SWFC boss Darren Moore

[BridportOwl]

Just now, Tewkesbury said:

Loanees, pretty much by definition.

 

You could say those who were on single year contracts too.

 

When we send out players on loan, do you then consider them mercenaries?

 

You could say those on a single year contract, but I would say you are wrong.

[victorturner]

17 hours ago, JemmoJemoJemmo said:

I wonder if any Sheffield Wednesday manager in our history has ever had the biggest budget in the division?

He could raise his win per game even higher if we continue to play a mixed bag of ailing giants and  minnows in this division.

He has done well of course he has, very well, as have certain key players who have propelled us upwards, for which we are all grateful, but the real challenges will be in the next couple of years if we get promoted.

[duncanidaho]

32 minutes ago, Tewkesbury said:

The squad is the issue. It's a squad built to go up now, not next season.

 

If we were playing youth, getting our next generation up to speed, building for the future, I'd be happy with mid table this season.

But at every turn, he's gone for the old over young, experience over youth. The young get dropped after a mistake, the older ones get chance after chance.

 

But we've built a squad of old mercenaries who'll mostly be gone at the end of the season, with the aim of winning now.

 

Come season end, the loans will be gone, the permanent players who played this season will nearly all be hitting 30 or older.

 

If we're accepting less than promotion, the season could have been used to consolidate and build for the future, but it wasn't, so not going up will be a wasted season.

I'm not sure what argument you are trying to make?

We were relegated with no money for transfers, players ready to walk after pay issues, low morale.  DM had to get loanees and freebies in as that is all we could get.  Of course he built a team for this season, because that was the only option he had

[Mister Soul]

30 minutes ago, Tewkesbury said:

The squad is the issue. It's a squad built to go up now, not next season.

 

If we were playing youth, getting our next generation up to speed, building for the future, I'd be happy with mid table this season.

But at every turn, he's gone for the old over young, experience over youth. The young get dropped after a mistake, the older ones get chance after chance.

 

But we've built a squad of old mercenaries who'll mostly be gone at the end of the season, with the aim of winning now.

 

Come season end, the loans will be gone, the permanent players who played this season will nearly all be hitting 30 or older.

 

If we're accepting less than promotion, the season could have been used to consolidate and build for the future, but it wasn't, so not going up will be a wasted season.

Maybe , given our circumstances last summer, DM thought it’s gonna take some old mercenaries to get us out of this league at the first attempt? 
I dunno but I do know that today, right now, these old mercenaries have got us within a whisper of promotion. I’m not sure a more youthful squad would have had the experience to do that in the first season together.

[Tewkesbury]

2 minutes ago, BridportOwl said:

 

When we send out players on loan, do you then consider them mercenaries?

 

You could say those on a single year contract, but I would say you are wrong.

Technically, in military terms they would be.

A military mercenary is someone who fights in someone else's war for pay.

[Tewkesbury]

Just now, Mister Soul said:

Maybe , given our circumstances last summer, DM thought it’s gonna take some old mercenaries to get us out of this league at the first attempt? 
I dunno but I do know that today, right now, these old mercenaries have got us within a whisper of promotion. I’m not sure a more youthful squad would have had the experience to do that in the first season together.

That's the point, it's a squad built for now, not the future.

[@owlstalk]

1 minute ago, Tewkesbury said:

That's the point, it's a squad built for now, not the future.

I'm totally fine with that

 

 

[@owlstalk]

3 minutes ago, Tewkesbury said:

Technically, in military terms they would be.

A military mercenary is someone who fights in someone else's war for pay.

 

Mate - you're talking about LOAN PLAYERS in football

 

 

[Tewkesbury]

3 minutes ago, duncanidaho said:

I'm not sure what argument you are trying to make?

We were relegated with no money for transfers, players ready to walk after pay issues, low morale.  DM had to get loanees and freebies in as that is all we could get.  Of course he built a team for this season, because that was the only option he had

He could have promoted from the u23, signed some of the young triallists we had instead of over 30s.

 

He's had plenty of opportunity to give youth a chance, yes, we'd be mid table, but when it's all over, there's no difference between losing playoff finalist and 20th.

[@owlstalk]

1 minute ago, Tewkesbury said:

He could have promoted from the u23, signed some of the young triallists we had instead of over 30s.

