2 FACED FANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PabloBonvin]

That's one opinion - many would agree - many others would disagree

But as a matter of interest how far do you go with deciding who "deserves" the chance to play professional football?

Good point, Theres nothing we can do about it, its about whos a good enough player, You could have two trialists at Real Madrid, one a criminal with many convictions, the other has just turned up to training after rescuing 50 orphans from a burning building, if the criminal is the better player he'll get the nod. Something i agree with in one respect and also disagree on many other levels.

It would be nice to have a perfect world where everyone gets what they deserve whether good or bad, but sadly that is not the case.

However i will still state my own opinion of the guy is that he is a waste of space and doesnt 'deserve' to play football.

[Guest Triplej2]

If only I was a 'good guy'.

What are you saying geezer? That you would have done 1 or more of the things Hughes did back then?

[DJMortimer]

TBH i struggle to believe that Hughes has responded to terrace taunts by mimicking driving actions and i'll believe it when there is credible evidence - but if he has then he should be banned from football for good

There is no mileage in trying to have a constructive debate about any of this because as i said previously there is too much emotion involved

Some think he has served his time and should be rehabilitated back into his life - others think he has gone past that point by his actions and shouldn't be allowed to enjoy such fruitful employment - NOBODY is condoning nor justifying what Hughes did - nobody

But some people absolutely refuse to countenance that despite the horror of what Hughes caused - some very basic and common human prinicples may have been at work - emotions such as fear, panic, irrationality, confusion - the emotion of language such as "he left somebody to die" may be true - it may be he had no knowledge of anything regarding the other occupants and i'm pretty sure he's no medic who could have made that assessment - to say "he left somebody to die" suggests he did it deliberately with knowledge of what was gonna happen - yes fleeing the scene was a monumentally poo poo thing to do bit i am always uncomforatble when people try to apply the thoughts and deeds of the rational to situations which are beyond the scope of the majority of humans

Maybe Hughes just is a scumbucket with callous disregard - i dunno cos i've never had dealings with him - but maybe he was just overtaken by horrific events of his own doing and rationale, sense and logic just deserted him?

To recognise the extraordinary events that this ordinary person was faced with does not seek to tolerate nor condone what happened - there'sno point just repeating what happened on that fateful night and subsequently - even with bullet points - because we all know and it's not being debated - once again nobody is justifying nor condoning what Hughes did - it's about how some people think offenders should be treated - while recognising the gossamer thin line that exists between a safe trip home (whether steamed/drugged/texting all the way) and an absolute catastrophe

Got to give you credit in this thread Scram. Your posts have covered all the bases in calm, rational and thoughtful fashion against a backdrop of high emotions.

Personally, I don't believe the upside (as the Yanks increasingly call it these days) of signing Hughes outweighs all the negatives to a degree which makes signing him worthwhile. And as you say, if he has mocked this terrible event in any way he should have been kicked out of the game. But given the nature of the 'evidence' I suspect he has not done so.

[scram]

Good point, Theres nothing we can do about it, its about whos a good enough player, You could have two trialists at Real Madrid, one a criminal with many convictions, the other has just turned up to training after rescuing 50 orphans from a burning building, if the criminal is the better player he'll get the nod. Something i agree with in one respect and also disagree on many other levels.

It would be nice to have a perfect world where everyone gets what they deserve whether good or bad, but sadly that is not the case.

However i will still state my own opinion of the guy is that he is a waste of space and doesnt 'deserve' to play football.

This is why i get a bit uneasy about the setting son the so-called moral compass

Let's face it - if there were a kid out there who had skills better than Messi and he'd just got out of clink for shooting his classmates then the top clubs would still be looking to sign him - ethics, morals and business are a lot easier to seprate when the product is mediocre

But take it a stage further and where do you really draw the line - is assault okay as long as the victim survives (physically at least)?

Drink driving is itself is entirely acceptable as long as there are no repercussions?

Is it outcomes and not intentions that are the sole arbiter of the fate that judges a person?

I don't have any answers and with every case i seem to be conflicted because there are 2 sides to most cases - i'm just putting it out there for consideration

I fully understand why people have their opinions of Hughes - totally - i am just saying that there is another viewpoint which is neither right nor wrong - just different

[Guest JonTheOwl66]

I think this is all getting hugely out of hand really.

All of you going on, 'Oh he's a sick bugger, he ran away!! He flipping killed somebody!!' Yes he did, everybody knows that. Now don't get me wrong, I personally think what he did was disgusting, and any person who kills, whether it was manslaughter or setting out to do it, should be locked in an absolute shithole and make sure the bellend doesn't see light again.

But think of it in context, a footballer's life is a whole lot different than ours. He most likely thought, in a drunken state, 'poo poo, this'll make front page news' Someone stated already, that he suffered no injuries from the crash, so why would he assume the other person had died? Yes, the ordinary person would immediately go and check, and offer to pay for the damages, but this is a person who panicked. He made a huge mistake, and he threw away several years of his life for it, and ruined one family.

