SWFC boss Darren Moore

[Tewkesbury]

26 minutes ago, duncanidaho said:

i'm sorry, but utter tosh. 

Of course players say things like 'we are aiming to win the league' and 'we think we are the best in the division', or 'we are only focused on the next game'.   we know it's mostly bollux what players say as they are scared to say anything outlandish or even be honest or everyone gets on their backs. 

did the club put out a statement saying the expectation had changed?  or the the manager?

 

pre match interviews are mostly pointless and post match are rarely better, and as for press conferences, you rarely get anything original.

 

 

We're going to win the league usually comes under stuff they don't say.

 

Hence DM bigging up the opposition every game and the game at a time comments. You can downplay, give it the 'we have a good bunch of lads' or 'we'll do our best', but saying you're going win is generally out.

 

It's all about managing expectations.

[109Waddle]

21 hours ago, JemmoJemoJemmo said:

I wonder if any Sheffield Wednesday manager in our history has ever had the biggest budget in the division?

Yet couldn’t spend any of that enormous budget on transfer fees

[Guest]

3 hours ago, duncanidaho said:

Wigan only became a league club in 1979 and have spent more time out of the top two divisions than in them.  If it wasn't for Dave Whelan we wouldn't even be talking about them.

Rotherham have spent more time in the third tier than anywhere else so are they overachieving?

Barnsley and Hull have bounced between tier 2 and 3 with a few minor excursions in 1 and 4, so may just fit your criteria.

 

 

Wasn't talking about long run history, just short run. All of the other sides spend a fair amount of time in the second tier so its fair to assume they will again at some point. Burton Albion might not, they don't have the resources to consistently go for promotion in league 1 - thats why I excluded them.

 

The original post was saying about a third bounce straight back - I just pointed out its half or slightly better when you knock out the outliers. Unless you want to also include Bolton and Wigan who were in a mess when they came down.

 

People want to say we were in a mess but we actually weren't. Last season we had cashflow issues but thats not been the case this season at all. No missed wages, no players sold, players given new contracts who you'd want to sign up, plenty of fresh signings. Chairman has done his job, managers job is promotion now. Lets hope he manages it.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, HootHoot said:

"Their place is lower down the pyramid"

 

Can you at least try and come across as less entitled? Being a big club and your place in the pyramid has no actual bearing on what happens on the football pitch. 

 

Sunderland, Ipswich, Bolton, Portsmouth. All clubs accustomed to the upper echelons of English football, all struggling to get out of little League One. 

 

Promotion isn't as easy as you make it out to be. Just ask those fans. We've amassed 85 points, however you try and spin it, that's an achievement in itself. 

Ipswich and Sunderland maybe, Bolton have just come up from League 2 after their financial problems and had a decent season in that context. They will be better next year. Portsmouth are no Sheffield Wednesday.

 

Of course Burton's place is lower down the pyramid, thats not an entitled thing to say its a statement of fact. When we were playing premier league football last, they were playing in the Southern League Premier Division, the 7th tier of the pyramid. They didn't become a league club until 2009. They've done well to get to the championship even for a couple of seasons. It would be silly to compare them in League 1 to Sheffield Wednesday in League 1. 

[morganowl]

10 hours ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

Those two performances and results looked very much the product of having covid in the camp and having to close the training ground for a couple of weeks at a vital stage of the season.

 

I was amazed by how many of our fans seemed willing to overlook those factors at that stage, and calling for him to be sacked because of those games seemed very harsh.

i agree but didnt at the time . driving all that way though horrendous traffic and seeing us get proper stuffed didnt make for a happy mind that day , but previous to that  d moore was getting a lot of stick i remember cheltenham away and quite a few in the crowd that day got quite upset and abusive .  i think d moore from me gets 7/10 for the season if we get to wembley 8/10 if we get promotion 10/10 i agree whatever happens he should start next season as manager , he has made mistakes and he will be the 1st to admit that . but 85 points is a decent return . 

[Guest]

7 hours ago, StudentOwl said:

Also takes great pains to point out when clubs with financial issues and points deductions were unlikely to bounce straight back.

 

Didn't we get a points deduction last season for financial issues?

Thats not this season?

[HootHoot]

20 minutes ago, Kevin Pressmans Pen said:

Ipswich and Sunderland maybe, Bolton have just come up from League 2 after their financial problems and had a decent season in that context. They will be better next year. Portsmouth are no Sheffield Wednesday.

 

Of course Burton's place is lower down the pyramid, thats not an entitled thing to say its a statement of fact. When we were playing premier league football last, they were playing in the Southern League Premier Division, the 7th tier of the pyramid. They didn't become a league club until 2009. They've done well to get to the championship even for a couple of seasons. It would be silly to compare them in League 1 to Sheffield Wednesday in League 1. 

"Portsmouth are no Sheffield Wednesday"  

 

Now I know you're talking tosh. Been in the prem more recently than us and won a trophy whilst we've been cementing ourselves as a championship/L1 club. 

 

Take the specs off and realise that a lot has change since we've done anything of merit lad. 

 

And as I said, doesn't matter about your history but both clubs are in the same league. That's all that matters. I'm sure the same was said about Bournemouth and look at how they turned out. 

[Jim]

A lot of Moore’s critics will point out the level we are currently at. Fair enough but as I pointed out in an earlier post, you can only work and try to improve at the level you are currently at in the football pyramid.

 

We’ve scored 78 goals this season. I didn’t see that coming. I said at the beginning of the season that if we were to challenge at the top end of the table we needed a good defensive campaign conceding 45 goals or less as I didn’t see us scoring more than 60-65 goals.