 

He's had plenty of opportunity to give youth a chance, yes, we'd be mid table 

 

 

I think your argument is bizarre when we're in the playoff semi finals

 

 

Given the choice of the current squad, current performances, current league placement, and the current situation VS your plan of finishing mid-table playing U23 players I think I'll side with Darren Moore here.

 

 

[Tewkesbury]

4 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

Mate - you're talking about LOAN PLAYERS in football

 

 

You know that you can use words for more than one thing, right?

 

They're playing for a team other than their own for personal gain.

 

As for the contracted ones, it's the ones who are primarily here for the money.

 

 

[BridportOwl]

Just now, Tewkesbury said:

You know that you can use words for more than one thing, right?

 

They're playing for a team other than their own for personal gain.

 

As for the contracted ones, it's the ones who are primarily here for the money.

 

 

 

I am not being funny, but you are making yourself look silly now. 

 

[Tewkesbury]

2 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

 

I think your argument is bizarre when we're in the playoff semi finals

 

 

Given the choice of the current squad, current performances, current league placement, and the current situation VS your plan of finishing mid-table playing U23 players I think I'll side with Darren Moore here.

 

 

That's the whole point though.

 

Go up, he's done it.

Don't and we may as well have built a side for next season and finished 20th.

 

Lose the playoffs or finish 20th, we still start from the same place next year.

[@owlstalk]

1 minute ago, Tewkesbury said:

That's the whole point though.

 

Go up, he's done it.

Don't and we may as well have built a side for next season and finished 20th. 

So to summarise you would prefer to build a side of U23's ready to rely on next season to compete for promotion?

And do you think that we would get promoted next season with U23 players given the League One that we've seen this season as an idea of how easy/tough it would be?

[duncanidaho]

8 minutes ago, Tewkesbury said:

He could have promoted from the u23, signed some of the young triallists we had instead of over 30s.

 

He's had plenty of opportunity to give youth a chance, yes, we'd be mid table, but when it's all over, there's no difference between losing playoff finalist and 20th.

Absolutely, mid table (or maybe worse) is preferable to 4th, the play-offs and a possible promotion.  

Also, if we are lucky enough to go up, don't you think the extra revenue and kudos of being a championship club could put us in a better position to attract/keep players?

 

i do understand the point you are trying to make, but to be fair to DM (which is hard for some people) do you not think he looked at U23/youth/tea ladies first and then decided on what he thought the club needed?

 

And even if we don't go up or even get to the final, reaching the playoffs is more attractive to future signings than joining a mid table efl league 1 side.    

[Tewkesbury]

1 minute ago, @owlstalk said:

So to summarise you would prefer to build a side of U23's ready to rely on next season to compete for promotion?

And do you think that we would get promoted next season with U23 players given the League One that we've seen this season as an idea of how easy/tough it would be?

No, build a core of players to build on next season and for the future. As it stands, none of our younger players have gained any meaningful experience this season.

 

Personally, I think he was right to build for this year, but anything less than promotion with the side we have is failure.

[sethman75]

Good on him for turning it around, it looked horrible only 4 months ago

[@owlstalk]

2 minutes ago, Tewkesbury said:

No, build a core of players to build on next season and for the future.  

But then how long will it be before we get promoted?

 

And not getting promoted will be hurting the chairman's finances every year we don't achieve it

Not sure we have the time, money nor inclination to sit mid table in League One nurturing U23 players

[Tewkesbury]

Just now, @owlstalk said:

But then how long will it be before we get promoted?

 

And not getting promoted will be hurting the chairman's finances every year we don't achieve it

Not sure we have the time, money nor inclination to sit mid table in League One nurturing U23 players

But if we do it this way and don't get promoted, where will we be?

 

Still in league one.

 

Chansiri didn't pay all of these players to stay in league one.

 

At the end of the day, it's a gamble. Pull it off, you're a hero, don't and you're a failure.

[Big Jack]

43 minutes ago, Mister Soul said:

Maybe , given our circumstances last summer, DM thought it’s gonna take some old mercenaries to get us out of this league at the first attempt? 
I dunno but I do know that today, right now, these old mercenaries have got us within a whisper of promotion. I’m not sure a more youthful squad would have had the experience to do that in the first season together.

I think you will find Darren Moore made that decision. As much as he is an advocate of young players coming through (which he is developing in tandem) , with high turnover of staff, experience being essential if you want to progress quickly.