I don't believe for one second that he didn't feel huge sorrow, that he didn't cry himself to sleep at night, it would be ridiculous to assume he didn't. He's not a horrible person, he never intentionally set out to kill. But yes, he rumbleing stupidly did it. He served his time, fair or not, he served it. He's publicly apologised, he's seen the family, seen how distraught they would of been and it must of killed him inside to see that.

At the end of the day, he's a footballer, nothing more, nothing less. I'd 100% support him if he came to us, I wouldn't like him as a person, as is expected, I wouldn't have anything to do with any murderers. But he's paid to do a job, and that job is playing football. I support Sheffield Wednesday football club, and if he came to do a job for us, he's part of the 'family' as such.

[Guest Triplej2]

I think this is all getting hugely out of hand really.

All of you going on, 'Oh he's a sick bugger, he ran away!! He flipping killed somebody!!' Yes he did, everybody knows that. Now don't get me wrong, I personally think what he did was disgusting, and any person who kills, whether it was manslaughter or setting out to do it, should be locked in an absolute shithole and make sure the bellend doesn't see light again.

But think of it in context, a footballer's life is a whole lot different than ours. He most likely thought, in a drunken state, 'poo poo, this'll make front page news' Someone stated already, that he suffered no injuries from the crash, so why would he assume the other person had died? Yes, the ordinary person would immediately go and check, and offer to pay for the damages, but this is a person who panicked. He made a huge mistake, and he threw away several years of his life for it, and ruined one family.

I don't believe for one second that he didn't feel huge sorrow, that he didn't cry himself to sleep at night, it would be ridiculous to assume he didn't. He's not a horrible person, he never intentionally set out to kill. But yes, he rumbleing stupidly did it. He served his time, fair or not, he served it. He's publicly apologised, he's seen the family, seen how distraught they would of been and it must of killed him inside to see that.

At the end of the day, he's a footballer, nothing more, nothing less. I'd 100% support him if he came to us, I wouldn't like him as a person, as is expected, I wouldn't have anything to do with any murderers. But he's paid to do a job, and that job is playing football. I support Sheffield Wednesday football club, and if he came to do a job for us, he's part of the 'family' as such.

He pleaded innocent and put the family through a lot of pain. Plus, I don't care what you say, anyone who runs from a serious accident (whether he thought everyone was ok or not) is a selfish c*nt and a coward.

[PabloBonvin]

I just fail to see remorse. I know he'd publicly apologised, but he had to do that regardless.

My link

But the player's return was criticised by Albert Frisby, who was injured in the crash which led to Hughes being sent to prison.

"He has no remorse," said Frisby. "To me he is very arrogant and ignorant. I've just got no time for the fellow.

"The only people I feel sorry for are his two kids. They've got to suffer the abuse that he's going to be called, or whatever, so it's just devastation all round."

Also:

My link

Also:

My link

Sharon Montgomery, whose father Douglas Graham, 56, died in the crash, revealed she visited him in jail and demanded an apology, adding the 31-year-old "blubbed like a baby".

She said: "I had to face the demon who never had the decency to say sorry."

Mrs Montgomery's mother Maureen, 51, was also injured and later died.

Hughes' Mercedes ploughed into the car carrying the couple and Albert Frisby, who still walks with a stick.

Mr Frisby, 62, said: "He's arrogant and I've no time for him. I'm not happy about him getting a job."

Edited January 22, 2011 by PabloBonvin

[Guest scott_andrew_william]

I think this is all getting hugely out of hand really.

All of you going on, 'Oh he's a sick bugger, he ran away!! He flipping killed somebody!!' Yes he did, everybody knows that. Now don't get me wrong, I personally think what he did was disgusting, and any person who kills, whether it was manslaughter or setting out to do it, should be locked in an absolute shithole and make sure the bellend doesn't see light again.

But think of it in context, a footballer's life is a whole lot different than ours. He most likely thought, in a drunken state, 'poo poo, this'll make front page news' Someone stated already, that he suffered no injuries from the crash, so why would he assume the other person had died? Yes, the ordinary person would immediately go and check, and offer to pay for the damages, but this is a person who panicked. He made a huge mistake, and he threw away several years of his life for it, and ruined one family.

I don't believe for one second that he didn't feel huge sorrow, that he didn't cry himself to sleep at night, it would be ridiculous to assume he didn't. He's not a horrible person, he never intentionally set out to kill. But yes, he rumbleing stupidly did it. He served his time, fair or not, he served it. He's publicly apologised, he's seen the family, seen how distraught they would of been and it must of killed him inside to see that.

At the end of the day, he's a footballer, nothing more, nothing less. I'd 100% support him if he came to us, I wouldn't like him as a person, as is expected, I wouldn't have anything to do with any murderers. But he's paid to do a job, and that job is playing football. I support Sheffield Wednesday football club, and if he came to do a job for us, he's part of the 'family' as such.

