gurujuan Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 You're making out like hard work is all he's shown. Get him in the right positions, in and around the box, and he WILL score goals. He's scored 3 good goals in an impotent side. Should have been 4 with the excellent finish at Bolton that was disallowed. He's made some great runs in good areas in the games I've seen, and never received the ball. I don't think it's unreasonable to believe he'd be on 6 or 7 goals already if we had a player with the vision to pick those runs out. Nobody would be trying to pick apart petty aspects to his game if he had scored 6 or 7. You're ignoring the positives and highlighting the negatives. Perhaps I am yes, I certainly don't think he was a bad signing though. I suppose I feel pretty miffed that we've had to change a system that I thought suited our resources to accommodate Stevie May. That me be a bit unfair, as that isn't necessarily his fault. What it probably boils down to, in my opinion, we are unlikely to find the type of midfielder who could provide May with the service he needs, for the budget we'd have available. Certainly not one who could operate in a central pairing of two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsons Cross Owl Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 No one can dispute the lad dosen`t work hard, but he has no quality, what a waste of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Perhaps I am yes, I certainly don't think he was a bad signing though. I suppose I feel pretty miffed that we've had to change a system that I thought suited our resources to accommodate Stevie May. That me be a bit unfair, as that isn't necessarily his fault. What it probably boils down to, in my opinion, we are unlikely to find the type of midfielder who could provide May with the service he needs, for the budget we'd have available. Certainly not one who could operate in a central pairing of two. I get what you're saying. I know you've been calling for a change of formation and I agree. I've been saying for a bit we should go with the 451/433 formation. Only difference of mine is I'd play May up top as the central striker with Nuhiu as an option off the bench. He doesn't have the physical presence of Nuhiu, but he'd cause defenders different types of problems with his movement. Plus he'd be doing it in the right areas. The extra man in midfield should help us with our build up play and keeping possession, which is something we've struggled with. No one can dispute the lad dosen`t work hard, but he has no quality, what a waste of money. You're a waste of an owlstalk account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I get what you're saying. I know you've been calling for a change of formation and I agree. I've been saying for a bit we should go with the 451/433 formation. Only difference of mine is I'd play May up top as the central striker with Nuhiu as an option off the bench. He doesn't have the physical presence of Nuhiu, but he'd cause defenders different types of problems with his movement. Plus he'd be doing it in the right areas. The extra man in midfield should help us with our build up play and keeping possession, which is something we've struggled with. You're a waste of an owlstalk account. It's an option I'd be willing to explore. Both Nuhiu and May, also Madine for that matter, have shown the willingness to work hard and defend from the front when needed. If we went back to 451-433 my preference would be for Nuhiu, mainly because he's done it before. He has the strength to hold the ball up allowing the attacking midfield players to get up and support, at the moment I don't think May has that strength. However, that's not to say he couldn't play the lone striker role, especially if we were to modify the system. With Nuhiu as the striker, I'd envisage an attacking midfield of Maguire, Maghoma and Drenthe all of whom would be given license to interchange. All three can run with the ball, and all three can shoot. If we were using May as the lone striker, I don't think he'd be so good at the hold up play. It would be more about creating angles and zipping the ball around a bit quicker. In this system, maybe GTF would be a better bet then Drenthe. In both systems the width would be provided by the full backs. Neither Nuhiu or May are target men, as such, but maybe both are capable of being at the apex of a fluid 451-433 system. Our current 442 system just doesn't work. The strikers don't have the pace and power to occupy the defenders, the wingers don't operate as wingers and the central two are being overrun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I reckon we could get away with 2 midfielders if 1 of them is Hutchinson. Lee probably best option as his partner. He'd be the one tasked with picking the killer passes. Obviously Hutchinson's injury problems prevent him playing much, and there's next to no chance of Milan replacing him, so as of now yes, we need 3 in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) In terms of the lone striker, Nuhiu's lack of mobility is an issue for me. It's all very one dimensional if he plays up there on his own. As much of a handful he can be for defenders, I think he is pretty easy to do a job on if he's all they have to worry about. Edited October 29, 2014 by IstillhateSteveBould Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geörge Whitebread Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 You're making out like hard work is all he's shown. Get him in the right positions, in and around the box, and he WILL score goals. He's scored 3 good goals in an impotent side. Should have been 4 with the excellent finish at Bolton that was disallowed. He's made some great runs in good areas in the games I've seen, and never received the ball. I don't think it's unreasonable to believe he'd be on 6 or 7 goals already if we had a player with the vision to pick those runs out. Nobody would be trying to pick apart petty aspects to his game if he had scored 6 or 7. You're ignoring the positives and highlighting the negatives. All debatable except the point about us not having someone with the vision to make something of him. Why keep playing him if his sucess depends so heavily on players that we don't possess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geörge Whitebread Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Perhaps I am yes, I certainly don't think he was a bad signing though. I suppose I feel pretty miffed that we've had to change a system that I thought suited our resources to accommodate Stevie May. That me be a bit unfair, as that isn't necessarily his fault. What it probably boils down to, in my opinion, we are unlikely to find the type of midfielder who could provide May with the service he needs, for the budget we'd have available. Certainly not one who could operate in a central pairing of two. