of course he can.

 

Football is a job - you can still support another team you don't play for.

[SiJ]

22 hours ago, malek said:

 

 

Lets learn on mistakes and not let this happen ever again.

 

 

You see, in this instance, I'm not sure what Wednesday can do. 

 

The system is skewed massively in favour of a club like Brentford who as a PL team can cherry pick the best players from lower down the leagues. 

 

From my understanding, these two lads had just reached the age where we could offer them scholar deals? They were both keen to sign, but then Brentford swooped in and that was that. 

 

There is no denying that Wednesday's youth development has been pretty subpar for years, but then we seem to be operating in a system which almost wants that to be the case. 

 

On the upside, Cadamateri has signed on for a year or two. 

[Jim]

7 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't necessarily blame him and his family for making a decision which may work out for the best in terms of career and finance but I don't think he can describe himself as Wednesday through and through any more. 

 

 

That’s harsh, it really is. We can’t be holier than thou until we really start to shown signs of giving academy lads a real shot at first team football here. We only give lads a chance when we’re short staffed and when we’re not it’s no more than a token gesture. This has to change to give us any chance whatsoever at keeping lads like the two that have gone to Brentford.

[Guest 1966]

20 hours ago, leftpeg said:

 

Brentford are a club known for developing players and selling them on to bigger clubs for a tidy profit.

 

Where as we sign 30 year old crocks and bench most decent youngsters.

Wednesday should Forget signing players let’s sign up Brentford recruitment team if we had done that 5 yeas ago we’d be in premier 

[Roy Of The Roasters]

10 minutes ago, SiJ said:

 

From my understanding, these two lads had just reached the age where we could offer them scholar deals? They were both keen to sign, but then Brentford swooped in and that was that. 

 

There is no denying that Wednesday's youth development has been pretty subpar for years, but then we seem to be operating in a system which almost wants that to be the case. 

 

 

Looking at it another way, if the academy is now producing players that are sufficiently good for PL teams to be paying attention, that can't be a bad thing. 

[TheGreatNebber]

16 minutes ago, royalowlisback said:

Of course he can.

 

Football is a job - you can still support another team you don't play for.

Being Wednesday 'through and through' isn't the same as supporting the team. I'm not saying he's not still a supporter but he's made a decision which adversely affects the club and benefits another. 

[SLJ]

20 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't necessarily blame him and his family for making a decision which may work out for the best in terms of career and finance but I don't think he can describe himself as Wednesday through and through any more. 

 

 

The sooner we all accept club loyalty and personal ambition are not the same thing, the sooner we’ll all feel a little better in life. Look at it another way, 10 years from now and we’re playing the Brentford with a Brentford fan in the ranks; Do you accept the player mentioning it in an interview? How about we go whole hog and let them celebrate together at the end. 
Time to grow up when it comes to this stuff. 

[TheGreatNebber]

12 minutes ago, Jim said:

That’s harsh, it really is. We can’t be holier than thou until we really start to shown signs of giving academy lads a real shot at first team football here. We only give lads a chance when we’re short staffed and when we’re not it’s no more than a token gesture. This has to change to give us any chance whatsoever at keeping lads like the two that have gone to Brentford.

I don't think I'm being harsh at all. He's made a decision which benefits him and which is probably the right one for the points you make but that means he's no longer Wednesday 'through and through' as the person I'm replying to says. He's a fan sure but he's made a decision which disadvantages the club,  a club who he not only supports but who have invested years in for what will now be little reward. 

[TheGreatNebber]

1 minute ago, SLJ said:

The sooner we all accept club loyalty and personal ambition are not the same thing, the sooner we’ll all feel a little better in life. Look at it another way, 10 years from now and we’re playing the Brentford with a Brentford fan in the ranks; Do you accept the player mentioning it in an interview? How about we go whole hog and let them celebrate together at the end. 
Time to grow up when it comes to this stuff. 

I don't disagree but again 'through and through' is a phrase which no longer applies to his support because he's made a decision which disadvantages the club at the expense of another. 

 

[SLJ]

1 minute ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't disagree but again 'through and through' is a phrase which no longer applies to his support because he's made a decision which disadvantages the club at the expense of another. 

 

Give over. He stays at Wednesday, Wednesday sign another lad from let’s say ‘Brentford’ and lad takes his place. Or are you saying the club will show him loyalty as he’s a fan and he’s set for life? 

[royalowlisback]

4 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't disagree but again 'through and through' is a phrase which no longer applies to his support because he's made a decision which disadvantages the club at the expense of another. 

 

How do we know it will disadvantage SWFC?

 

He might never make it - he could have some sort of sell on fee - and the odds are he probably wouldn't have got a look in at Hillsborough anyway - in which case you could argue he is saving them money.

[Roy Of The Roasters]

2 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

I don't think I'm being harsh at all. He's made a decision which benefits him and which is probably the right one for the points you make but that means he's no longer Wednesday 'through and through' 

 

Surely there's more to being Wednesday than who pays your wages? One is an integral part of your identity, the other no longer than the remaining duration of your contract.

 

2 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

He's a fan sure but he's made a decision which disadvantages the club.....

 

How do we know that? We don't know how his career will pan out. He may re-join us later in his career having benefited from elite coaching and PL experience. Or he may end up injury prone and a dead weight. We just don't know.

