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Think it was Steve Bruce that said a rebuild needs 3 or 4 transfer windows to achieve what’s required.

In reality we haven’t had one normal transfer window due to being under successive embargoes.

Taking this into account its clear Moore has done pretty well with the hand he was dealt and should be given another season…2 more normal windows to finish reshaping the squad. And yes although we missed promotion I agree we should be happier about the state of the club than one year ago

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35 minutes ago, Tamworthowl said:

 

9 months later and we’ve finished 4th. To me, that’s overachieving. True, we messed up in the play-offs and we’ve conceded way too many late goals to lose points. But we’ve dealt with yet another massive injury list along the way. We’ve produced an entertaining style of play, plenty of goals, and a home record we’ve been dreaming of for years. 
 

 

I know we fell short this season (although we still finished ahead of my own expectations) but I'm seeing plenty of positives and some firm foundations being put in place. Yes, there have been shortcomings, but they are things that can be worked at and improved IMO. 

 

Like yourself I'm optimistic. More optimistic than I have been in for several seasons in fact. My biggest fear is that with the departure of some key players there will be another period of adjustment and bedding in of replacements. Many fans are expecting a flying start to next season, and I've already read multiple comments on Owlstalk suggesting that if we're not firmly in the top two after a couple of months then Moore should be dismissed. Personally speaking I think this sort of thinking is short term and counterproductive, and that he really needs the whole of next season to continue the rebuilding. Unfortunately, a lot of our fans are impatient and (IMO) have unrealistically high expectations, so I can see people quickly getting on the managers back yet again.

 

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3 minutes ago, Roy Of The Roasters said:

 

I know we fell short this season (although we still finished ahead of my own expectations) but I'm seeing plenty of positives and some firm foundations being put in place. Yes, there have been shortcomings, but they are things that can be worked at and improved IMO. 

 

Like yourself I'm optimistic. More optimistic than I have been in for several seasons in fact. My biggest fear is that with the departure of some key players there will be another period of adjustment and bedding in of replacements. Many fans are expecting a flying start to next season, and I've already read multiple comments on Owlstalk suggesting that if we're not firmly in the top two after a couple of months then Moore should be dismissed. Personally speaking I think this sort of thinking is short term and counterproductive, and that he really needs the whole of next season to continue the rebuilding. Unfortunately, a lot of our fans are impatient and (IMO) have unrealistically high expectations, so I can see people quickly getting on the managers back yet again.

 

I fully agree with your sentiments, however I think there’s a good chance we’ll start next season with 7/8 of the starters against Sunderland playing the first game.  Injuries permitting…

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41 minutes ago, Tamworthowl said:


Finishing 4th in Div 3 is an embarrassment to a club of our stature and aspirations, and it’s nothing to brag about, but based on where we were and our expectations 12 months ago, it is an over achievement. Unless, of course, you thought that Moore could build a top two finish from the dregs of last season's demoralised relegation squad amidst the chaos of a transfer embargo and recent non payment of salaries. Nah, we overachieved against any reasonable expectation this season.

We’re in league 1, the other teams aren’t very good. It’s quite easy to finish top 2, Rotherham did and we got more points than them last season in the championship. We brought in enough quality players for this level to achieve it.

 

A decent managers would have had us better organised at set plays, cut out so many late goals conceded, played players in the right positions, asked the players not to play out from the back so much when they can’t do it.. the net result would have been comfortably 5 points more for autos.

 

I always scratch my head when I hear some of our fans say they expected us to finish in the bottom half so they’re happy with how it went. It’s like they’ve not seen the teams in the bottom half, the players they have and the budgets they have.

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1 minute ago, Sham67 said:

I fully agree with your sentiments, however I think there’s a good chance we’ll start next season with 7/8 of the starters against Sunderland playing the first game.  Injuries permitting…

 

I think that's about right, but it depends which 7 - 8. Players of the calibre of Luongo, Dean, Storey, BPF will be big shoes to fill.

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29 minutes ago, Roy Of The Roasters said:

 

I think that's about right, but it depends which 7 - 8. Players of the calibre of Luongo, Dean, Storey, BPF will be big shoes to fill.

I’ll be shocked if one of those are not here.

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I think this season will be difficult to evaluate.

 

Nothing you've said about your fears for the club before the season are wrong. We did look completely f*cked for a period and I'll hold my hands up, I was one of those who wondered if we'd have a club at all, or at least a team capable of competing against relegation.

