SWFC SUMMER 2022 TRANSFER RUMOUR MEGATHREAD - in memory of Gurujuan

[Rotherham Owl]

I dont see all this youth and resale value. The aim is to get out of League 1, once this is achieved not many will make the grade at Championship level. The ones that do we keep. The rest we release because so few clubs will buy a League 1 player no matter what his League 1 qualities, hence there is no resale value.

 

Better to get the players who can do a job for us this year on a 1-2 year contract, no more. The rest on loan.

[Teddy Nickelarse]

8 minutes ago, Rotherham Owl said:

I dont see all this youth and resale value. The aim is to get out of League 1, once this is achieved not many will make the grade at Championship level. The ones that do we keep. The rest we release because so few clubs will buy a League 1 player no matter what his League 1 qualities, hence there is no resale value.

 

Better to get the players who can do a job for us this year on a 1-2 year contract, no more. The rest on loan.

That strategy pretty much requires guaranteed promotion which if not achieved  will contribute to further retarding of the club IMO.

[flash]

Both local journo’s for Cardiff and Hull have said they’re not after Michael Smith from Rotherham. Warne has said he’s likely to go elsewhere - we could be in with a good chance. 
 

He would be an excellent piece of business on a free transfer. Not for only his goals but his work rate and how he brings others in to play. 

[fpowl]

57 minutes ago, Teddy Nickelarse said:

Respect your opinion and argument and although its not fully aligned with mine there are areas that we do agree on.

To clarify; as well as the development squad I want to see our recruitment rather more centred on younger players who it's felt can realistically challenge for first team spots in the short term with the potential to become valuable longer term assets. For example given a straight choice between Tucker and Dean; it's Tucker all day for me.What I don't want is a squad rammed with expensive 30+ year olds. 

I think that’s where the balance and judgment comes in isn’t I think we all know what dean can bring to the table it’s just where Is tuckers current ability at against deans as opposed to tuckers future ability against deans 

 

if our ambitions are to get automatic we simply have to get and play the best players we can in getting us out of the league and in my opinion is we can’t compromise 

 

Best example I think I can give Dele bashiru I think is a more than capable of playing league one football currently and his potential ability will see him championship level minimum if managed and developed right. He falls into what I think you would be looking at brining in. However for me he is still 5th choice behind luongo, Byres, bannan, Adrienne for me and I think we will bring in another player for CM too

 

i don’t think Dele is a bad player at this level but I don’t think he gets much game time in our promotion ambition team, cup games, cameos, bit of squad rotation that’s it. Personally I think his development would be best served out on loan otherwise he could stall on developing

 

and this is my point with example tucker and I’m not saying he is but I’d rather sign players who I think can play 40 games. Plus in an automatic promotion team

 

Dele might give us 40 odd games in a playoff campaign team

 

and this is where we have compromised we’re not a mid table team we are aiming for autos and unless these young players we want are ready for level we expect now I feel we are giving a first team shirt away

 

ppayers like shodipo, kamberi, sow, etc…..not up to the quality to deliver our ambitions these are so called back up players and maybe that costs Us having to rely or throw in players that just are not to the level yet 

 

 

[malek]

44 minutes ago, Rotherham Owl said:

I dont see all this youth and resale value. The aim is to get out of League 1, once this is achieved not many will make the grade at Championship level. The ones that do we keep. The rest we release because so few clubs will buy a League 1 player no matter what his League 1 qualities, hence there is no resale value.

 

Better to get the players who can do a job for us this year on a 1-2 year contract, no more. The rest on loan.

 

Pretty much strategy that we employed for more than last 20 years and that would have put out out of existence if it wasn't for Milan Mandarić. No successful team in England or anywhere else in the World works like this.

[Rotherham Owl]

27 minutes ago, Teddy Nickelarse said:

That strategy pretty much requires guaranteed promotion which if not achieved  will contribute to further retarding of the club IMO.

 

No it doesn't. If you have loan deals and players on 1-2 year contracts you cannot get stung with injuries, bad form or poor recruitment. Spending on youth and looking at players for future potential resale value is what will keep us in this division longer, allow us to get stung for those that fail to make the grade. Get players in to do a job and then get rid.

 

There are so few players that get sold out of League 1.

 

If you want a strategy that will give you a resale value then that is getting relegated out of the Championship. Rotherham haven't sold any one after their numerous promotions but do tend to sell when they get relegated.

[lukeyswfc]

It’s about having players ready to replace the experienced. Have we at any point ever had players ready to replace anyone since the 90s?

 

I’m all for a core of experienced players, but we just never seem to have anyone to step in ready. Stockdale is a good signing at this level. I hope we have a plan for after he goes… That’s our issue and has been since the 90s.

