Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 6 minutes ago, dnhc said: the joe hart situation shows what has gone on for years, shyte keeper? but at a BIG club? YOU'RE IN. Exactly, not sure if I read on here or somewhere else, someone saying ‘why take Butland and not Hart? Harts had a bad season but Butland has had a worse one!’ Just because Stoke got relegated. If it wasn’t for Butland Stoke would’ve gone down well before they did, he saved them in a lot of games. He deserves to go. Agree with your second part, too scared to attack. I’d rather we go out and lose by actually trying to win the game rather than not to lose and still lose. Im still not sure about Southgates team but at least he hasn’t picked names for names sake. Don’t rate Llalana or Henderson but who else is there? And don’t get me started on Sterling, most overrated player ever! And he runs like a duck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, hasthagotanycheese said: Totally agree. England should play "English" football, stop trying to be Spain or Holland. Play with a big orrid centre forward, two wingers high tempo get it in the mixer and have a right go. Pick players that are on form not just because they play for the big clubs. Wales got to the semi's of the Euros on the back of this method with 1 world class player a couple of prem players and the rest championship journeymen. Overall our team is stronger than that but the sum is generally less than the whole of the parts. ICELAND (the very small country not the frozen food outlet) shamed us by playing what was essentially high tempo 'british football'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, dnhc said: ICELAND (the very small country not the frozen food outlet) shamed us by playing what was essentially high tempo 'british football'. That really was a low moment watching England Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 8 minutes ago, room0035 said: we have possibly the easiest group so if we cannot get to the next round we need to ditch the lot. Scrape past Panama Draw with Tunisia Lose to Belgium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Starling Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 23 minutes ago, Spuddy01 said: That team was good enough to win something in my opinion just wasn’t used right. It was obvious the Gerard/Lampard combo just didn’t work in a 442 but we kept persevering with it. It wasn't good enough to win a prize in a tombola. The only real world class player in that generation was Ashley Cole. The others at best were good footballers but nowhere near World class which in my book you have to maintain a level of consistency for many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, dnhc said: ICELAND (the very small country not the frozen food outlet) shamed us by playing what was essentially high tempo 'british football'. no offence intended to the 'frozen food' outlet, i'm sure if they had a side they'd be itching to have pop at the 'mighty' england too, and provided kevin off shelf packing was free would be in with a good chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Ronnie Starling said: It wasn't good enough to win a prize in a tombola. The only real world class player in that generation was Ashley Cole. The others at best were good footballers but nowhere near World class which in my book you have to maintain a level of consistency for many years. It was good enough to win the Euros in 04 I think, if Rooney hadn’t been sent off who knows what could’ve happened in that game and afterwards. The main problem with English teams is we just don’t have that winning mentality that the Germans/Spanish /Italians have. Italy don’t have any world class players but they know how to win games in tournaments. Edited May 18, 2018 by Spuddy01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Spuddy01 said: It was good enough to win the Euros in 04 I think, if Rooney hadn’t been sent off who knows what could’ve happened in that game and afterwards. The main problem with English teams is we just don’t have that winning mentality that the Germans/Spanish /Italians have. Italy don’t have any world class players but they know how to win games in tournaments. Agree. A winning team doesn't have to be made up of world class talents. It helps no doubt. But getting the best team out of what is available goes a long way. A lesson not learned by a succesion of England managers who have shoehorned in our 'Star' players at the expense of having a fluid, effective team unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Ronnie Starling said: We were told we had a golden generation of footballers i.e Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard etc who weren't as good as people thought. Other nations had far superior players that played at the top of their game and maintained that tournament after tournament. Plenty of froth and no substance. Not as good as our press made them out to be. But still enough talent to have been forged into an effective unit. Lack of tactical fluidity and an absolute cold sweat fear of dropping any of the names to make us a better overall unit stopped them achieving more than they could have done. IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 16 minutes ago, Spuddy01 said: It was good enough to win the Euros in 04 I think, if Rooney hadn’t been sent off who knows what could’ve happened in that game and afterwards. The main problem with English teams is we just don’t have that winning mentality that the Germans/Spanish /Italians have. Italy don’t have any world class players but they know how to win games in tournaments. the italians have a mind set, generally they have defenders who can defend, and they play to THEIR strengths giving 100%, whilst england play like they're carrying heavy baggage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 15 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said: Agree. A winning team doesn't have to be made up of world class talents. It helps no doubt. But getting the best team out of what is available goes a long way. A lesson not learned by a succesion of England managers who have shoehorned in our 'Star' players at the expense of having a fluid, effective team unit. 100% agree too scared to drop the ‘names’ in