Last season 'Legends' not the answer

[Chris C]

I'm struggling to understand why so many people are kicking off and moaning that Llera was on the bench last night [and COG] and why so many people are calling for Kirkland to be dropped and Bywater recalled.

Yes, Llera has scored a couple of important goals this season [as he did last] but he has also been culpable for a fair few we've conceded. I'm sure that DJ's first choice centre back pairing is Gardner and Taylor and he hasn't been able to test that yet - although from what we've seen so far they both need to improve significantly if that's going to be the answer. The sooner Buxton is back (or Lee steps up) the better as Mattock can't play RB. Beevers probably got the nod last night because he's a little more mobile than Llera and Vaughan is a handful. Llera playing last night won't have changed the result. We were overran in midfield and they kept possession far better than us.

We didn't work hard enough or get tight enough to stop them doing this. That's why we struggle when we go behind against teams who keep the ball.

Bothroyd was poor last night [as was Madine] but he is a better player than COG. I can't believe that many could argue that point. Bothroyd will surely improve given his record in the Championship previously and if he doesn't [pretty sharpish] then I'm sure we'll see COG back in the starting line up.

Granted we've conceded a lot of goals but how many were Kirkland's fault? Maybe Bywater is a bit better at organising the defence but he hardly had a save to make last season given the opposition we were playing. A settled back 4 with people in the right position and Kirkland will start getting clean sheets. If he starts dropping clangers then get Bywater back in, but until that happens it would be very harsh to take him out.

The simple truth is that the step up to the Championship is a big one and certain players [regardless of how the played last season and how popular they are] aren't the answer in this league.

Edited September 20, 2012 by Chris C

[KivoOwl]

I really worry that we haven't got one decent centre back.

Llera - 33, defensively all over the place

Taylor - 32, slow, Darren Purse mkII

Gardner - 32, crock

Beevers - gone backwards in his development

Reda - Scary seeing him at left-back, never mind centre back

[BRUCE LEE]

I understand what he did, he picked the back four that in his mind was best set up to defend,

But the problem for me with Llera being dropped is that his replacement has a big impact on the style of play.

Taylor and Beevers will NEVER give us quality distribution from the back, and it looked like the top 2 reflected that. 2 big men up front, i'm presuming to deal with the long balls coming forward.

It wasn't pretty, at times it was awful.

On the Kirkland front though, i really can't get my head around that, he's not put a foot wrong.

[Dagmeister]

I'm struggling to understand why so many people are kicking off and moaning that Llera was on the bench last night [and COG] and why so many people are calling for Kirkland to be dropped and Bywater recalled.

Yes, Llera has scored a couple of important goals this season [as he did last] but he has also been culpable for a fair few we've conceded. I'm sure that DJ's first choice centre back pairing is Gardner and Taylor and he hasn't been able to test that yet - although from what we've seen so far they both need to improve significantly if that's going to be the answer. The sooner Buxton is back (or Lee steps up) the better as Mattock can't play RB. Beevers probably got the nod last night because he's a little more mobile than Llera and Vaughan is a handful. Llera playing last night won't have changed the result. We were overran in midfield and they kept possession far better than us.

We didn't work hard enough or get tight enough to stop them doing this. That's why we struggle when we go behind against teams who keep the ball.

Bothroyd was poor last night [as was Madine] but he is a better player than COG. I can't believe that many could argue that point. Bothroyd will surely improve given his record in the Championship previously and if he doesn't [pretty sharpish] then I'm sure we'll see COG back in the starting line up.

Granted we've conceded a lot of goals but how many were Kirkland's fault? Maybe Bywater is a bit better at organising the defence but he hardly had a save to make last season given the opposition we were playing. A settled back 4 with people in the right position and Kirkland will start getting clean sheets. If he starts dropping clangers then get Bywater back in, but until that happens it would be very harsh to take him out.

The simple truth is that the step up to the Championship is a big one and certain players [regardless of how the played last season and how popular they are] aren't the answer in this league.

Too many changes at once is making some good players look bad.... especially in defence. Bad enough wholesale changes pre-season but worse when we're underway. Past performance is no guaranteee for the future.....COG has looked good at this level... better than the other strikers. That should get him a place for the time being.

[TheBoyBeevers]

In the main, I agree. We've made a lot of changes in a short space of time which were needed, and it will take a while for those players to settle in and form an actual team. Megson said our promoted squad would need to be dismantled, and DJ obviously agrees.

The one exception is that the team at the moment is crying out for Chris Lines in the centre of midfield. Semedo is out of sorts and Barkley and McCabe together have barely played 20 first team professional games between them.

When Lines is back fit, it will be a huge boost for us.

[yowl84]

Though you can argue about needing better players for a better division - I think Norwich, Southampton and Swansea have all shown recently how this isn't the be all and end all - that having team spirit, hard work, continuity and above all a plan can help any group of players to overachieve.

For us, it may be that a team closer to last season's would start to find the going tough in the long term. I think this is probably the case, and Jones will gradually get the new team playing the way he wants, in a style suitable for the championship. At the moment, however, some of the qualities I just mentioned would be apprectiated - regardless of who is in the team.

[Dagmeister]

In the main, I agree. We've made a lot of changes in a short space of time which were needed, and it will take a while for those players to settle in and form an actual team. Megson said our promoted squad would need to be dismantled, and DJ obviously agrees.

The one exception is that the team at the moment is crying out for Chris Lines in the centre of midfield. Semedo is out of sorts and Barkley and McCabe together have barely played 20 first team professional games between them.

When Lines is back fit, it will be a huge boost for us.

Yes we've missed Lines.

[yowl84]

When Lines is back fit, it will be a huge boost for us.

I would agree - though I think the lines/semedo combination was particularly well balanced between attack and defence. I'm one of those who hopes McCabe gets a consistent run in the side, so I'm not sure where Lines fits back in. (I'm generally a fan of Lines, though.)

[fife_owl]

I really worry that we haven't got one decent centre back.

Llera - 33, defensively all over the place

Taylor - 32, slow, Darren Purse mkII

Gardner - 32, crock

Beevers - gone backwards in his development

Reda - Scary seeing him at left-back, never mind centre back

Thanks Kivo!

I was beginning to cheer up until I read that.

[BRADDAZ]

In the main, I agree. We've made a lot of changes in a short space of time which were needed, and it will take a while for those players to settle in and form an actual team. Megson said our promoted squad would need to be dismantled, and DJ obviously agrees.

The one exception is that the team at the moment is crying out for Chris Lines in the centre of midfield. Semedo is out of sorts and Barkley and McCabe together have barely played 20 first team professional games between them.

When Lines is back fit, it will be a huge boost for us.

Agree.

[Dagmeister]

I would agree - though I think the lines/semedo combination was particularly well balanced between attack and defence. I'm one of those who hopes McCabe gets a consistent run in the side, so I'm not sure where Lines fits back in. (I'm generally a fan of Lines, though.)

As things stand if DJ sticks to 4-4-2 then it'll be Lines plus one. I'd go will McCabe.

[Dagmeister]

I really worry that we haven't got one decent centre back.

Llera - 33, defensively all over the place

Taylor - 32, slow, Darren Purse mkII

Gardner - 32, crock

Beevers - gone backwards in his development

Reda - Scary seeing him at left-back, never mind centre back

Taylor and Gardner have proved last year that they can perform well at this level. Can see them becoming a solid unit. Bevers will learn and hopefully prosper playing alongside Taylor as Gardner it appears is 25 games a season at best probably. Mark is still only 22 I think and has the best years ahead of him. Personally I hope that someone else doesn't get the benefit of his peak years.