 

Its why we are now miles behind United. Even Barnsley have an incredible youth project, their issue is their ceiling is low without major investment so they can only ever hope to cash in. We could, in theory, keep those “up and coming” players as we progress upwards.

[Big Jack]

Signing young players who have proved they can compete at league one and championship level is ideal but its very competitive as these players are in demand.

That is why its important to develop our own and those kids with potential from clubs higher up the chain who get released.

Its a long term plan not a quick fire solution, meanwhile you have to make sure the first team is progressing. Its not an easy task.

[Bloxwich Owl]

Hull City have made a £3million bid for MK Dons starlet Scott Twine, reports John Percy.

Hull City are keen to lure the attacking midfielder to the MKM Stadium this summer in an ambitious move.

[malek]

4 minutes ago, Asio otus said:

Signing young players who have proved they can compete at league one and championship level is ideal but its very competitive as these players are in demand.

That is why its important to develop our own and those kids with potential from clubs higher up the chain who get released.

Its a long term plan not a quick fire solution, meanwhile you have to make sure the first team is progressing. Its not an easy task.

 

I don't think there are many clubs that can offer talented young players on the verge of first team squads better opportunity of first team football in combination with relatively high wages.

 

Just look how well teams like Oxford did signing this sort of players, but unlike us lacked financial clout to keep them for a longer haul or bring squad capable of promotion around them.

 

Some players they signed on cheap:

 

Josh Ruffels - free transfer

Joe Rothwell - free transfer

James Henry - free transfer

Cameron Brannaghan - 225k

John Lundstram - free transfer

Ryan Ledson - undisclosed

[WalthamOwl]

5 minutes ago, Bloxwich Owl said:

Hull City have made a £3million bid for MK Dons starlet Scott Twine, reports John Percy.

Hull City are keen to lure the attacking midfielder to the MKM Stadium this summer in an ambitious move.

3 million seems a bargain for him. Hope he doesn’t end up at Hull. He’s better than that. 

[Rotherham Owl]

10 minutes ago, malek said:

 

I don't think there are many clubs that can offer talented young players on the verge of first team squads better opportunity of first team football in combination with relatively high wages.

 

Just look how well teams like Oxford did signing this sort of players, but unlike us lacked financial clout to keep them for a longer haul or bring squad capable of promotion around them.

 

Some players they signed on cheap:

 

Josh Ruffels - free transfer

Joe Rothwell - free transfer

James Henry - free transfer

Cameron Brannaghan - 225k

John Lundstram - free transfer

Ryan Ledson - undisclosed

 

So you want to develop a team around some youths so that we can perhaps get promotion in the future? Some of those players signed for Oxford over 7 years ago and still went for free.

[Tony Pulis]

 

20 minutes ago, malek said:

 

I don't think there are many clubs that can offer talented young players on the verge of first team squads better opportunity of first team football in combination with relatively high wages.

 

Just look how well teams like Oxford did signing this sort of players, but unlike us lacked financial clout to keep them for a longer haul or bring squad capable of promotion around them.

 

Some players they signed on cheap:

 

Josh Ruffels - free transfer

Joe Rothwell - free transfer

James Henry - free transfer

Cameron Brannaghan - 225k

John Lundstram - free transfer

Ryan Ledson - undisclosed

I take your point but many of these may not even start for us now - and this strategy hasn't given Oxford any promotion.

[Steve Down South]

37 minutes ago, malek said:

 

Pretty much strategy that we employed for more than last 20 years and that would have put out out of existence if it wasn't for Milan Mandarić. No successful team in England or anywhere else in the World works like this.

Signing experienced players in the way we have done over recent years has got us nowhere and cost a fortune.  So many people talk about getting the age of the squad down and then have a good moan if we don’t sign an established name.  The club seem terrified by the prospect of having a plan and taking a few chances.  I don’t think we can continue with the approach of building an ageing team for short term success (by no means guaranteed) and then starting again the following season as players reach the end of contracts and loans go back to their clubs.  Even if this approach achieves promotion we’re unlikely to have a team ready for the Championship and will be back where we started in a season or two.

[19owl08]

Just watched Stockdales first interview and he’s asked if he knows anyone in the squad to which he replies… Dean, Bannan & Hunt. Either he doesn’t realise Dean isn’t our player & Hunt is out of contract or he may have let some news slip 

[Teddy Nickelarse]

47 minutes ago, Rotherham Owl said:

 

No it doesn't. If you have loan deals and players on 1-2 year contracts you cannot get stung with injuries, bad form or poor recruitment. Spending on youth and looking at players for future potential resale value is what will keep us in this division longer, allow us to get stung for those that fail to make the grade. Get players in to do a job and then get rid.