fear of upsetting the little cherubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, dnhc said: the italians have a mind set, generally they have defenders who can defend, and they play to THEIR strengths giving 100%, whilst england play like they're carrying heavy baggage. I agree. You could argue that the pressure the press/fans put on the team could play a part but personally I don’t buy that. the Italian press put way more pressure on their national side and they seem to handle it, as like you say, they play to their strengths and give 100%. We just don’t have any bite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewswfc Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 37 minutes ago, dnhc said: ICELAND (the very small country not the frozen food outlet) shamed us by playing what was essentially high tempo 'british football'. I haven't be interested one little bit since that fiasco. I wouldn't have let the players back in the country. Overpaid namby pamby w##kers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 1 minute ago, Spuddy01 said: 100% agree too scared to drop the ‘names’ in fear of upsetting the little cherubs. And of upsetting the press. Remember when Capello first took over. (Didn't do a great job. But that's another debate - a culture clash) He didn't pick Owen and that is litterally all they asked him about. Owen had barely played a game for his club. He'd been out for months. And they kept going on and on and on. "But his record is great" Then the pundits were at it. "Can't believe he hasn't picked him. With his record." Thing is. He'd been a spent force for time before that. You cannot win with the press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Starling Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 21 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said: Agree. A winning team doesn't have to be made up of world class talents. It helps no doubt. But getting the best team out of what is available goes a long way. A lesson not learned by a succesion of England managers who have shoehorned in our 'Star' players at the expense of having a fluid, effective team unit. It was absolutely criminal that we shoehorned Gerrard, Lampard & Beckham into the side and then the other World class player I forgot to add to Cole Scholes was constantly overlooked, messed around and played out of position until he decided to jack it in. Which you can't blame him for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 Just now, Ronnie Starling said: It was absolutely criminal that we shoehorned Gerrard, Lampard & Beckham into the side and then the other World class player I forgot to add to Cole Scholes was constantly overlooked, messed around and played out of position until he decided to jack it in. Which you can't blame him for. Absolutley agree. It was a 4-4-2 shoe horn. But he kept to it because our record scorer was about pace on the back line and couldn't play alone up there. Never had the balls to drop or change system. As I just said in another post - I think half of that is fear of the press. Greece showed what can be done with an effective system and players in roles that compliment each other. (Ugly as sin to watch and I'm not suggesting we play the way they did. Awful spectacle. But... the old saying. A team is about more than the sum of the parts.) Same as Nuhiu really. Hooper plays his best with him. Joao plays his best with him Fernando plays his best with him. But he's hardly played becasue he isn't, as an indivual, one of the best players. Carlos was a league football Sven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 7 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said: And of upsetting the press. Remember when Capello first took over. (Didn't do a great job. But that's another debate - a culture clash) He didn't pick Owen and that is litterally all they asked him about. Owen had barely played a game for his club. He'd been out for months. And they kept going on and on and on. "But his record is great" Then the pundits were at it. "Can't believe he hasn't picked him. With his record." Thing is. He'd been a spent force for time before that. You cannot win with the press. Yep, didn’t Maclaren do it with Beckham as well? Even though the press had been slating Becks for ages. Personally I think he did that to prove a point ‘I’m the boss’ but he got hounded for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spuddy01 Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, Ronnie Starling said: It was absolutely criminal that we shoehorned Gerrard, Lampard & Beckham into the side and then the other World class player I forgot to add to Cole Scholes was constantly overlooked, messed around and played out of position until he decided to jack it in. Which you can't blame him for. Definitely agree with that. Scholes was completely wasted in the England squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 3 minutes ago, Spuddy01 said: Yep, didn’t Maclaren do it with Beckham as well? Even though the press had been slating Becks for ages. Personally I think he did that to prove a point ‘I’m the boss’ but he got hounded for it. He did. I think the problem he had was that he hadn't thought properly about how he was going to replace him. For a spell he just pushed Gerrard out there. And it worked in a way for a time because he saw the value of Hargreaves being a ball winner in the middle. Then Wright-Phillips came in. Running into dead ends. By the end it was Gerrard and Lampard back in the middle. They all fell into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted May 18, 2018 Share Posted May 18, 2018 22 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said: And of upsetting the press. Remember when Capello first took over. (Didn't do a great job. But that's another debate - a culture clash) He didn't pick Owen and that is litterally all they asked him about. Owen had barely played a game for his club. He'd been out for months. And they kept going on and on and on. "But his record is great" Then the pundits were at it. "Can't believe he hasn't picked him. With his record." Thing is. He'd been a spent force for time before that. You cannot win with the press. it's the british way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now