Just because they play football doesn't make them celebrities, I bet he didn't give a crap whether the other people were hurt or not, he was more bothered about himself. I still don't think he's learnt his lesson, I think now he's out he doesn't care about it anymore "He's done his time". If he came to wednesday, I will never go to a match again, I think i'd be through with them. I'm a loyal supporter, but I will not nor will I ever support that scum bag. How do you know he's not a horrible person? If he really was bothered about the family then why did he plead not guilty? People who don't think he did the celebration, he did, it was on skysports news. He didn't serve his time, because he's still alive.

[cardiffowl06]

Just to add, he would be a poo poo addition to our squad..

[pgmetcalf]

So the fact that the OP's rating is -81 doesn't convince him he's wrong?

[scram]

So the fact that the OP's rating is -81 doesn't convince him he's wrong?

Whats the rating got to do with anything?

Those things are turning Owlstalk into a kindergarten - absolutely add nothing to the site but take plenty away

flipping moronic idea

[Arthur Bach]

Just to add, he would be a poo poo addition to our squad..

Absolute total clap trap.

Hughes is a supreme finisher.

[Guest JonTheOwl66]

He pleaded innocent and put the family through a lot of pain. Plus, I don't care what you say, anyone who runs from a serious accident (whether he thought everyone was ok or not) is a selfish c*nt and a coward.

Where in my post did I say I disagreed? Yes, he is a `selfish c*nt and a coward` but that is not the point I'm rumbleing well making. I'm saying he is a footballer, and any footballer that plays for Wednesday will always get my 100% support.

[Guest JonTheOwl66]

Just to add, he would be a poo poo addition to our squad..

Bullshit.

[Guest JonTheOwl66]

Just because they play football doesn't make them celebrities, I bet he didn't give a crap whether the other people were hurt or not, he was more bothered about himself. I still don't think he's learnt his lesson, I think now he's out he doesn't care about it anymore "He's done his time". If he came to wednesday, I will never go to a match again, I think i'd be through with them. I'm a loyal supporter, but I will not nor will I ever support that scum bag. How do you know he's not a horrible person? If he really was bothered about the family then why did he plead not guilty? People who don't think he did the celebration, he did, it was on skysports news. He didn't serve his time, because he's still alive.

No point in arguing with such a deluded person.

[Guest JonTheOwl66]

I just fail to see remorse. I know he'd publicly apologised, but he had to do that regardless.

My link

But the player's return was criticised by Albert Frisby, who was injured in the crash which led to Hughes being sent to prison.

"He has no remorse," said Frisby. "To me he is very arrogant and ignorant. I've just got no time for the fellow.

"The only people I feel sorry for are his two kids. They've got to suffer the abuse that he's going to be called, or whatever, so it's just devastation all round."

Also:

My link

Also:

My link

Sharon Montgomery, whose father Douglas Graham, 56, died in the crash, revealed she visited him in jail and demanded an apology, adding the 31-year-old "blubbed like a baby".

She said: "I had to face the demon who never had the decency to say sorry."

Mrs Montgomery's mother Maureen, 51, was also injured and later died.

Hughes' Mercedes ploughed into the car carrying the couple and Albert Frisby, who still walks with a stick.

Mr Frisby, 62, said: "He's arrogant and I've no time for him. I'm not happy about him getting a job."

Of course they're going to hate him, if he'd killed someone in my family I'd hate him with a passion. Even if he apologised I still would, end of really.

[Guest dunellaowl]

GETTIN SICK OV THIS,..............yes lee hughes did wrong, personally i dont care if he comes or not, i dont think we need him.....BUT ..if he came and scored a hatrick in his first game,and took us to promotion, you 2 faced fkrs woulds be screaming his name ..FACT, i dont agree with what he did, hes done his time, i dontr think it was long eneough but, blame our justice system ffss, get behind our team..........all them fkrs ringing radio sheff tonight , high n mighty????? why not alsao ban the fans coming into the ground with a criminal record?????? GET A FKIN GRIP...............WED BE SEEING 10,000 weve all made mistakes you arseholes ..........UTO

WHAT A NASTY THREAD! as you said everyone makes mistakes yes ur right but every one can be two faced aswell but not every one kills somebody and does a runner and then gets to live it up as a footballer while a family is ruined for life!!

[Gorny]

I certainly sang Lee Hughes' name away at Meadow Lane, along with thousands of other Wednesdayites.

And trust me, that is the only Lee Hughes song i will ever sing ... fact!

Same here... I didn't agree with the booing of Purse the other week, but I will definitely sing this song again next time I see Lee Hughes play - even if it is in blue & White stripes. I do not want him anywhere near this club and I think 99% of Owls agree. If he did make the mistake of coming here, I'd do all I can to make it as short a stay as possible... And yes that would involve booing him every time he got the ball. I would also want rid of the manager that signed him and so obviously mis-judged the fanbase of this club...

Further to issues on morality, he simply wouldn't improve the squad anyway, so what's the point?