Is Moore good enough to get us promoted?

[parajack]

I think the squad we had this Year was good enough to not draw 14 games so I don’t know

Edited May 11, 2022 by parajack

[parajack]

23 hours ago, royalowlisback said:

Does anything in his managerial track record suggest he is?

 

Does he inspire his players, can he adapt to changing situations in games, can he surprise and outwit his 'opposites' manager?

 

Can he get his players to rise to the big occasion, can he get his team to manage the game, see games out and do the 'ugly' things that are all part of the modern game?

 

Although our season ended last night, I think that insane spell of Johnson, Palmer and who ever else's name came out of the hat to play in the 3 at the back was what effectively killed our season, it was a WTF moment on a par with playing FF at Full-Back, but it went on for ages. I know we had injuries, every team does, you adapt, you play a different system, one that suits your players strengths - not shoehorn players stubbornly into alien positions because you don't have a Plan B, let alone a C,D.......

 

The loan signings we made, were on the whole absolute garbage, wingers signed when we don't play with wingers and unfit defenders. He was so obsessed with the system he wanted to play, so why sign them? We have been crying out for pace up front and an absolute Beast Mode Unit up front, we have nothing to change our focus of attack with, no out ball, no strength, no extra height in both defending and attacking set-pieces. Signing NML didn't help matters, he is just another winger, playing out of position, often at the expense of a more central attacker, running into Johnson's space and just confusing matters.

 

We can't defend balls into the box, we are hopeless against big Target Men and have been all season, yet it continues game after game. Here is how to beat SWFC - press our insane passing around at the back (that doesn't get us anywhere) , get somebody close to Barry Bannan, them lump it to the target man, if he doesn't score, don't worry, because you will score from the resulting set-piece - it really is that simple - if you can lob a a nice slice of ****-housery into the mix all the better....

 

I don't know what the answer is in terms of which manager could get us out of this division, but I'm not sure Darren Moore is it.

Great summary sadly many just can’t see it some would say including DM.  This post dedicated to Debra James brave beautifull woman facing her death with dignity and STILL thinking of others Airborne 

[parajack]

19 hours ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

^^^ This ^^^

 

10 games for me if he doesn’t have us 1 or 2 and playing well with a settled squad  than….,,…

[WUGGAMONKEY1]

I don’t believe he is good enough to get us up. This was our best shot in my opinion. It’s going to be much harder next season if we are without players like Luongo, Dean, Hutch, BPF, Hunt & Storey. 
 

His early season tinkering and failure to play a settled side really cost us. Tactically I don’t think he is good enough, the switch to 4 at the back in the 2nd half at Sunderland nearly cost us the entire tie, being an example. Sticking with Johnson at centre half v Oxford away (who got out jumped for one of their goals) when Storey was on the bench was baffling. Playing NML up front when he isn’t a striker. 
 

 

[Devonstrix]

I totally get it when people say our form since Christmas has been automatic promotion form. However, the big concern has remained our mediocre away form and I think this supports some concerns over his tactical acumen. 
 

We dropped 17 points in away games against Morecambe, Shrewsbury, Lincoln, Wimbledon, Cambridge, Gillingham and Cheltenham. Just taking 6 of those 17 points would have seen us promoted.
 

Failing to register an away win against any of the teams in that list is seriously concerning and MUST be a focus of a change in tactical approach next season if we are to challenge for automatic promotion. Is DM the man to do it? I would give him until the end of October. 

[Tommy Crawshaw]

5 minutes ago, Devonstrix said:

I totally get it when people say our form since Christmas has been automatic promotion form. However, the big concern has remained our mediocre away form and I think this supports some concerns over his tactical acumen. 
 

We dropped 17 points in away games against Morecambe, Shrewsbury, Lincoln, Wimbledon, Cambridge, Gillingham and Cheltenham. Just taking 6 of those 17 points would have seen us promoted.
 

Failing to register an away win against any of the teams in that list is seriously concerning and MUST be a focus of a change in tactical approach next season if we are to challenge for automatic promotion. Is DM the man to do it? I would give him until the end of October. 

 

I agree that for any chance of automatic promotion we would definitely need more wins away than we had this season.

 

Also it will be a tall order to match this season's home record again, so more away wins would be needed.

 

Wigan won 14 away, Rotherham 12 and MK 13, compared to our 8.