 

At the halfway point we had scored 30 and conceded 26. We were on course for a good defensive record at this stage but we conceded 5 at our upcoming play-off opponents and this skewed things.

 

What none of us saw coming I’m sure was the 48 goals we scored in the second half of the season. This allowed us a little leeway defensively but we still went on to concede less in this period of the season with 24.

 

What brought about the change? I think the players finally got to grips with the playing style that Moore was working towards. A lot was made of Chris Wilder’s overlapping centre-back system at the Laneabau. I think this style is slightly different as the back 5 and midfield 3 can pop up anywhere on the pitch at anytime therefore making it difficult for the opposition to pick up runners and a big reason so many of the squad has found themselves on the scoresheet.

 

Liam Palmer in particular excels going forward in this system and for me has become a much better all round player in 12 months under Moore’s tutelage than he arguably was in the previous 10 years or so working under other managers at this club.

 

I was laughed at by the experts on here when I pointed out that Moore has players playing out of position in order to help improve their all round game and as a result make the playing style/system work but Palmer is a good example of this and I would hazard a guess the likes of Hunt and Johnson are playing the best football of their careers and the 3 players I’ve mentioned are all in their 30’s. If Moore can improve seasoned professionals, what could he do with younger players starting their career.

 

But you can’t be forward thinking here. You need to have round pegs in round holes, play your strongest eleven every week and play an old fashioned target man up top.

 

The games changed. It’s a squad game. It’s a technical game. This is modern football. We have a modern football manager. We’re making progress. We’re moving forward. The future’s bright while ever we stick with Darren Moore. He’s a massive managerial talent and we

are very lucky to have him.

[runningaround]

On 02/05/2022 at 22:28, Tewkesbury said:

He could have promoted from the u23, signed some of the young triallists we had instead of over 30s.

 

He's had plenty of opportunity to give youth a chance, yes, we'd be mid table, but when it's all over, there's no difference between losing playoff finalist and 20th.

yet we are 4th and live until the playoffs sorted its all hypothetical ask Fulham who face same if we do go up

[Tewkesbury]

19 minutes ago, runningaround said:

yet we are 4th and live until the playoffs sorted its all hypothetical ask Fulham who face same if we do go up

It is indeed hypothetical.

 

As I said, if we go up, he'll become a legend.

 

But this team is very much a one year wonder. If we don't go up, we'll lose most of them and be in a worse position next year.

[@owlstalk]

 

Have never known a season where our fans have talked our own team and manager down like this before

Its crackers 

[Guest DoesJackHunt]

[runningaround]

48 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

Have never known a season where our fans have talked our own team and manager down like this before

Its crackers 

his hands tied i agree

[NorthernOwl]

On 02/05/2022 at 19:24, Jim said:

 

But you can’t be forward thinking here. You need to have round pegs in round holes, play your strongest eleven every week and play an old fashioned target man up top.

 

The games changed. It’s a squad game. It’s a technical game. This is modern football. We have a modern football manager. We’re making progress. We’re moving forward. The future’s bright while ever we stick with Darren Moore. He’s a massive managerial talent and we

are very lucky to have him.

 

Excellent post. Its great to have a manager who understands the modern game.

 

Many of our fans are stuck in the past thinking that the way to be successful in the 90s still applies now.

 

Things have moved on and we have a manager that understands that. Yes he will get criticism from fans still obsessed with 4-4-2 and football being a 'simple game.' But that's not the reality of how it is anymore. 

[NorthernOwl]

1 hour ago, Tewkesbury said:

It is indeed hypothetical.

 

As I said, if we go up, he'll become a legend.

 

But this team is very much a one year wonder. If we don't go up, we'll lose most of them and be in a worse position next year.

 

Not necessarily. Moore now has an established formation and way of playing and will know exactly what is needed in terms of replacements/ additions. That continuity will mean existing players will know exactly what is expected of them.

 

We will lose a few players sure, but the turnover will be less than last season. And I have confidence in Moores ability to attract decent players as he has already demonstrated. 

[BridportOwl]

I agree @NorthernOwl,  even if we don't go up this time we are a lot more attractive club for a lot of players. We are playing well, getting good gates, paying players and have a feelgood factor around us. None of that was true last summer.  The club is getting positive press for the first time in a long time, it might take a season longer than we all wanted, but I firmly believe we are starting to rebuild and are heading in the right direction.

[Tewkesbury]

I agree with the feelgood, but I can see League One being a lot more competitive next year.

 

This league is very physical, we have an older contracted side,which will be a year older, so if we lose Luongo, Windass, etc, and with the loans, we'll have to have a great window ro compete. Younger players will be at a premium as the Champ and EPL should start bulking out squads again now the revenue is back. 

Our advantage in wages will be lower next season.

 

Due to COVID, many smaller teams had cash issues and teams all through the league were trimming all of the fat they could, the threat of the return of COVID has stifled investment as everyone was trying to save money.

This led to a two-tier league with a massive gulf between the top few haves and the lower half have nots.

It also meant that Championship teams were happy to offload any player not in the first 11 to clear the wages, which we took advantage of. If you were going to have an embargo, there was no better time to have it than last year.

 

After a year of gates, and COVID being over as far as football is concerned, the investment will return and smaller teams will be a lot more competitive, plus, we will have Derby with a new owner, as well as Barnsley and Peterborough who will be competitive, on top of whoever else doesn't go up and the likes of Ipswich, Plymouth and Oxford who should do better next year.