 

That said, I also think that view undersells what we did have. I think every single other manager in this division would take BPF, Iorfa, Dean, Bannan, Byers, Luongo, Windass and Gregory. We brought in loan signings who - at least in theory with the likes of Theo and Shodipo - looked to have the talent to compete at the top end of this league. We were able to bring players in on a free to bolster things mid-season like Berahino and NML who many others in this league might not have been able to attract or afford. 

 

The team had talent. Keeping some of the players we kept, attracting some of the signings we attracted, shouldn't have been possible for a League One team and might not be again for a second stint.

 

I firmly believe the team we finished the season with was good enough to go up, and should have gone up, and nobody will ever convince me that failing to do so is anything other than abject failure.

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Some perspective is sorely needed. The last two times we were in this league:

 

2003-4 - 16th

2004-5 - 5th - promoted through play-offs

 

2010-11 - 15th

2011-12 - 2nd - automatically promoted

 

This time:

2021-22 - 4th

Now that's a huge improvement in my book.

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1 hour ago, Blatter said:

Think it was Steve Bruce that said a rebuild needs 3 or 4 transfer windows to achieve what’s required.

In reality we haven’t had one normal transfer window due to being under successive embargoes.

Taking this into account its clear Moore has done pretty well with the hand he was dealt and should be given another season…2 more normal windows to finish reshaping the squad. And yes although we missed promotion I agree we should be happier about the state of the club than one year ago

I think the reality is this summer is the first summer for 4 or 5 seasons we have no excuses for not getting our business done early and players in for a full preseason. No embargos, no points deduction, no manager changes, no change of division.

 

The recruitment needs to be better, players we need to play the way we want to, focus of young and improving to go with the older heads of Bannan, Gregory, maybe Dean and Hutch.

 

I dont want the Chansiri approach of leaving everything to the last minute, sign players on transfer deadline day, who mainly get injured, are unfit or barely play. We don't need Premier league players or Championship players we need good league one players that can get us promoted from this league.

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3 minutes ago, room0035 said:

I think the reality is this summer is the first summer for 4 or 5 seasons we have no excuses for not getting our business done early and players in for a full preseason. No embargos, no points deduction, no manager changes, no change of division.

 

The recruitment needs to be better, players we need to play the way we want to, focus of young and improving to go with the older heads of Bannan, Gregory, maybe Dean and Hutch.

 

I dont want the Chansiri approach of leaving everything to the last minute, sign players on transfer deadline day, who mainly get injured, are unfit or barely play. We don't need Premier league players or Championship players we need good league one players that can get us promoted from this league.

 

I hope that's true - but I don't understand what's happening about Financial Fair Play.

Didn't we have a 25million loss? That must put us in a very tight position unless there's some kind of get out due to the Covid years.

Maybe someone on here can explain how it works.

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7 minutes ago, Pulcinella said:

Some perspective is sorely needed. The last two times we were in this league:

 

2003-4 - 16th

2004-5 - 5th - promoted through play-offs

 

2010-11 - 15th

2011-12 - 2nd - automatically promoted

 

This time:

2021-22 - 4th

Now that's a huge improvement in my book.

What happened in in 2004 and 2011 are completely irrelevant, and the squad we had this time around, along with the wages being paid are far and away better than the previous campaigns mentioned.

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2 minutes ago, Pulcinella said:

Some perspective is sorely needed. The last two times we were in this league:

 

2003-4 - 16th

2004-5 - 5th - promoted through play-offs

 

2010-11 - 15th

2011-12 - 2nd - automatically promoted

 

This time:

2021-22 - 4th

Now that's a huge improvement in my book.

But the previous two times we had chairman willing to make the changes needed to get promoted, I dont think we currently have that.

 

would DC have sacked Moore with 10 games to go to make sure we got in a manager to get us promoted. if come 20 games into next season will DC get rid and bring in another experience manager to get us up.

 

milan did with Megson and Dave Allen with Sturrock, I am not sure with DC he is more reactive than Proactive.

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2 minutes ago, Pulcinella said:

 

I hope that's true - but I don't understand what's happening about Financial Fair Play.

Didn't we have a 25million loss? That must put us in a very tight position unless there's some kind of get out due to the Covid years.

Maybe someone on here can explain how it works.

I thunk the rule for this league are different its not based on losses but % of turnover but someone will be able to give the exact details.

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2 hours ago, Tamworthowl said:


Finishing 4th in Div 3 is an embarrassment to a club of our stature and aspirations, and it’s nothing to brag about, but based on where we were and our expectations 12 months ago, it is an over achievement. Unless, of course, you thought that Moore could build a top two finish from the dregs of last season's demoralised relegation squad amidst the chaos of a transfer embargo and recent non payment of salaries. Nah, we overachieved against any reasonable expectation this season.

What stature is that?

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