[Devonstrix]

10 minutes ago, Tommy Crawshaw said:

 

I agree that for any chance of automatic promotion we would definitely need more wins away than we had this season.

 

Also it will be a tall order to match this season's home record again, so more away wins would be needed.

 

Wigan won 14 away, Rotherham 12 and MK 13, compared to our 8.

We can’t afford another repeat of that poor away form for sure, because you’re probably right that we won’t be able to repeat our home form, which was obviously great. 
 

4 points out of a possible 21 against that list of teams in my post is absolutely abysmal and points to us being out thought and out fought against teams who, with all due respect, raise their game because of our 'status'. 

[WC1Owl]

44 minutes ago, Devonstrix said:

We can’t afford another repeat of that poor away form for sure, because you’re probably right that we won’t be able to repeat our home form, which was obviously great. 
 

4 points out of a possible 21 against that list of teams in my post is absolutely abysmal and points to us being out thought and out fought against teams who, with all due respect, raise their game because of our 'status'. 

 

I don't know how much of this is about the opposites raising their game, and how much is about us not being quite good enough to regularly beat a well-implemented low block? That's not a problem unique to us, tbf.

[A E Neuman NYowl]

I have my reservations about Moore, I think he is a bit naive in managerial terms.

However I think he should be given another go, he got us to the play offs and importantly the style and results improved as the season progressed.

[Guest OrlandoUnTrustful]

I think it’s fairly obvious that Moore isn’t good enough to get us promoted.

 

He had the best squad and biggest wage budget in the league. He isn’t cute enough tactically and failed to inspire any performances over the two biggest games of the season.

 

We don’t turn up away from hillsborough and regularly get bullied and out thought.

[Big Jack]

 Darren Moore is the man for the job and deserves immense credit for what he has 

achieved on and off the pitch.

I am staggered that some people who should know better cannot even acknowledge the progress we have made. Had to build a complete squad, bring the fans onside, cope with covid, injured players, keep the chairman on side, the list goes on.

Anyway fortunately they are in a minority and even DC must surely stick with him.

 Automatic promotion with DM next season.

 

[Big Jack]

14 minutes ago, OrlandoUnTrustful said:

I think it’s fairly obvious that Moore isn’t good enough to get us promoted.

 

He had the best squad and biggest wage budget in the league. He isn’t cute enough tactically and failed to inspire any performances over the two biggest games of the season.

 

We don’t turn up away from hillsborough and regularly get bullied and out thought.

No it is not obvious. We through some silly points away, but we got 85 points and one of the best home records in the EFL.

[bobness]

 

On 10/05/2022 at 05:17, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

Our form since the start of November suggests Moore's good enough to get us promoted, yes. Once he'd had a bit of time to work with the squad, get to know the players, and develop our style of play, we were one of the best sides in the division.

 

If we can avoid the injury issues which plagued our season, keep the core of the squad together and add a few key reinforcements, there's no reason to think we couldn't go one step better next year.

 

 

When we lost to Huddersfield in the playoffs I said Carlos ought to go. 

 

The arguments for Carlos staying were all stats related; more points than last season, higher position in the table, etc. The phrase on here was something like "year on year progression". 

 

But I was looking at the football on the pitch, and it just wasn't very good. Our position flattered us a bit (lucky results), and I genuinely didn't feel as much confidence as I did during Carlos' first year. 

 

At the time I couldn't really argue against the stats, because they showed Carlos was doing a good job. It's the same here. Lean on the stats and Moore is doing a superb job. But the football isn't very good, and I don't have confidence when the team steps onto the pitch. 

 

My only argument against sacking Moore is a fear of who Chansiri would replace him with. In an alternative reality I'd keep Moore, but change his job title, because I think he's done a good job bringing players in. 

[Guest OrlandoUnTrustful]

16 minutes ago, Asio otus said:

No it is not obvious. We through some silly points away, but we got 85 points and one of the best home records in the EFL.

And that got us where exactly?

 

The aim was promotion not failure. We bottled the two biggest games of the season.

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

8 minutes ago, bobness said:

 

 

When we lost to Huddersfield in the playoffs I said Carlos ought to go. 

 

The arguments for Carlos staying were all stats related; more points than last season, higher position in the table, etc. The phrase on here was something like "year on year progression". 