[TheGreatNebber]

6 minutes ago, SLJ said:

Give over. He stays at Wednesday, Wednesday sign another lad from let’s say ‘Brentford’ and lad takes his place. Or are you saying the club will show him loyalty as he’s a fan and he’s set for life? 

Again, I don't disagree but I'm not talking about whether his decision is a sensible one in terms of him personally or his career. 

 

I think it's pretty clear that I don't see the actions of this lad being consistent with him being described as being 'Wednesday through and through'. Don't you think that phrase has a particular meaning that means more than just being a fan who'll choose self interest over the club. 

 

If I worked for Asda and described myself as being Asda 'through and through' but then got a job at Tesco then I'd have to stop describing myself like that even if I still did my weekly shop at Asda.  

[TheGreatNebber]

9 minutes ago, royalowlisback said:

How do we know it will disadvantage SWFC?

 

He might never make it - he could have some sort of sell on fee - and the odds are he probably wouldn't have got a look in at Hillsborough anyway - in which case you could argue he is saving them money.

Of course he might not make it but I doubt he made the decision to go to Brentford because he was thinking about saving us from future disappointment just in case.  

[royalowlisback]

2 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

Again, I don't disagree but I'm not talking about whether his decision is a sensible one in terms of him personally or his career. 

 

I think it's pretty clear that I don't see the actions of this lad being consistent with him being described as being 'Wednesday through and through'. Don't you think that phrase has a particular meaning that means more than just being a fan who'll choose self interest over the club. 

 

If I worked for Asda and described myself as being Asda 'through and through' but then got a job at Tesco then I'd have to stop describing myself like that even if I still did my weekly shop at Asda.  

At least you would still be in Blue and White Stripes.

[elyowl1]

50 minutes ago, SiJ said:

You see, in this instance, I'm not sure what Wednesday can do. 

 

The system is skewed massively in favour of a club like Brentford who as a PL team can cherry pick the best players from lower down the leagues. 

 

From my understanding, these two lads had just reached the age where we could offer them scholar deals? They were both keen to sign, but then Brentford swooped in and that was that. 

 

There is no denying that Wednesday's youth development has been pretty subpar for years, but then we seem to be operating in a system which almost wants that to be the case. 

 

On the upside, Cadamateri has signed on for a year or two. 

When we tried doing what Brentford have done, for every Bart Williams, we have had the two? Linighan brothers who were crap, Mckeever and Billington etc. 

Our record in tring to sign young players has been horrendous to say the least for at least 30 years. 

[SLJ]

39 minutes ago, TheGreatNebber said:

Again, I don't disagree but I'm not talking about whether his decision is a sensible one in terms of him personally or his career. 

 

I think it's pretty clear that I don't see the actions of this lad being consistent with him being described as being 'Wednesday through and through'. Don't you think that phrase has a particular meaning that means more than just being a fan who'll choose self interest over the club. 

 

If I worked for Asda and described myself as being Asda 'through and through' but then got a job at Tesco then I'd have to stop describing myself like that even if I still did my weekly shop at Asda.  

If Wednesday offered him a similar or better deal then I’d agree, but we need to segregate loyalty and ambition. 
 

Simple scenario.

 

You’re on £5k a week at SWFC, with two years left with no offer on the table. Man City come in, offer 5 years, £40k a week, with potential to play with better players and improve your game and trophy haul. I’ll be honest, I’m rooming with John Stones with and picking up his mucky boxers for that kind of life changing deal. 
 

What would you do? What would the family want you to do?? 

[royalowlisback]

4 minutes ago, SLJ said:

If Wednesday offered him a similar or better deal then I’d agree, but we need to segregate loyalty and ambition. 
 

Simple scenario.

 

You’re on £5k a week at SWFC, with two years left with no offer on the table. Man City come in, offer 5 years, £40k a week, with potential to play with better players and improve your game and trophy haul. I’ll be honest, I’m rooming with John Stones with and picking up his mucky boxers for that kind of life changing deal. 
 

What would you do? What would the family want you to do?? 

He'd stay at Asda. 

[TheGreatNebber]

5 minutes ago, SLJ said:

If Wednesday offered him a similar or better deal then I’d agree, but we need to segregate loyalty and ambition. 
 

Simple scenario.

 

You’re on £5k a week at SWFC, with two years left with no offer on the table. Man City come in, offer 5 years, £40k a week, with potential to play with better players and improve your game and trophy haul. I’ll be honest, I’m rooming with John Stones with and picking up his mucky boxers for that kind of life changing deal. 
 

What would you do? What would the family want you to do?? 

As I've already said I'm not making a point about what's best to do. Of course for most people money and stability take priority, although simple short terms gains don't always work out and many a highly paid promising premier league youngster will burn through their cash and be skint by the time their career ends I'll bet. 

 

As I've said I'm clearly making a point about making this choice not being consistent with being described as being Wednesday 'through and through'. However I concede to your persistence; I'm wrong, the lad bleeds blue and white, he's up there with Tango as one of our most committed ever fans, he averts his eyes whenever he drives past Bramall Lane, he's got 900 priority points and wears SWFC pyjamas. He's Wednesday through and through and he'll always look out for our results while wearing Wednesday boxer shorts under his Brentford B kit.