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geörge Whitebread Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I get what you're saying. I know you've been calling for a change of formation and I agree. I've been saying for a bit we should go with the 451/433 formation. Only difference of mine is I'd play May up top as the central striker with Nuhiu as an option off the bench. He doesn't have the physical presence of Nuhiu, but he'd cause defenders different types of problems with his movement. Plus he'd be doing it in the right areas. The extra man in midfield should help us with our build up play and keeping possession, which is something we've struggled with. We need someone that can retain possession at this level though. He needs to learn that, just as Nuhiu has. It's taken over a season for Nuhiu to become an effective Championship player. Why we're expecting Stevie to take a huge step up from a standing start is beyond me. Let's just have a bit of sense and work with him over time rather than rushing things too much. We could break him at this rate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geörge Whitebread Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 It's an option I'd be willing to explore. Both Nuhiu and May, also Madine for that matter, have shown the willingness to work hard and defend from the front when needed. If we went back to 451-433 my preference would be for Nuhiu, mainly because he's done it before. He has the strength to hold the ball up allowing the attacking midfield players to get up and support, at the moment I don't think May has that strength. However, that's not to say he couldn't play the lone striker role, especially if we were to modify the system. With Nuhiu as the striker, I'd envisage an attacking midfield of Maguire, Maghoma and Drenthe all of whom would be given license to interchange. All three can run with the ball, and all three can shoot. If we were using May as the lone striker, I don't think he'd be so good at the hold up play. It would be more about creating angles and zipping the ball around a bit quicker. In this system, maybe GTF would be a better bet then Drenthe. In both systems the width would be provided by the full backs. Neither Nuhiu or May are target men, as such, but maybe both are capable of being at the apex of a fluid 451-433 system. Our current 442 system just doesn't work. The strikers don't have the pace and power to occupy the defenders, the wingers don't operate as wingers and the central two are being overrun. Again, spot on. Without wishing to be too sycophantic, I like the cut of your jib x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geörge Whitebread Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 In terms of the lone striker, Nuhiu's lack of mobility is an issue for me. It's all very one dimensional if he plays up there on his own. As much of a handful he can be for defenders, I think he is pretty easy to do a job on if he's all they have to worry about. Which is exactly why we need the likes of Drethe, Maghoma, Maguire and/or GTF in support (3 of, rather than just 1 or 2!), rather than May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 All debatable except the point about us not having someone with the vision to make something of him. Why keep playing him if his sucess depends so heavily on players that we don't possess. For a start, play him because he's shown qualities that suggest he's by far the most likely of our 3 strikers to score goals on a regular basis. Look at the quality of his goals. There's nothing debatable about them, or the quality of the disallowed goal at Bolton. There's nothing debatable about the runs I've seen him make with my own eyes. Nothing debatable about the intelligence and control he showed to manufacture that chance at Leeds that he unfortunately dragged wide. Why do you and others choose to ignore these things? And a quality passer is the number 1 ideal scenario. That doesn't mean we can't get plenty out of Stevie May without one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Which is exactly why we need the likes of Drethe, Maghoma, Maguire and/or GTF in support (3 of, rather than just 1 or 2!), rather than May. Where did I say anything about not needing 3 supporting? I'm talking about playing May as central striker instead of Nuhiu. I've already explained the reason why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I wonder, if Gray is going to insist on playing 442, what would be the right type of partner for him. None of our existing forwards, as they are all too one paced, in that they don't have any. May seems like a harder working version of Steve McLean, and not just because he's from North of the border. McLean's purple patch was the period when he had big Kenwyn alongside. I think Stevie May could benefit from that type of pace and power, rather than the more static Nuhiu or Madine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Tough to think of any in our range. That's the problem. A quicker more mobile version of Nuhiu would be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Was listening to the Sky pundits talking about how much easier it was to defend against side who don't have any pace Defences push up knowing they can't be caught out by anyone running in behind, everything is played out in front of the defence half way up the pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
since59owe Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Was listening to the Sky pundits talking about how much easier it was to defend against side who don't have any pace Defences push up knowing they can't be caught out by anyone running in behind, everything is played out in front of the defence half way up the pitch. Answer: Teddy Sherringham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigash_swfc Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think our team is too cliquey No togetherness, alot of little pockets of players, some with agendas No unity throughout the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Answer: Teddy Sherringham Him, and latterly, Berbatov are two examples of forwards that didn't have pace but they did have speed of thought. They were at their best when they were bringing players into the game who did. You need pace in the modern game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Pace is something we are definitely lacking, particularly in our first choice 11. I said at the time, it was a shocking decision to sell Antonio for such a low price, and we'd miss him massively at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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