 

But I was looking at the football on the pitch, and it just wasn't very good. Our position flattered us a bit (lucky results), and I genuinely didn't feel as much confidence as I did during Carlos' first year. 

 

At the time I couldn't really argue against the stats, because they showed Carlos was doing a good job. It's the same here. Lean on the stats and Moore is doing a superb job. But the football isn't very good, and I don't have confidence when the team steps onto the pitch. 

 

My only argument against sacking Moore is a fear of who Chansiri would replace him with. In an alternative reality I'd keep Moore, but change his job title, because I think he's done a good job bringing players in. 

 

I just don't get the feeling that our position flattered us this season, though - if anything, we've been unlucky not to pick up more points than we have. Some terrible finishing, defensive brain-farts and refereeing abominations have cost us dear at times.

 

Have you honestly not felt confident watching us at Hillsborough since the close of the January window?

[Big Jack]

29 minutes ago, OrlandoUnTrustful said:

And that got us where exactly?

 

The aim was promotion not failure. We bottled the two biggest games of the season.

We all wanted promotion, but it was always going to be difficult, despite some on here banging on about tin pot clubs and this league it is easy etc. The play offs are a lottery.

Fortunately most of us can see the progress the club is making, definitely automatics next season under DM. The circle of just sacking managers does not work.

Upwards and onwards with DM.

 

 

Edited May 11, 2022 by Big Jack

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

I just don't get the feeling that our position flattered us this season, though - if anything, we've been unlucky not to pick up more points than we have. Some terrible finishing, defensive brain-farts and refereeing abominations have cost us dear at times.

 

Have you honestly not felt confident watching us at Hillsborough since the close of the January window?

A lot of that is Moore’s fault though. Playing people who aren’t really strikers up front like NML or Paterson inevitably means they miss chances a natural striker would score. Playing people out of position at centre half means they don’t get themselves set right, can’t defend set pieces well and inevitably soft goals get conceded. Asking the keepers and defenders to play out from the back when they aren’t really good enough to do it inevitably leads to brain farts because they’re too slow to anticipate and don’t have the ball control or accuracy of passing to execute it. 

[royalowlisback]

13 minutes ago, Kevin Pressmans Pen said:

A lot of that is Moore’s fault though. Playing people who aren’t really strikers up front like NML or Paterson inevitably means they miss chances a natural striker would score. Playing people out of position at centre half means they don’t get themselves set right, can’t defend set pieces well and inevitably soft goals get conceded. Asking the keepers and defenders to play out from the back when they aren’t really good enough to do it inevitably leads to brain farts because they’re too slow to anticipate and don’t have the ball control or accuracy of passing to execute it. 

This 100% ^^^^

 

Don't do the above 3 things, we would probably have finished in the top 2, it was all WTF, again and again.

[bobness]

9 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

I just don't get the feeling that our position flattered us this season, though - if anything, we've been unlucky not to pick up more points than we have. Some terrible finishing, defensive brain-farts and refereeing abominations have cost us dear at times.

 

Have you honestly not felt confident watching us at Hillsborough since the close of the January window?

 

I'll give you that this season we often battered teams on the pitch but simply didn't manage to convert those performances into wins (due to no fault of Moore's). I'm also not sure I can make a solid argument beyond how I feel. But I felt the same way with Carlos. 

 

Regarding having confidence. After a string of good results I felt confident we would squeeze out the next, but once that string had broken confidence didn't carry over into the next match. While losses are normal for even the best teams, ours didn't feel like a "blip", they felt like the result of poor game management that wasn't foreign to us.

 

One thing that did my head in was the faffing about at the back, I couldn't understand why we kept doing it (including during the playoffs), despite it inviting pressure and often resulting with us losing possession in our own half. It's almost like Moore decided on it early on and couldn't change it. 

 

I bloody well hope I'm wrong about Moore, and we may as well support him going into the next season, as DC will probably hold onto him. But if it was up to me, I'd be looking for someone else.

[Mighty Quinn]

3 hours ago, Tommy Crawshaw said:

 

I agree that for any chance of automatic promotion we would definitely need more wins away than we had this season.

 

Also it will be a tall order to match this season's home record again, so more away wins would be needed.

 

Wigan won 14 away, Rotherham 12 and MK 13, compared to our 8.

And Rotherham only let 11 goals in, in 23 away games ffs