 

There are so few players that get sold out of League 1.

 

If you want a strategy that will give you a resale value then that is getting relegated out of the Championship. Rotherham haven't sold any one after their numerous promotions but do tend to sell when they get relegated.

 Loans can be very expensive unless taking punts on teenagers which would hardly be a surefire recipe for autos. One and two year contracts potentially shrinks the field too; e.g. I could imagine a player of Dean's vintage might well want a longer deal. The idea of a comprehensive rebuild every season is not a strategy that I favour so I guess we'll have to agree to differ.

[Ever the pessimist]

3 minutes ago, 19owl08 said:

Just watched Stockdales first interview and he’s asked if he knows anyone in the squad to which he replies… Dean, Bannan & Hunt. Either he doesn’t realise Dean isn’t our player & Hunt is out of contract or he may have let some news slip 

I suspect the former.

[malek]

10 minutes ago, Rotherham Owl said:

 

So you want to develop a team around some youths so that we can perhaps get promotion in the future? Some of those players signed for Oxford over 7 years ago and still went for free.

 

No I don't as I clearly stated before.

 

We need mix of both, experienced professionals and talented young players to develop playing alongside them. I'm not saying We should build our squad around 11 youths, or 5, or 3... But I'm saying that this aspect of team building that usually brings biggest profit to the club has been neglected for decades and it did cost us dearly. Oxford was used as an example of how mediocre League One club can bring in some really good talented players and develop them. Some of those went for free as they are not in our position and couldn't afford to keep them at the club and build successful squad around them.

 

Quote

Signing experienced players in the way we have done over recent years has got us nowhere and cost a fortune.  So many people talk about getting the age of the squad down and then have a good moan if we don’t sign an established name.  The club seem terrified by the prospect of having a plan and taking a few chances.  I don’t think we can continue with the approach of building an ageing team for short term success (by no means guaranteed) and then starting again the following season as players reach the end of contracts and loans go back to their clubs.  Even if this approach achieves promotion we’re unlikely to have a team ready for the Championship and will be back where we started in a season or two.

 

100% mate.

 

This is what We seem to be doing this Summer, what We have been doing for most of last 20 years and what got us in the poo where We are right now. Bloody lab rats would have figured it out by now and changed their approach.

[Teddy Nickelarse]

1 hour ago, fpowl said:

I think that’s where the balance and judgment comes in isn’t I think we all know what dean can bring to the table it’s just where Is tuckers current ability at against deans as opposed to tuckers future ability against deans 

 

if our ambitions are to get automatic we simply have to get and play the best players we can in getting us out of the league and in my opinion is we can’t compromise 

 

Best example I think I can give Dele bashiru I think is a more than capable of playing league one football currently and his potential ability will see him championship level minimum if managed and developed right. He falls into what I think you would be looking at brining in. However for me he is still 5th choice behind luongo, Byres, bannan, Adrienne for me and I think we will bring in another player for CM too

 

i don’t think Dele is a bad player at this level but I don’t think he gets much game time in our promotion ambition team, cup games, cameos, bit of squad rotation that’s it. Personally I think his development would be best served out on loan otherwise he could stall on developing

 

and this is my point with example tucker and I’m not saying he is but I’d rather sign players who I think can play 40 games. Plus in an automatic promotion team

 

Dele might give us 40 odd games in a playoff campaign team

 

and this is where we have compromised we’re not a mid table team we are aiming for autos and unless these young players we want are ready for level we expect now I feel we are giving a first team shirt away

 

ppayers like shodipo, kamberi, sow, etc…..not up to the quality to deliver our ambitions these are so called back up players and maybe that costs Us having to rely or throw in players that just are not to the level yet 

 

 

Yes totally see your point in your first paragraph. 

Regarding your second; obviously autos is the ambition but it cannot be guaranteed. This is just my opinion and I know it will be opposed by many but if the real risk of missing out meant we were back to square one with even less money and a paucity of playing and/or saleable assets then that leaves me cold. I get what your saying and totally respect your opinion, and certainly how you express it, but it's  fundamentally at odds with mine.

With regards to Dele, I thought that he showed real improvement last season and its quite feasible that he may make similar forward  strides next season. He offers something that no other player on the books mirrors. Adeniran is the nearest but without the power. Dele has played the vast majority of his games with us as a 19/20 year old. His performance against MKD was terrific and showed a window into what he might develop into. Next season as a 21/22 year old will be very interesting in terms of what he brings to the party. I wouldn't be loaning him out personalty. 

[Jack of Clubs]

Happy with the Stockdale deal. He’s played regularly throughout his career and his experience can only help what will be a new back line next season.